What happens to tolman

[BELMORE]

I agree that Tolman is a modern day lightweight prop but he is still around 185cm and Graham is taller again. They are both between 105 and 110kg which doesn't make them JWH or Junior Paulo sized but they are reasonable and much more mobile than the big blokes and with the interchanges coming down they will go pretty well in the future.

They aren’t mobile enough to be effective though, no teams are troubled by their “mobility”

 

[flamebouyant]

You want Tolman to play lock. Thats the dumbest thing ive read in my whole life. Tolman at lock hahaha please give me a break.

What on earth will he offer at lock. A lock needs to offer something in attack an offload footwork leg speed post contact metres hit hard in def something. Tolman offers nothing his too small and slow no coach can fix that. Danny F Jackson or RFM need to be our lock. Id go with Danny F at lock Jackson and RFM on the edges. Tolman bench nsw cup or plays for another club.

Im not wasting any more breath on you. You dont have to like him, and i dont really give a shit. Next year he will be in the team whether you like it or not. Then you can just bitch and moan about him all season.
Ill be sure to say i told you so if he starts at lock.

 

[Dingo]

Im not wasting any more breath on you. You dont have to like him, and i dont really give a shit. Next year he will be in the team whether you like it or not. Then you can just bitch and moan about him all season.
Ill be sure to say i told you so if he starts at lock.

With the exception of Klemmer at his rightful Prop position, whether Tolman, Jackson, RFM, Fualalo or even Elliot be selected at Lock doesn't really matter to me.
Its a tough call and may take some trial and error to figure out but I trust that Dean Pay will ultimately make the best decision.
A forward with his experience will know exactly how a Bulldog pack should look and function.
While I have my preference/s I will sit on the fence and watch a bit longer.

 

[flamebouyant]

With the exception of Klemmer at his rightful Prop position, whether Tolman, Jackson, RFM, Fualalo or even Elliot be selected at Lock doesn't really matter to me.
Its a tough call and may take some trial and error to figure out but I trust that Dean Pay will ultimately make the best decision.
A forward with his experience will know exactly how a Bulldog pack should look and function.
While I have my preference/s I will sit on the fence and watch a bit longer.

Exactly. Its up to him at the end of the day. I trust his judgement also. And if tolman plays off the bench or has to do a stint in ISP then so be it. Im not the coach. Im juat defending the guy because i think he cops way too much criticism on here.

 

[Dingo]

Exactly. Its up to him at the end of the day. I trust his judgement also. And if tolman plays off the bench or has to do a stint in ISP then so be it. Im not the coach. Im juat defending the guy because i think he cops way too much criticism on here.

I know mate he cops a bit. I'm keen to see if both Tolman and Eastwood find some new life under Pay.

 

[flamebouyant]

I know mate he cops a bit. I'm keen to see if both Tolman and Eastwood find some new life under Pay.

Ots certainly not out of the question. He hasnt played 10 years of fg for two successful clubs because he is shit.

 

[speedy2460]

Im not wasting any more breath on you. You dont have to like him, and i dont really give a shit. Next year he will be in the team whether you like it or not. Then you can just bitch and moan about him all season.
Ill be sure to say i told you so if he starts at lock.

Totally agree with you. E18 says Tolman has no mobility and promotes Fualolo. I think Fualolo is a very promising prop, but he has less mobility than Tolman.
I want to change Tolmans name to Toilman. He will make a great lock.

 

[CrittaMagic69]

Totally agree with you. E18 says Tolman has no mobility and promotes Fualolo. I think Fualolo is a very promising prop, but he has less mobility than Tolman.
I want to change Tolmans name to Toilman. He will make a great lock.

Lol @ great lock, laughable really. It's like you don't even watch other teams play.

 

[flamebouyant]

Lol @ great lock, laughable really. It's like you don't even watch other teams play.

And its like you are a living breathing encyclopedia of rugby league. You know everything. Lol

 

[flamebouyant]

Totally agree with you. E18 says Tolman has no mobility and promotes Fualolo. I think Fualolo is a very promising prop, but he has less mobility than Tolman.
I want to change Tolmans name to Toilman. He will make a great lock.

I think he will too. Eure he will have to tweak his game a little, but i can see him doing well in the position.
At the end of the day, the only persons opinion that matters is Dean Pays. not mine or yours, or any of the Tolman haters. So come round one next year we will see what he thinks. Im tipping Tolman to play lock though.

 

[Gabe]

Interesting

Aiden Tolman (2017 stats)
Tackles: 880
Hitups: 337
Running Metres: 2720

Per Game
Tackles: 38.26
Hitups: 14.65
Running Metres: 118.26

Jesse Bromwich (2017 stats)
Tackles: 453
Hitups: 250
Running Metres: 2409

Per Game
Tackles: 23.84
Hitups: 13.16
Running Metres: 126.79

 

[CrittaMagic69]

And its like you are a living breathing encyclopedia of rugby league. You know everything. Lol

Not at all, it's just basic facts. Compare Tolman to the other locks in the game and it's crazy to call him great when compared to them. His skillset just isn't comparable to them at all.

Has nothing to do with me hating on Tolman, but i'm not going to pretend hes anything more than what he actually is. No footwork, no speed, no ball playing ability, no tackle breaking ability, etc. I'm not saying he needs to be an out and out attacking weapon, but he needa to be more than one of the least ineffective ball runners in todays game.

I'm really struggling to see why people think Tolman is such a great choice at lock in todays game, so please explain to me what i'm missing. At best he's a stop gap solution unless he overhauls his game.

 

[EB18]

Not at all, it's just basic facts. Compare Tolman to the other locks in the game and it's crazy to call him great when compared to them. His skillset just isn't comparable to them at all.

Has nothing to do with me hating on Tolman, but i'm not going to pretend hes anything more than what he actually is. No footwork, no speed, no ball playing ability, no tackle breaking ability, etc. I'm not saying he needs to be an out and out attacking weapon, but he needa to be more than one of the least ineffective ball runners in todays game.

I'm really struggling to see why people think Tolman is such a great choice at lock in todays game, so please explain to me what i'm missing. At best he's a stop gap solution unless he overhauls his game.

Oohhh oohh but but Tolman is a tackling machine. His so great in def. His a workhorse he will be a mad lock.

Dont worry about attack its not important. As long as he can tackle.

 

[speedy2460]

Has any of you so called experts ever heard it said that "defence wins games"?

 

[CrittaMagic69]

Has any of you so called experts ever heard it said that "defence wins games"?

And there's more to defence than tackle counts and missed tackle stats. It's also not as if he's making 60+ tackles some games like Mannering or Friend.

Tolman certainly isn't an elite defender like you're trying to make him out to be. Sure he makes his tackles and rarely misses, and that's good, but how many of his tackles lead to a quick play the ball to setup an opposition attack? How many tackles does he hurt the opposition? How many tackles does he push the attacker back or stop them dead in their tracks? How often does he dominate and slow the ruck? There's so many other things that make a great defender other than just stopping the defender make a line break.

And then even if you rate his defence so highly, what else does he offer? Look at what all the other top locks in the game do. What's your plan, have Tolman make 60+ tackles and limit his work with the ball in hand? Pfft.

 

[CaptainJackson]

And there's more to defence than tackle counts and missed tackle stats. It's also not as if he's making 60+ tackles some games like Mannering or Friend.

Tolman certainly isn't an elite defender like you're trying to make him out to be. Sure he makes his tackles and rarely misses, and that's good, but how many of his tackles lead to a quick play the ball to setup an opposition attack? How many tackles does he hurt the opposition? How many tackles does he push the attacker back or stop them dead in their tracks? How often does he dominate and slow the ruck? There's so many other things that make a great defender other than just stopping the defender make a line break.

And then even if you rate his defence so highly, what else does he offer? Look at what all the other top locks in the game do. What's your plan, have Tolman make 60+ tackles and limit his work with the ball in hand? Pfft.

Yep agree

It's amazing that people are looking at his stats and saying he did good.

He plays more minutes than most forwards because of des

His tackles are mostly ineffective until someone else joins in

His metres are clocked up because of the huge minutes he got under des


The one good thing I can give tolman credit for is that he does notice when the defence is on the back foot and has a hole in it so he wants the ball in those situations and makes breaks. But seriously it wouldn't be a high concern for me to have my props playing like that.

You'd want your props to dominate and punish the opposition, to wear them down. But the amount if times we have been dominated in the first 20 minutes with graham and tolman on the field

 

[CrittaMagic69]

Yep agree

It's amazing that people are looking at his stats and saying he did good.

He plays more minutes than most forwards because of des

His tackles are mostly ineffective until someone else joins in

His metres are clocked up because of the huge minutes he got under des


The one good thing I can give tolman credit for is that he does notice when the defence is on the back foot and has a hole in it so he wants the ball in those situations and makes breaks. But seriously it wouldn't be a high concern for me to have my props playing like that.

You'd want your props to dominate and punish the opposition, to wear them down. But the amount if times we have been dominated in the first 20 minutes with graham and tolman on the field

Yup. I still see plenty of value (ignoring his wage) in Tolman, just not as a starting lock or starter in general in this side. I have said it so many times and i'll probably keep saying it, the blokes a small forward but he doesn't move like one. He simply needs to bulk up and sacrifice his "engine" for more power.

A stronger more physical Tolman playing less minutes at a higher intensity with his desire to work will be far more valuable than leaving him out there for extended minutes like he's some marathon runner.

 

[flamebouyant]

Oohhh oohh but but Tolman is a tackling machine. His so great in def. His a workhorse he will be a mad lock.

Dont worry about attack its not important. As long as he can tackle.

Haha your such a clown mate.

 

[Natboy]

I’d love to see a poll on what front rower players love to run at the most

 

[flamebouyant]

Yup. I still see plenty of value (ignoring his wage) in Tolman, just not as a starting lock or starter in general in this side. I have said it so many times and i'll probably keep saying it, the blokes a small forward but he doesn't move like one. He simply needs to bulk up and sacrifice his "engine" for more power.

A stronger more physical Tolman playing less minutes at a higher intensity with his desire to work will be far more valuable than leaving him out there for extended minutes like he's some marathon runner.

You see, this i agree with. He probably wont be getting the same minutes as he did under des as im sure that pay has a very different gameplan. It is also possible pay will ask him to bulk up a little in the offseason, and its also possible he could add an offload to his game, he does pass well behind the line, so its possible.
Our whole forward rotation and style of play will be dramatically different next year. Im sure most of us will agree on this, so i just dont get why so many people have no confidence that tolman is capable of changing it up.
I agree tolman will never be taumololo or tapau or anything like this type of player, but it is possible that he can sacrifice some of his game time and durability in exchange for a bit more impact.
This being said, i cant see him being a bench player. And this is why i think he will play lock.