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The Real Outcomes of BLM

Dawgfather

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Here's an even bigger, and more fun one. The fun of teaching physics. You need to teach relativity but teachers won't mention that relativity is wrong. It's just the best explanation we have for the way physics happens in the macroverse. But I'm about facts so I would teach relativity for a year then mention, "BTW, everything I taught you is inaccurate. But it's the best we have"
I'm less concerned (to an extent) about the nuance between teaching the best available information versus complete and utter accuracy (even though I know this has a level of importance).

I'm more concerned about whether teachers are teaching kids to think for themselves and to learn to think critically.

I think the biggest disservice we do to kids is to indoctrinate them to a political ideology or to turn them into activists (on either side of politics).
 

Hacky McAxe

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I'm less concerned (to an extent) about the nuance between teaching the best available information versus complete and utter accuracy (even though I know this has a level of importance).

I'm more concerned about whether teachers are teaching kids to think for themselves and to learn to think critically.

I think the biggest disservice we do to kids is to indoctrinate them to a political ideology or to turn them into activists (on either side of politics).
I agree. By standard, political ideologies are not meant to be taught at all and they are deliberately kept out of the curriculum, but teachers will always influence their political ideologies on children.

That aside, there is a complete lack of critical thinking taught at school. They do it in an attempt to avoid chaos, so it makes sense. But it also causes so many problems. To quote Carl Sagan:

"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them"

There's so much promise in the world that is hindered by our inability to teach children to think for themselves.
 

Mr 95%

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That probably leads into the bigger discussion of how easy it is to become a teacher (going back in history it was the job you did if you received a really 5hit HSC mark).
Gee you generalise.. lol.. And @Lov_Dog I am disappointed you agreed..
 

Dawgfather

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Gee you generalise.. lol.. And @Lov_Dog I am disappointed you agreed..
Yes I was generalising, but if you raise my point with most people, they won't be surprised and will nod in agreement.

At the end of the day, you don't need to be particularly gifted or special to end up as a teacher. You simply need to do your time at uni and out you come.

My point is that we should be making it far tougher to become a teacher and making it a sought after job rather than just something you do when you can't do anything else.
 

Mr 95%

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Yes I was generalising, but if you raise my point with most people, they won't be surprised and will nod in agreement.

At the end of the day, you don't need to be particularly gifted or special to end up as a teacher. You simply need to do your time at uni and out you come.

My point is that we should be making it far tougher to become a teacher and making it a sought after job rather than just something you do when you can't do anything else.
Pfft..more generalising lol..You do realise you get found out if you don’t know what you are doing when you are at Uni? People change too, they maybe shit at school, but succeed at Uni, some the opposite..people evolve. Sheesh there is a lot more to teaching than facts and figures..or grammar..Development of the child, giving them a sense of worth..is in some situations a hellava lot more important to whether or not they can add 2 + 2..

The HSC result should not be a stamp on someone’s head as a guide to success or future success.. SMH..
 

Dawgfather

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Pfft..more generalising lol..You do realise you get found out if you don’t know what you are doing when you are at Uni? People change too, they maybe shit at school, but succeed at Uni, some the opposite..people evolve. Sheesh there is a lot more to teaching than facts and figures..or grammar..Development of the child, giving them a sense of worth..is in some situations a hellava lot more important if they can add 2 + 2..

The HSC result should not be a stamp on someone’s head as a guide to success or future success.. SMH..
I agree you don't have to be an academic whiz to be a great teacher, but overall Australia would be better if we improved the minimum standards of our teachers in terms of academic performance.
 

Mr 95%

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I agree you don't have to be an academic whiz to be a great teacher, but overall Australia would be better if we improved the minimum standards of our teachers in terms of academic performance.
I got no problem with improving skills, whether they be practical or developmental orientated, which indeed at the moment there are pathways to do so.
 

utility half

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That probably leads into the bigger discussion of how easy it is to become a teacher (going back in history it was the job you did if you received a really 5hit HSC mark).
I thought that was policing....oh no, that's the job for HSC duds with a predisposition for pushing people around. I too can play the generalisation game.
 

Nano

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Pfft..more generalising lol..You do realise you get found out if you don’t know what you are doing when you are at Uni? People change too, they maybe shit at school, but succeed at Uni, some the opposite..people evolve. Sheesh there is a lot more to teaching than facts and figures..or grammar..Development of the child, giving them a sense of worth..is in some situations a hellava lot more important to whether or not they can add 2 + 2..

The HSC result should not be a stamp on someone’s head as a guide to success or future success.. SMH..
If you can’t do simple maths or sciences at a young age, then what hope do you have at a uni level that’s only going to get harder for said subjects?

The HSC is a good gauge at seeing what a student is possible of achieving or could achieve when more mature for these types of stem based industries. Also the HSC lets unis see what subjects students have picked, the types of careers they wana try branch into and see if they have already achieved on the fundamentals.

Do you think students who have studied all these drama, languages and arts based subjects at a HSC level are suddenly going to pick up engineering or Computer science so easily? Or you even get students who don’t even pick stem based subjects like basic 2u maths which teaches the fundamentals of algebra, trigonometry and calculus suddenly thinking they can do it and keep up at 3-4 subjects a semester with no prior background?

You need to tell kids the reality is that the HSC is first step towards your future if you wana Start young for certain industries and to get in ahead rather than taking a long time to find yourself and all this other crap, put in the hard work when young so you graduate at 23-24 years old with an education and be ready to do the needed for work after.

It’s abit harsh but the real world is far more harsher, an education at least opens doors for you and you might aswell take all the given opportunities you get given in this country from an young age. Why waste time...
 

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yep and i'd agree with you on that point as well.
At least we can agree that a higher standard of policing and a thorough review of overarching structures and mates covering for mates culture would result in better outcomes across the board.
 

Mr 95%

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If you can’t do simple maths or sciences at a young age, then what hope do you have at a uni level that’s only going to get harder for said subjects?

The HSC is a good gauge at seeing what a student is possible of achieving or could achieve when more mature for these types of stem based industries. Also the HSC lets unis see what subjects students have picked, the types of careers they wana try branch into and see if they have already achieved on the fundamentals.

Do you think students who have studied all these drama, languages and arts based subjects at a HSC level are suddenly going to pick up engineering or Computer science so easily? Or you even get students who don’t even pick stem based subjects like basic 2u maths which teaches the fundamentals of algebra, trigonometry and calculus suddenly thinking they can do it and keep up at 3-4 subjects a semester with no prior background?

You need to tell kids the reality is that the HSC is first step towards your future if you wana Start young for certain industries and to get in ahead rather than taking a long time to find yourself and all this other crap, put in the hard work when young so you graduate at 23-24 years old with an education and be ready to do the needed for work after.

It’s abit harsh but the real world is far more harsher, an education at least opens doors for you and you might aswell take all the given opportunities you get given in this country from an young age. Why waste time...
Gee way to limit someone. You would be surprised what people learn as they get older. It is a complete myth that the HSC is the first step, or the last the step, or whatever step you want to call it. If a person is willing to learn they can. Heck they can do bridging courses to gain such basics. People’s brain mature at different rates, grasping educational concepts, regardless of any age, should not be limited to 5-18. I am an eternal optimist, I certainly won’t limit myself to just ‘learning’ to this period, nor would I expect someone else too. However, you can place restraints on people, and yourself, I certainly will not.
 

Nano

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Gee way to limit someone. You would be surprised what people learn as they get older. It is a complete myth that the HSC is the first step, or the last the step, or whatever step you want to call it. If a person is willing to learn they can. Heck they can do bridging courses to gain such basics. People’s brain mature at different rates, grasping educational concepts, regardless of any age, should not be limited to 5-18. I am an eternal optimist, I certainly won’t limit myself to just ‘learning’ to this period, nor would I expect someone else too. However, you can place restraints on people, and yourself, I certainly will not.
I don't think it's restriction its more so filtering out, I know people learn more as they get older but you can either have a 23-24 year old young adult who has just finished and has showed they have the ability/drive to learn hard things and opush themselves or a 35-40 year old still trying to figure out things?
 

Lov_Dog

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Gee you generalise.. lol.. And @Lov_Dog I am disappointed you agreed..
@Mr 95% I, too, feel dirty agreeing with anything he posts also, since our political views are diametrically opposed.
However, the fundamental and underlying point focusses on education. Substandard teachers --> substandard students.

I agree with the sentiment @Dawgfather raises regarding historical HSC / UAT scores being so low for entry into teaching degrees; during university course selection in grade 12, career counsellors instructed students to put a teaching degree in the last selection "in case" something goes wrong with ones grades. These were the very teachers/advisors remarks. Unfortunately, educational vocation seemed few and far between during my secondary studies.

Final remark - excellent educators develop open-minded, worldly, engaged, well-adjusted and socially minded pupils who's bullshit detector will be finely tuned when they are the next generation of policy makers instituting renewable energy guidelines, drafting the Constitutional Recognition of Indigenous Australians, and rescinding the tax-free status of religious bodies ... I am all for improvements in education. But a smart electorate could be construed as too dangerous for many governments.
 

Mr 95%

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I don't think it's restriction its more so filtering out, I know people learn more as they get older but you can either have a 23-24 year old young adult who has just finished and has showed they have the ability/drive to learn hard things and opush themselves or a 35-40 year old still trying to figure out things?
I see what your saying..but the HSC mark doesn’t necessarily define your knowledge or ability, that is my point. You can do bridging courses as I said, you are not all washed up.
 

Mr 95%

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@Mr 95% I, too, feel dirty agreeing with anything he posts also, since our political views are diametrically opposed.
However, the fundamental and underlying point focusses on education. Substandard teachers --> substandard students.

I agree with the sentiment @Dawgfather raises regarding historical HSC / UAT scores being so low for entry into teaching degrees; during university course selection in grade 12, career counsellors instructed students to put a teaching degree in the last selection "in case" something goes wrong with ones grades. These were the very teachers/advisors remarks. Unfortunately, educational vocation seemed few and far between during my secondary studies.

Final remark - excellent educators develop open-minded, worldly, engaged, well-adjusted and socially minded pupils who's bullshit detector will be finely tuned when they are the next generation of policy makers instituting renewable energy guidelines, drafting the Constitutional Recognition of Indigenous Australians, and rescinding the tax-free status of religious bodies ... I am all for improvements in education. But a smart electorate could be construed as too dangerous for many governments.
I’m glad you feel dirty! Lol Again I know what you mean..certain standards much be reached. But you know some of the best teacher’s are the one’s who never understood as students, than BANG they get it, they know what it is like not to know, and understand and fully empathise with students who are struggling.
 

Nano

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I see what your saying..but the HSC mark doesn’t necessarily define your knowledge or ability, that is my point. You can do bridging courses as I said, you are not all washed up.
I understand but when you have kids getting mystery marks and very low grades on the HSC, are these the type of people who should study things like engineering, computer science or medicine if they can later on? Because these fields are very important in having the right People ready to benefit to the greater community.

I think it can clearly define your knowledge, ability and logic/problem solving skills especially for a uni level needed in proper fields, if you can’t do the basic at the young age you probably aren’t cut out for it in the later run when it gets much harder and aren’t spoon fed anymore
 

Mr 95%

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I understand but when you have kids getting mystery marks and very low grades on the HSC, are these the type of people who should study things like engineering, computer science or medicine if they can later on? Because these fields are very important in having the right People ready to benefit to the greater community.

I think it can clearly define your knowledge, ability and logic/problem solving skills especially for a uni level needed in proper fields, if you can’t do the basic at the young age you probably aren’t cut out for it in the later run when it gets much harder and aren’t spoon fed anymore
I disagree. It doesn’t clearly define your knowledge, etc. there are too many variables eg.school conditions, resources available,.. i agree though you need certain skills to qualify to participate in a course, but those skills are not only confined to being learnt during K-12
 

Hacky McAxe

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https://m.imgur.com/a/Suc1RKJ

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/20...ce=Twitter&utm_campaign=websitesharingbuttons

Shit like this doesn't help any side.

PS could be fake but could be real, either way whoever is responsible needs a bullet in the head.
I would suggest avoiding the Gateway Pundit for news. They're famous for taking actual stories and mixing in complete bullshit in an attempt to create animosity against the left. They're also famous for reporting on hoaxes as real news.

Here's an actual news site on the story

https://www.news.com.au/world/north...k/news-story/286ac22422164f7cd63ed2445dee4513
 
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