Opinion Salary Cap isn't working

[oldman]

There are a number of improvements that could occur with the cap

Namely:

a) Players are categorised into two tiers, Imported and Developed.

Import players are players who were not promoted to the NRL through the development pathway of their current club.

Developed players are players who were promoted to the NRL after commencing their career with their initial club.

A player who changes clubs, regardless of reason, will cease to be recognised as a “Developed Player”, even if they later return to their development club.

To be recognised for salary cap exemption, development players must be registered to their club prior to turning 17 years of ago.

b) Development players are salary cap exempt. If a player changes clubs then normal salary cap rules apply;

c) Import players are not salary cap exempt unless:

the player has player seven consecutive years at the one club. In this case the salary cap for the player will receive a 25% exemption.

the player has player ten consecutive years at the one club. In this case the salary cap for the player will receive a 50% exemption.

d) TPA will be capped at $150,000, per season. This amount is total amount permitted, combined across all players in receipt of TPA’s.

The intent of the proposal is for clubs to invest in juniors. If clubs want to purchase players, then it comes at a financial burden.

 

[albatross]

Buying the wrong players, paying overs for the wrong players, letting the wrong players go, and not developing enough quality juniors, are bigger problems for us than the cap. Rorting the cap is happening but it's not the reason we're shit.

 

[Untamed]

I remember the days when the dogs were powerful & when players left for more money, their careers went down the drain & never won a gf with other teams. Unfortunately for last few years, the roles have reversed. I'm sick of these overpaid players who come over & don't perform. This shit started with those 3 fucking idiots who let young good players leave for overpaid bums.

 

[piggy]

Buying the wrong players, paying overs for the wrong players, letting the wrong players go, and not developing enough quality juniors, are bigger problems for us than the cap. Rorting the cap is happening but it's not the reason we're shit.

This is exactly why, unless you are an elite player, no player should be given more than a 2 year contract. The problem of course is that when clubs are offering 3 and 4 year contracts, players want the added security of a longer term contract. But signing a shorter term contract keeps players on their toes because if they don't perform they will have difficulty finding another club or would have to accept a reduced salary. The other huge problem with the salary cap is there are not enough quality players so lower tiered clubs end up signing dud players just for the sake of spending 95% of their salary cap instead of being able to save this money to but quality players when they become available.

 

[Doogie]

There are a number of improvements that could occur with the cap

Namely:

a) Players are categorised into two tiers, Imported and Developed.

Import players are players who were not promoted to the NRL through the development pathway of their current club.

Developed players are players who were promoted to the NRL after commencing their career with their initial club.

A player who changes clubs, regardless of reason, will cease to be recognised as a “Developed Player”, even if they later return to their development club.

To be recognised for salary cap exemption, development players must be registered to their club prior to turning 17 years of ago.

b) Development players are salary cap exempt. If a player changes clubs then normal salary cap rules apply;

c) Import players are not salary cap exempt unless:

the player has player seven consecutive years at the one club. In this case the salary cap for the player will receive a 25% exemption.

the player has player ten consecutive years at the one club. In this case the salary cap for the player will receive a 50% exemption.

d) TPA will be capped at $150,000, per season. This amount is total amount permitted, combined across all players in receipt of TPA’s.

The intent of the proposal is for clubs to invest in juniors. If clubs want to purchase players, then it comes at a financial burden.

Nice idea - except this is just going to create some interesting jockeying for high school players and opportunities to do all sorts of dodgy deals that don't fall under the salary cap. May also cause development issues if for example a kid is playing well in his local area but a club in another state offers him a sweetheart deal that he cannot refuse. He'd need to up and move, causing problems with education, player welfare etc.

Don't think you can make dev players cap exempt. This just creates an unfair playing field to teams with bigger feeder zones (i.e. Broncs, NQ, Penrith etc.) Maybe a 30% reduction - incentive to develop players but not overly disadvantaging teams with small feeds.

Like the import exemptions for time spent. Only issue is 7 and 10 years are a long time. Maybe 5 and 7 years?

The TPA is an interesting one - attached below are 2018-19 TPA's - some interesting reading. Storm is not unexpected but Roosters - hmmm...


The only thing I would add is ALL clubs have to publicize their contract roster. Happens in American sports, EPL and other big $ sports leagues. Would be very interesting to have transparency on all of this beyond what the NRL appointed commish gets to see. Might also have some players asking q's when they see what other players are getting paid.

 

[BDPScarface]

I'm not going to blame our current predicament exclusively on the salary cap, because from the outside in, it'll appear that we are using it as an excuse, as opposed to when we were making finals and doing relatively well.

Obviously the outsiders don't understand how badly scarred our club and the fans are from salary cap dramas, and how it's been a bone of contention since day 1.

But the game really has its head buried deep in the sand at the moment about the failings of the game. This round continues the current situation, where it is entirely predictable who will win, the same teams as last year, and pretty much the same teams as for several years now. And the margins are indicative of the yawning chasm.

So far I've only found one article alluding to this problem, by Roy masters in The Sydney morning Herald a couple of weeks ago. Otherwise, the media covering the NRL are shamefully staying silent on the situation. There is no way in hell they are oblivious.

 

[mr j]

Salary Cap works if done right. Manly have DCE/Turbo over +$1m, Cowboys have JT/Holmes/Morgan close to that figure and Broncos have Milf. We have DWZ/Napa close to $1.5m and if you invest those funds better you turn your results around. No surprise all 4 teams are at the bottom of the ladder with dreadful use of the cap

 

[bradyk]

Salary Cap works if done right. Manly have DCE/Turbo over +$1m, Cowboys have JT/Holmes/Morgan close to that figure and Broncos have Milf. We have DWZ/Napa close to $1.5m and if you invest those funds better you turn your results around. No surprise all 4 teams are at the bottom of the ladder with dreadful use of the cap

Panthers are soon to have ~2.4m between Cleary, JFH and Luai. They also have Crichton on big money and a few other players on decent money. There's nothing wrong with the model, it just needs to be on the right players. Napa is worth minimum wage and we're paying him 650k, DWZ is worth around 300-400k and we're paying him 550k... you can find plenty of other e.g's throughout the team.

 

[bowleggedwog]

A salary cap is useless when you add TPAs.

 

[mr j]

Panthers are soon to have ~2.4m between Cleary, JFH and Luai. They also have Crichton on big money and a few other players on decent money. There's nothing wrong with the model, it just needs to be on the right players. Napa is worth minimum wage and we're paying him 650k, DWZ is worth around 300-400k and we're paying him 550k... you can find plenty of other e.g's throughout the team.

I’m not faulting the model, faulting the teams who are bottom 4 with their Top 30 management. Look at what Panthers get out of Cleary/JFH and Luai compared with the bottom 4 teams. It’s why they deserve to be at the top and we deserve to be on the bottom. Yet some on here want to blame Baz already. Ps, DWZ on way more than $550 - let that sink in.

 

[Trafford10]

The Raiders have a number of players on less than half what they were on at other clubs. Ryan James went from $780 at the Titans to $390. CNK played last year for $130k. Others have signed for far less than offered elsewhere. Fix the culture and the cap becomes pretty much irrelevant...

Nobody should underestimate the desire to play in a winning culture. With that comes a advantage for a competition with a salary cap but no draft.

 

[Trafford10]

A salary cap is useless when you add TPAs.

Agree, they need a model like MLB that would even the playing field sonewhat for clubs that can't command big TPAs.

 

[maroondog72]

Culture is everything, I look at the nrl right now and in a way to me it's becoming similar to the NBA players will take less money to stay on competitive teams and have a chance to compete for a championship every year. There are still a few high profile players leaving for money etc David Fifita but when you look at someone like Brandon Smith who is probably going to stay at the storm for a fuck ton less then other clubs will offer him I think our only way out is junior development which will take years. We gotta get better at scouting and poaching talent before they make it into the NRL.

Spot on I said in the other thread if we where 3/0 instead of 0/3 no one would be bitching about the salary cap or valandys.we need to fix our club not the fucking comp

 

[B-Train]

Salary Cap works if done right. Manly have DCE/Turbo over +$1m, Cowboys have JT/Holmes/Morgan close to that figure and Broncos have Milf. We have DWZ/Napa close to $1.5m and if you invest those funds better you turn your results around. No surprise all 4 teams are at the bottom of the ladder with dreadful use of the cap

They shouldn't force teams to spend 95% of the cap. The best players go to the top 4 clubs which means bottom 8 teams have to overpay for mediocre players to fill their cap.

Change it so that teams can spend as little as they want and you'll see far less bad contracts from bottom 8 teams.

 

[a dogs life]

This is exactly why, unless you are an elite player, no player should be given more than a 2 year contract. The problem of course is that when clubs are offering 3 and 4 year contracts, players want the added security of a longer term contract. But signing a shorter term contract keeps players on their toes because if they don't perform they will have difficulty finding another club or would have to accept a reduced salary. The other huge problem with the salary cap is there are not enough quality players so lower tiered clubs end up signing dud players just for the sake of spending 95% of their salary cap instead of being able to save this money to but quality players when they become available.

Sure but by that reasoning half our squad should be playing better than they currently are because they are unsigned for next year.

I do like your idea of not having to spend a minimum 95% of your cap and being able to bank it for future years.

Agree what someone else posted above. Beggars belief that the NRL are looking at expansion with the state of the current competition.

 

[bulldog butch]

I have big concerns how our cap has been spent even this year and last year.... Dallin, napa, hopoate have to be on way more than they should be.... Jackson I have so much respect for, but he reached his peak years ago and is on the decline is also not value for money... I am also worried about thompsons value for money.. I think he has it in him but has not delivered anywhere near the form to justify big dollars he's rumoured to be on. Corey Allen, who knows! .... Have a look at south's back line depth.... Latrell, Johnson, gagai, Campbell Graham, walker, Reynolds, Steve masters, tautua moga, braidon burns, Jaxson paulo. Then they can afford Marshall and mansour as cover/depth at the start of the year.. there forward pack apart from cook and murray aren't superstars but they get value/best out of them and we're still able to sign arrow..... Have a look at our back line players..... We don't even have a quality 1-7 let alone depth.... Doesn't look good, we don't have any value for $ players in our side its simple.... Okonbur maybe but that's it... I personally don't think our cap is any better now or next year than 3-4 years ago.... Anyways just compare the 2 rosters and something doesn't add up.....

 

[Chris Harding]

For the salary cap to work there needs to be some rules applied that will make it work.

1. Highest bidder for a player sets the price of bidding (or at least an in the same ballpark figure).
Sick of hearing shit about how players like Tedesco will take $300k under his market vaue to stay at the Roosters. Same shit with Keary. If a club offers him 1 million per season on the salary cap it should mean that the Roosters have to at least offer $950k to $975k per season on the salary cap. We currently have a situation where someone like Politis could easily arrange for a $300k per season third party deal through his business connections. And he still might win the player with promisies of TPA's he arranges on the sly even if this rule was bought in, but it might mean he can save $25k to $50k through cheating rather than $300k. That's 300k less to offer another decent player. Considering that the Roosters supposedly have both Keary and Tedesco on significantly less than other clubs were willing to offer under the cap (reportedly something like half a million between those two) it just means a stacked team can still make offers on another really good player. half a million can get you a very good forward or back. It reduces the options for marquee players a bit. But for someone able to earn half a million dollars a year that should be an inconvenience they're prepared to live with. Fly in fly out workers suffer that inconvenience for $50k a year jobs. Footballers should realize that sacrifices need to be made to earn the big dollars.

2. Junior reductions.
If you are the first club to pay a junior a contract you are entitled to a permanent discount on their wage that increases by a small amount for every year they stay in your junior system. Not sure what is fair. But we are in a situation where many clubs have very little incentive to spend on player development. Many will just wait till a good junior is approaching 18-19 to chase promising juniors and a club that has developed them from 15 years of age will lose out on a player they've alredy invested plenty of time and effort into. The NRL could really increase the number of good players coming through the junior systems by giving each club a specified country area to invest in if their local junior base is too small to be useful. and this in turn would help keep league viable in country areas as well.

There are probably a few more ideas that would help balance the spread of talent. But these two alone would mean that (a) clubs couldn't keep offering money on the side to get players. (b) More clubs would be inclined to carry the financial weight of investing in the players that will be the future of the game.

All a clever CEO needs to do is offer a base salary to his top players, then find ways for them to win easy bets for big money which is not counted under the cap.

 

[chisdog]

I’m not faulting the model, faulting the teams who are bottom 4 with their Top 30 management. Look at what Panthers get out of Cleary/JFH and Luai compared with the bottom 4 teams. It’s why they deserve to be at the top and we deserve to be on the bottom. Yet some on here want to blame Baz already. Ps, DWZ on way more than $550 - let that sink in.

You should also note that the Panthers have the biggest & best juniors in the comp. It makes a HUGE difference.

 

[pillow]

They shouldn't force teams to spend 95% of the cap. The best players go to the top 4 clubs which means bottom 8 teams have to overpay for mediocre players to fill their cap.

Change it so that teams can spend as little as they want and you'll see far less bad contracts from bottom 8 teams.

100% this. Being forced to pay the same money for garbage players that other clubs are supposedly paying superstars is ridiculous.

we need Arthur to open his wallet and provide the big TPAs so our salary cap figure can be reduced

 

[mr j]

You should also note that the Panthers have the biggest & best juniors in the comp. It makes a HUGE difference.

And we have a bigger junior system when compared with most other teams. We spent years looking out rather than developing within. More than half of the players who take us to the next premiership will be based on players who haven’t played a FG game yet. That’s how you stay cap compliant. We throw big bucks to Napa/DWZ and Thompson who won’t ever win us games. We invest money in the wrong positions. We need to find a good young core, sign them long term and build around them. Having Flanagan and Burton is a positive step in the right direction.