The untold story of how the Bulldogs let Johnathan Thurston sign with the Cowboys
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Dogs lose next immortal - JT
[h=1]Dally M winner Johnathan Thurston: How the Bulldogs let league’s next Immortal go[/h]42 minutes ago
DailyTelegraph
[h=3]Steve 'Blocker' Roach on Johnathan Thurston[/h]
IT will go down as the biggest recruitment blunder in rugby league history, bar none. The day back in July 2004 when the Canterbury Bulldogs let a 21-year-old Johnathan Thurston go.
Despite his pleas to stay at Belmore and the fact he was prepared to accept 30 per cent less than North Queensland was offering, the Bulldogs cut him loose — and chose Brent Sherwin ahead of him. Here is how it all unfolded.
In those days Thurston was barely recognisable. The punters wouldn’t have even noticed Cowboys coach, the late Graham Murray, and team manager Peter Parr, with the boom young halfback and his agent Sam Ayoub sitting around a table at Barzura in Coogee.
[h=4]Other Stories[/h][h=4]Hodges cleared for grand final[/h]
[h=4]Mundine: Why I’m better than Hayne[/h]
[h=4]Partner explains why Thurston broke down[/h]
[h=4]Story behind the Dally M showstopper[/h]
[h=4]‘I got three or four words in’[/h]
He played only seven first grade games that year.
In those days the Cowboys had Nathan Fien at half-back and David Myles at five-eighth, both handy players but hardly in the superstar class.
That morning in the coffee shop they offer Thurston a two-year contract worth $460,000. It is huge money for a youngster who at that stage of his career was only on year-to-year deals.
The offer is put in writing the next day — $220,000 for 2005 and $240,000 for 2006. They need a quick decision and place a 48-hour deadline.
It is even more appealing because, at the meeting, Murray offers him the starting half-back job while he is still playing off the bench at Canterbury.
DECIDER: Grand final teams named
INJURY: Thurston not 100 per cent
Thurston didn’t want to leave the Bulldogs after they gave him his NRL start.Previously they had bought older and more experienced players like Julian O’Neill and Tim Brasher. Here was the kid Murray believed could one-day deliver the club a premiership.
Thurston also had interest from the Rabbitohs. Former Bulldogs forward, Paul Dunn, was the South Sydney CEO chief executive, offering Thurston $120,000 a year, almost double what he was on at Canterbury.
Phil Gould was a close friend and adviser to Dunn and advised him to bump the offer up to $200,000 and that he wouldn’t regret it.
Dunn couldn’t go any higher because of salary cap pressure so it came down to the Bulldogs or the Cowboys.
Thurston was desperate to stay at Belmore, the year he played off the bench in the Bulldogs’ grand final-winning side. He was close mates with Willie Mason, Reni Maitua, Matt Utai and Willie Tonga.
When no one else wanted him, the Bulldogs gave him a contract (match payments only) and free accommodation in 2002.
He ended up winning three premierships in three years — the Under 20s (2002), reserve grade (2003) and first grade in 2004. He loved the club. It had become his home.
After the talks with the Cowboys in Coogee, Ayoub organises an urgent meeting the Bulldogs.
WALLY: ‘JT will take my throne’
INTERACTIVE: How JT made history
Former Bulldogs CEO Malcolm Noad with coach Steve Folkes — the men who dumped JT.It’s 9am inside the office of chief executive Malcolm Noad. There is Noad, coach Steve Folkes, Thurston and Ayoub. Thurston reminded Ayoub before they walked in he wanted to stay. Still Ayoub was worried.
“Folkesy was one of those structured-like coaches,” Ayoub said.
“He probably saw too much flair in Johnathan and although he wanted to keep him, he wasn’t going to bust his guts to do it.”
Ayoub brings the contract offer from the Cowboys to the meeting to prove it is legitimate and not one of those cases where managers try to squeeze more by inventing interest from elsewhere.
Incredibly, Thurston offers to stay for 30 per cent less than the Cowboys have offered. He says he’ll sign for $160,000 in 2005 and $170,000 in 2006.
The Bulldogs were under salary cap pressure. As crazy as it seems now, they had spent all their money signing half-back Brent Sherwin for five years and Braith Anasta for three.
“I told them I didn’t expect them to match the Cowboys money,” Ayoub said, “we’ll stay for 30 per cent less. I can still remember Folkesy sitting at the end of the table.
“He said ‘no mate — take it and go.’ Malcolm Noad didn’t say much and we left.”
Ayoub can remember it all as though it was yesterday. They walk to his car, get inside, and Thurston breaks down and cries.
“Yes, he teared up,” Ayoub recalls, “I said to him ‘They made the decision for you.’ It was tough because you don’t want a player going somewhere he doesn’t want to go but it was a decision they made for him.”
Thurston found a home in Townsville and a coach who trusted him in Graham Murray.Two days later they flew to Townsville and signed the contract.
It didn’t take long for Thurston to settle in. He steered the Cowboys into the 2005 grand final and won the first of his four Dally M Awards.
“Muzz had plenty of appeal as his coach,” Ayoub said. “He let him play his natural game.
“Unlike Folkesy, Brian Smith and all them who played very structured, one on the left, one on the right, he gave Johnathan a license just to play football.
“He allowed a half to be a half and didn’t harness him. That freedom and his natural instincts helped him become the champion he is today.”
Two years ago, Thurston all but quit the Cowboys. As much as he loved North Queensland, it was time to think of after-football career opportunities.
Being in Sydney where the big media corporates are based had plenty of appeal. He could work for Channel Nine or Fox Sports. James Packer, through Phil Gould, was offering opportunities if he signed at Penrith.
My Daily Telegraph colleague Dean Ritchie splashed the story over the back page the night Des Hasler secretly tried to lure him back to Belmore.
“That photo turned him off the Dogs a bit,” Ayoub said, “He was disappointed it had been leaked.”
Phil Gould came close to convincing Thurston to joining the Panthers.Ayoub reveals Thurston actually decided to quit the Cowboys to join the Panthers.
“He rang me on a Wednesday night,” Ayoub recalls, “He’d been tossing it around for weeks. We’d had lots of meetings. Gus made a really big play and galvanised a lot of support (including Packer).
“I was stressing about it because he was so settled in Townsville and was thinking about starting a family. He was very happy.
“Anyway the call was about 9.30pm. And he said, ‘mate I’m going to leave.’ It was great money and a great opportunity at Penrith but I said ‘do you really want to’
“He told me that’s what he wanted and asked me to move forward with it.
“I then said he should think about it for a couple of days and go and see a couple of people up there he is very close to. There was no rush. Gus didn’t have a deadline.
“I held back from ringing Gus to tell him Johnathan was coming. I don’t know why but I just didn’t ring. I’ve seen players make decisions then change their minds. I just wanted to give him another 48 hours just in case.
“Jono kept putting it off. He didn’t want to tell the Cowboys he was going. Anyway, they eventually caught up, they had a good chat and he changed his mind. The rest his history.”
Eventually Thurston signed for three more years at the Cowboys. 2015, 2016 and 2017. He is now in talks to extend his contract until the end of the 2018 season.
He is there for good.
Originally published as How the Bulldogs lost an Immortal
[h=1]Dally M winner Johnathan Thurston: How the Bulldogs let league’s next Immortal go[/h]42 minutes ago
DailyTelegraph
[h=3]Steve 'Blocker' Roach on Johnathan Thurston[/h]
IT will go down as the biggest recruitment blunder in rugby league history, bar none. The day back in July 2004 when the Canterbury Bulldogs let a 21-year-old Johnathan Thurston go.
Despite his pleas to stay at Belmore and the fact he was prepared to accept 30 per cent less than North Queensland was offering, the Bulldogs cut him loose — and chose Brent Sherwin ahead of him. Here is how it all unfolded.
In those days Thurston was barely recognisable. The punters wouldn’t have even noticed Cowboys coach, the late Graham Murray, and team manager Peter Parr, with the boom young halfback and his agent Sam Ayoub sitting around a table at Barzura in Coogee.
[h=4]Other Stories[/h][h=4]Hodges cleared for grand final[/h]
[h=4]Mundine: Why I’m better than Hayne[/h]
[h=4]Partner explains why Thurston broke down[/h]
[h=4]Story behind the Dally M showstopper[/h]
[h=4]‘I got three or four words in’[/h]
He played only seven first grade games that year.
In those days the Cowboys had Nathan Fien at half-back and David Myles at five-eighth, both handy players but hardly in the superstar class.
That morning in the coffee shop they offer Thurston a two-year contract worth $460,000. It is huge money for a youngster who at that stage of his career was only on year-to-year deals.
The offer is put in writing the next day — $220,000 for 2005 and $240,000 for 2006. They need a quick decision and place a 48-hour deadline.
It is even more appealing because, at the meeting, Murray offers him the starting half-back job while he is still playing off the bench at Canterbury.
DECIDER: Grand final teams named
INJURY: Thurston not 100 per cent
Thurston also had interest from the Rabbitohs. Former Bulldogs forward, Paul Dunn, was the South Sydney CEO chief executive, offering Thurston $120,000 a year, almost double what he was on at Canterbury.
Phil Gould was a close friend and adviser to Dunn and advised him to bump the offer up to $200,000 and that he wouldn’t regret it.
Dunn couldn’t go any higher because of salary cap pressure so it came down to the Bulldogs or the Cowboys.
Thurston was desperate to stay at Belmore, the year he played off the bench in the Bulldogs’ grand final-winning side. He was close mates with Willie Mason, Reni Maitua, Matt Utai and Willie Tonga.
When no one else wanted him, the Bulldogs gave him a contract (match payments only) and free accommodation in 2002.
He ended up winning three premierships in three years — the Under 20s (2002), reserve grade (2003) and first grade in 2004. He loved the club. It had become his home.
After the talks with the Cowboys in Coogee, Ayoub organises an urgent meeting the Bulldogs.
WALLY: ‘JT will take my throne’
INTERACTIVE: How JT made history
“Folkesy was one of those structured-like coaches,” Ayoub said.
“He probably saw too much flair in Johnathan and although he wanted to keep him, he wasn’t going to bust his guts to do it.”
Ayoub brings the contract offer from the Cowboys to the meeting to prove it is legitimate and not one of those cases where managers try to squeeze more by inventing interest from elsewhere.
Incredibly, Thurston offers to stay for 30 per cent less than the Cowboys have offered. He says he’ll sign for $160,000 in 2005 and $170,000 in 2006.
The Bulldogs were under salary cap pressure. As crazy as it seems now, they had spent all their money signing half-back Brent Sherwin for five years and Braith Anasta for three.
“I told them I didn’t expect them to match the Cowboys money,” Ayoub said, “we’ll stay for 30 per cent less. I can still remember Folkesy sitting at the end of the table.
“He said ‘no mate — take it and go.’ Malcolm Noad didn’t say much and we left.”
Ayoub can remember it all as though it was yesterday. They walk to his car, get inside, and Thurston breaks down and cries.
“Yes, he teared up,” Ayoub recalls, “I said to him ‘They made the decision for you.’ It was tough because you don’t want a player going somewhere he doesn’t want to go but it was a decision they made for him.”
It didn’t take long for Thurston to settle in. He steered the Cowboys into the 2005 grand final and won the first of his four Dally M Awards.
“Muzz had plenty of appeal as his coach,” Ayoub said. “He let him play his natural game.
“Unlike Folkesy, Brian Smith and all them who played very structured, one on the left, one on the right, he gave Johnathan a license just to play football.
“He allowed a half to be a half and didn’t harness him. That freedom and his natural instincts helped him become the champion he is today.”
Two years ago, Thurston all but quit the Cowboys. As much as he loved North Queensland, it was time to think of after-football career opportunities.
Being in Sydney where the big media corporates are based had plenty of appeal. He could work for Channel Nine or Fox Sports. James Packer, through Phil Gould, was offering opportunities if he signed at Penrith.
My Daily Telegraph colleague Dean Ritchie splashed the story over the back page the night Des Hasler secretly tried to lure him back to Belmore.
“That photo turned him off the Dogs a bit,” Ayoub said, “He was disappointed it had been leaked.”
“He rang me on a Wednesday night,” Ayoub recalls, “He’d been tossing it around for weeks. We’d had lots of meetings. Gus made a really big play and galvanised a lot of support (including Packer).
“I was stressing about it because he was so settled in Townsville and was thinking about starting a family. He was very happy.
“Anyway the call was about 9.30pm. And he said, ‘mate I’m going to leave.’ It was great money and a great opportunity at Penrith but I said ‘do you really want to’
“He told me that’s what he wanted and asked me to move forward with it.
“I then said he should think about it for a couple of days and go and see a couple of people up there he is very close to. There was no rush. Gus didn’t have a deadline.
“I held back from ringing Gus to tell him Johnathan was coming. I don’t know why but I just didn’t ring. I’ve seen players make decisions then change their minds. I just wanted to give him another 48 hours just in case.
“Jono kept putting it off. He didn’t want to tell the Cowboys he was going. Anyway, they eventually caught up, they had a good chat and he changed his mind. The rest his history.”
Eventually Thurston signed for three more years at the Cowboys. 2015, 2016 and 2017. He is now in talks to extend his contract until the end of the 2018 season.
He is there for good.
Originally published as How the Bulldogs lost an Immortal
Ummmm our issue isn't identifying the talent. It's keeping the talent that we've signed up let go. Example Jt
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Way way off beam. We went close with Foran but couldnt find $1.2m a year. You are a miserable lot. Sherwin and Anasta won us the 2004 premiership. We were still over the cap. We had to shed Thurston to keep Sherwin. Anasta, Price, OMealey, Mason, Asotasi, upgrade SBW etc etc. Even if we kept Thurston at that time whos to say under Folkes then Moore that Thurston would have been the player he is today. Why does Thurston appear to have more time than most? ...because he stands deeper. His kicking game = Sherwins.
Even if Thurston had stayed in 2004, he would have played 2nd fiddle to Sherwin and Anasta...he wouldnt be the player he is today. I dont care we didnt keep Thurston. If he had found his feet despite playing 2nd fiddle, we would have lost him because of the cap around about 2007 anyway. Thurston is a great player because of his time spent with great players - Smith, Cronk, Inglis, Slater, etc etc.....the players around him give him time and space and make him look good. Now he is a confident senior player and makes other players look good. Some players keep getting better, like Michael Ennis, and some players inexplicably go off, like Anasta did in his later years.
Remember also the part he had played with Coffs Harbor. All in all, the club felt at the time it was better to move him on. There are many many kids constantly showing promise. I remember after 2 good games in a row earlier this year the Kennel was screaming for the club to do everything to keep Mbye. Now, because of the coaching, players around him and poor game plans he looks worse than useless. Who do we blame for the drop off of Mbyes form? Mbye?Des? Is he a future superstar? Would Belamy make him a superstar?Maybe!
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Folksey was never a coach/man manager ,should have stuck to being a trainer,very ordinary talent spotting there
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Im just glad he cleaned up his act. He was front and centre in the Coffs scandal. Its good to see him redeeming himself now. If you knew, like I do, what happened you wouldnt think the world of him. Like the club, I wont say anything more than that.
Dog Till I Die
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Doesn't mean it doesn't hurt any less.
Folkes singlehandedly took a premiership outfit and busted it wide open with a lack of respect. In turn, what did he expect? Even Mason called him out, said he was a fool.
Folkes is to the Bulldogs what Jason Taylor was to the Rabbitohs. A punching bag. Harder the better!
Bullfrog must still be turning in his grave!
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Anasta had nothing to do with it, it was Folkes.
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Thurston is not good enough to be an immortal.
This story will be brought up every time Thurston is in a grand final! Love it how Gus was so close to convincing him. Sam Ayoub wasn't letting Thurston think about the panthers deal. He was biding time to ring the cowboys that Penrith had made a huge offer and that the cowboys needed to up thurstons deal which equaled more commission! Everyone knows the managers only care is the commission they receive
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You guys also forget that Steve price ****ed us that year as well, dogs had allocated all this money to re-sign Price and the prick held off to the last minute only to sign with Warriors.
If dogs had known price was leaving they would have re-signed Thurston.
Ppl also forget Folkes was grooming Anasta to be lock and Thurston would have been our full time 5/8..
If dogs had known price was leaving they would have re-signed Thurston.
Ppl also forget Folkes was grooming Anasta to be lock and Thurston would have been our full time 5/8..
speedy2460
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Review of Bulldogs rape case
BY NEIL MERCER
THE SUNDAY TELEGRAPH
FEBRUARY 18, 2007 12:
THREE years after rape allegations shattered the Bulldogs, a detective has written a book exposing rifts in the investigation team that dogged the case.
The 100,000 word manuscript, by former detective senior sergeant Gary McEvoy, gives for the first time a detailed behind-the-scenes view of the investigation, police infighting and the extraordinary number of leaks to the media.
The case took a huge toll on police involved - nine of the 10 detectives in the Coffs Harbour office in 2004 are no longer there.
Some, like McEvoy, who is now mowing lawns for a living, have been discharged medically unfit. Others are awaiting discharge or are on long-term sick leave.
McEvoy told The Sunday Telegraph he wrote the day-by-day account to refute suggestions the inquiry was flawed.
It mounts a convincing case that Bulldogs players were falsely accused of sexual assault.
He told The Sunday Telegraph that initially officers had little doubt about the version of events given by the then 20-year-old woman who said she had been gang raped by six or seven players.
The woman told police on Sunday, February 22, 2004, the assault had happened about 6.30am that day in the pool of the Pacific Bay Resort in Coffs Harbour.
But some detectives soon questioned her story after it was contradicted by independent eyewitnesses. At the end of the inquiry, some even wanted her charged with making false allegations.
But McEvoy says Detective Chief Inspector Jason Breton, the Coffs Harbour crime manager, and the public face of the inquiry, vetoed the idea.
McEvoy reveals how investigators were shocked at the beginning of the case when 2GB's Ray Hadley read out the woman's graphic allegations.
They had been recorded on the NSW Police COPS computer system and then leaked.
McEvoy says in his manuscript, which he is hoping to get published: "The problem was the (COPS) report was based on untested allegations. Who knows, they could all be lies.''
He also believes that senior police in Sydney were apparently influenced by the media frenzy that accompanied the case.
On February 25, 2004, the head of forensic services, Superintendent Phil Flogel, had made contact.
McEvoy says Flogel explained "the allegations were 'red hot' news in Sydney and he had been advised to provide all assistance possible to us to clear the matter as quickly as possible''.
McEvoy says: "I was later told that many serious cases which had been waiting for some time ... were temporarily put to one side.
"This demonstrates the role of the media in setting police priorities. The sex allegations were of a high priority but I question whether a homicide investigation should be pushed to one side for the benefit of our case.''
According to McEvoy, who spent 23 years in the NSW Police, "troubling signs'' about the veracity of the woman's story emerged within three days.
"We were getting good evidence of an incident of consensual sex but not of a pack rape.
"In fact, we were getting nothing to suggest any crime had occurred at all.''
McEvoy says the woman's girlfriend had not backed her claims. The friend had been with one of the players in the resort that night. He says she was "far from supportive of the alleged victim.
"No specific reasons were given - but she appeared to hold some doubt over the victim's allegations.''
In addition, the alleged victim changed her story several times in the course of making several official statements.
McEvoy says such were the conflicts, police at one stage thought there must have been two incidents, one consensual and one rape. But the evidence did not stack up.
He says Insp Breton was told early on "that there were serious concerns about the authenticity of the allegations''.
"Despite the early warning signs, his aggressive media strategy continued unabated.''
As to the woman's motive for possibly making up the story, he says she had been insulted by one player some hours earlier.
She was again insulted just minutes after the alleged attack, with another player allegedly saying, "what the f*** are you doing here. I thought we got rid of you.''
McEvoy says Detective Leading Senior Constable Glen Pearce was second in charge of the investigation.
"Glen felt the victim had made a false report,'' he says.
"He also believed there was sufficient evidence to at least investigate her for 'make false allegation' or public mischief.''
McEvoy says that Pearce, who has also left the police force, put in a report stating, in part: "... I am concerned that politics and the media are playing a dominant role in police decision-making ...''
McEvoy says the police media unit arranged a photo of the Coffs Harbour detectives arriving in Sydney even though some of the officers were unhappy about being photographed.
Once, a briefing minute was prepared for the office of the deputy commissioner. It was faxed to the deputy and the northern region office.
"Within the hour, material contained within that document was in the hands of certain members of the media.''
He said he had asked senior police to stand up and say publicly the investigation was sound and demonstrably so. But none had supported the front-line officers.
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yes mate, and I don't thing the current ones are any smarter either
KelpiesHuskies
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folkes lost thurston, price and was the cause for sonny bill williams leaving with his remarks about his religion.
folkes should go down as the worst recruitment officer ever.
folkes should go down as the worst recruitment officer ever.
FreshSoulL
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Just found out this morning man
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You are technically correct. The best kind of correct.
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