Royal commission on catholic sex abuse

[CroydonDog]

Is it surprising? You see those in the trump thread who are shocked that liberals are protesting against trump and claim that it's because they are "sore losers". I'd think that there's a strong correlation to conservatives and an expectation to follow orders without fuss. So by all means not all of them, but I do understand why a majority of catholics are not piping up, the tendency to obey and the ignorance of the situation. Again this isn't quite outside the realms of normal human behaviour, it's understandable.

So in saying this, it is a duty and does fall down to the non-catholics who oppose this, to maintain pressure on the church.

There seems to be a lot of people who are happy to conform I guess. Don't rock the boat. But if society just did this, for example, unions would never have acted and lead to the reforms and safety issues people just take for granted, racism, sexism etc would be completely normalized is people didn't protest. Corruption would never be exposed. Protest is one of the cornerstones of a free society, whether you think the people are justified on their issue or not.

I read an article recently where a person was complaining about being drug tested for a job in which there were no safety issues that would require one. Most of the people commenting on the article all said "so what, I have to be drug tested" and "fair enough", and here was me thinking how did we get to the point where we just do what we're told by those in power? In no way would I hand my piss over to an employer without some serious justification.

I know there are people out there who will question authority. We just had a lively debate the other day about hospitals. But on so many issues, its all yes sir, no sir. Not that I want to drag the discussion over to Trump issues (there is a thread there already for that), but this whole "pipe down losers" bullshit is, well, bullshit. People have a right to be heard, whether from the left, right or centre.

Anyway, not sure how much more this topic can be exhausted until more developments occur in the Commission. I just hope some good can come of all of it.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Is it surprising? You see those in the trump thread who are shocked that liberals are protesting against trump and claim that it's because they are "sore losers". I'd think that there's a strong correlation to conservatives and an expectation to follow orders without fuss. So by all means not all of them, but I do understand why a majority of catholics are not piping up, the tendency to obey and the ignorance of the situation. Again this isn't quite outside the realms of normal human behaviour, it's understandable.

So in saying this, it is a duty and does fall down to the non-catholics who oppose this, to maintain pressure on the church.

It's a general aspect in any organisation or religion. You get passionate toward something and you defend it with bias because it's part of you. Oddly enough this happens more often if you don't have any monetary value towards it. For example, people who support a team without actually paying any financial value toward that team will more often than not support the team through thick and thin. People who pay money for memberships and sponsorship will be more likely to ridicule the team when they do something wrong.

This is why political volunteers are not paid. When you pay someone they lose some of the passion. It's basic psychological cognitive dissonance. It's seen especially strong in religion because you're never really paying to support the religion. Many don't donate and those that do don't feel that they're donating to the entire church system, only their local church or the needy. So they still hold that mindless passion for the organisation.

Another factor is that the bible tells you that the heads of the church are representatives of God. You stand against the church, you stand against God.

A 3rd factor is denial. People feel that the representatives of the church are the ultimate worshippers. If they are found to be fallible then what chance does the general public have. It's easier to ignore the sin than to accept that sin is strong enough to turn everyone.

 

[CaptainJackson]

There seems to be a lot of people who are happy to conform I guess. Don't rock the boat. But if society just did this, for example, unions would never have acted and lead to the reforms and safety issues people just take for granted, racism, sexism etc would be completely normalized is people didn't protest. Corruption would never be exposed. Protest is one of the cornerstones of a free society, whether you think the people are justified on their issue or not.

I read an article recently where a person was complaining about being drug tested for a job in which there were no safety issues that would require one. Most of the people commenting on the article all said "so what, I have to be drug tested" and "fair enough", and here was me thinking how did we get to the point where we just do what we're told by those in power? In no way would I hand my piss over to an employer without some serious justification.

I know there are people out there who will question authority. We just had a lively debate the other day about hospitals. But on so many issues, its all yes sir, no sir. Not that I want to drag the discussion over to Trump issues (there is a thread there already for that), but this whole "pipe down losers" bullshit is, well, bullshit. People have a right to be heard, whether from the left, right or centre.

Anyway, not sure how much more this topic can be exhausted until more developments occur in the Commission. I just hope some good can come of all of it.

Looking through history, I'd say it takes a core group of people to start up the opposition and to be in it for the long haul, and then you're always going to have people who are in and out as far as their support is concerned. But it really depends on that core group and them seeing it through.

Social norms are broken with just a handful of persistent people. Of course a reasonable argument is needed to convince others to support it.

And completely agree, protesting is a cornerstone of democracy, it's no different to corporate donors feeding politicians.

 

[CaptainJackson]

It's a general aspect in any organisation or religion. You get passionate toward something and you defend it with bias because it's part of you. Oddly enough this happens more often if you don't have any monetary value towards it. For example, people who support a team without actually paying any financial value toward that team will more often than not support the team through thick and thin. People who pay money for memberships and sponsorship will be more likely to ridicule the team when they do something wrong.

This is why political volunteers are not paid. When you pay someone they lose some of the passion. It's basic psychological cognitive dissonance. It's seen especially strong in religion because you're never really paying to support the religion. Many don't donate and those that do don't feel that they're donating to the entire church system, only their local church or the needy. So they still hold that mindless passion for the organisation.

Another factor is that the bible tells you that the heads of the church are representatives of God. You stand against the church, you stand against God.

A 3rd factor is denial. People feel that the representatives of the church are the ultimate worshippers. If they are found to be fallible then what chance does the general public have. It's easier to ignore the sin than to accept that sin is strong enough to turn everyone.

Yep, every individual is susceptible to confirmation bias/cognitive dissonance, part and parcel of being human.

Religion is a special case, I'd say more to down to the emotional investment in it, it's brainwashing and ideological mechanisms make it an actual trait of the individual, rather than being a separate entity, e.g. the soul of a human.

 

[Realist90]

You were going so well talking about tolerance etc, but then you had to put in this little dig...

But seriously folks, when I first bumped this thread it wasn't intended for a theological war - after all, every other thread that has gone down that path hasn't ended well (and has ususally been "ended" by mods).

I was more looking at the issues regarding child abuse and cover ups by people in a powerful organisation, one that relies on fear (and yes that includes the "fear of God") to get away with ruining lives.

Peace.

So it was you that bumped the thread lol. How typical.
I love in how one of your posts you're like "someone religious would get offended" obviously me you're talking about. But I love how you worded it as if only religious people get offended. Bitch you get offended if I fkn walk on an ant don't be talking like I'm so offended here, if you look at most of my posts here I'm in complete agreeance and want this mess dealt with.
What I have been defending is the doctrine of Catholicism itself, why the fuk would o be offended if people are talking of a priest who's touched a kid? He deserves everything he gets in this and the next life.

And Catholics aren't coming out? Are you like fkn blind and deaf? How many times does the pope the guy that represents the whole church needed to come out and talk out against the issue? We even got a fkn letter in the mail from the Catholic Church about it and how they've done wrong.
Please enlighten me on who exactly has defended these acts of evil? Or hasn't come out for your liking condemning the acts? Keep in mind the pope represents all Catholics pretty much.

P.s again just stop being a hypocrite and don't again say "someone religious will get offended" when yourself gets offended at anything and feels the need to always speak up especially when it's a post of written.

 

[Realist90]

Yep, every individual is susceptible to confirmation bias/cognitive dissonance, part and parcel of being human.

Religion is a special case, I'd say more to down to the emotional investment in it, it's brainwashing and ideological mechanisms make it an actual trait of the individual, rather than being a separate entity, e.g. the soul of a human.

Emotional investment aye? coming from someone so emotionally sensitive to people who haven't got your same views.
Another hypocritical post by a leftist.

 

[CroydonDog]

So it was you that bumped the thread lol. How typical.
I love in how one of your posts you're like "someone religious would get offended" obviously me you're talking about. But I love how you worded it as if only religious people get offended. Bitch you get offended if I fkn walk on an ant don't be talking like I'm so offended here, if you look at most of my posts here I'm in complete agreeance and want this mess dealt with.
What I have been defending is the doctrine of Catholicism itself, why the fuk would o be offended if people are talking of a priest who's touched a kid? He deserves everything he gets in this and the next life.

And Catholics aren't coming out? Are you like fkn blind and deaf? How many times does the pope the guy that represents the whole church needed to come out and talk out against the issue? We even got a fkn letter in the mail from the Catholic Church about it and how they've done wrong.
Please enlighten me on who exactly has defended these acts of evil? Or hasn't come out for your liking condemning the acts? Keep in mind the pope represents all Catholics pretty much.

P.s again just stop being a hypocrite and don't again say "someone religious will get offended" when yourself gets offended at anything and feels the need to always speak up especially when it's a post of written.

You do realise its not all about you?

Addressing your often indecipherable ramblings can be difficult and tihs is why I have asked you befoe not to engage with me, but your silly obsession continues.

So, here we go. I'll type this slowly so you can keep up.

1.

 

[Realist90]

You do realise its not all about you?

Addressing your often indecipherable ramblings can be difficult and tihs is why I have asked you befoe not to engage with me, but your silly obsession continues.

So, here we go. I'll type this slowly so you can keep up.

1.

When you're clearly talking about me, like you do in many other posts which you even directly mention my posts, be sure I will be there to reply to pull apart your hypocrisy.
Enough with your "I'm so intellectual" attitude. You're not that smart mate anyone who watches tv and reads mainstream articles has your exact same intellectual levels

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Time to offend everyone:

- God is real...

- ...Really fake

- Women deserve equal rights...

- ...Equal with animals

- South Sydney are a good team...

- ...Compared to Manly

- White people are superior...

- ....To pretty much no one at all

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Now fight!

 

[CaptainJackson]

Emotional investment aye? coming from someone so emotionally sensitive to people who haven't got your same views.
Another hypocritical post by a leftist.

I see once again aspects of my post have flown over your head.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

- Atheists are great...

- ...At being wrong about everything

- Everyone here sucks...

- ...Except for the ones that blow

 

[CaptainJackson]

So it was you that bumped the thread lol. How typical.
I love in how one of your posts you're like "someone religious would get offended" obviously me you're talking about. But I love how you worded it as if only religious people get offended. Bitch you get offended if I fkn walk on an ant don't be talking like I'm so offended here, if you look at most of my posts here I'm in complete agreeance and want this mess dealt with.
What I have been defending is the doctrine of Catholicism itself, why the fuk would o be offended if people are talking of a priest who's touched a kid? He deserves everything he gets in this and the next life.

And Catholics aren't coming out? Are you like fkn blind and deaf? How many times does the pope the guy that represents the whole church needed to come out and talk out against the issue? We even got a fkn letter in the mail from the Catholic Church about it and how they've done wrong.
Please enlighten me on who exactly has defended these acts of evil? Or hasn't come out for your liking condemning the acts? Keep in mind the pope represents all Catholics pretty much.

P.s again just stop being a hypocrite and don't again say "someone religious will get offended" when yourself gets offended at anything and feels the need to always speak up especially when it's a post of written.

Why hasn't he told Pell to return to Australia to face the Royal Commission?

 

[Realist90]

Why hasn't he told Pell to return to Australia to face the Royal Commission?

He already faced the royal commission was a big thing last year. It was on every mainstream news station how could you not have seen it?

 

[CroydonDog]

So it was you that bumped the thread lol. How typical.
I love in how one of your posts you're like "someone religious would get offended" obviously me you're talking about. But I love how you worded it as if only religious people get offended. Bitch you get offended if I fkn walk on an ant don't be talking like I'm so offended here, if you look at most of my posts here I'm in complete agreeance and want this mess dealt with.
What I have been defending is the doctrine of Catholicism itself, why the fuk would o be offended if people are talking of a priest who's touched a kid? He deserves everything he gets in this and the next life.

And Catholics aren't coming out? Are you like fkn blind and deaf? How many times does the pope the guy that represents the whole church needed to come out and talk out against the issue? We even got a fkn letter in the mail from the Catholic Church about it and how they've done wrong.
Please enlighten me on who exactly has defended these acts of evil? Or hasn't come out for your liking condemning the acts? Keep in mind the pope represents all Catholics pretty much.

P.s again just stop being a hypocrite and don't again say "someone religious will get offended" when yourself gets offended at anything and feels the need to always speak up especially when it's a post of written.

Sorry i'm not used to this small keyboard. Will retry...


You do realise its not all about you? (Rhetorical question in case you weren't sure).

I have been completely reasoned with pretty much every comment above in this thread today, but of course, you, my stalker would come out to try to make it personal.

Now, I know you aren't the sharpest knife in the Kennel drawer, so i'll type slowly for you (and I will try to get my points right in response as your sentences are so hard to read):

1. I bumped this thread because of the recent comments of the Royal Commission. It's a big story.
2. I have not attacked your beloved Catholicism, hell, I even asked others not to as it just upsets people, and now you're upset, or because you say "fkn lol" in your posts, you are acting cool about it.
3. I said "someone would get offended" in relation to how so many threads in the past have descended into shit because someone brought up religion (whether a believer or not). I used it in the past tense to refer to history on this site. Those who aren't so blinded will read that and understand completely. Again, it really in't about you.

As for Catholics coming out, at no stage have I said that nobody was speaking out. But as a collective those who can be a bit objective can see that the wheels of change will happen very slowly and with very little effect unfortunately. You got a letter? Wow, well then, that's that matter dealt with. The Royal Commission can now finish because the church wrote a letter.

You really need to calm your tits and perhaps play the ball and not the man. I am happy to accept the thoughts of others reading this thread as to where I have said anything hypocritical or incorrect. Would anyone care to comment?

I'm not claiming to be an "intellectual", just someone who thinks a bit before they open their mouth. If that, and considering others makes me a "PC brigadier", fuck, I'll wear the badge with pride, because the way you try to use such phrases as insults says a lot more about you than it does me.

One could stoop to your level I suppose and just throw insults around, but I'd rather not.

I have asked you not to engage with me. So why do you continue to do it? Sad. just so sad.

If you want to discuss the actual issue, then do so without getting butthurt. Or why don't you start your own thread about all the things you hate, and how you're right and everyone else is wrong (despite it being "just my opinion bro fkn lol").

 

[CroydonDog]

Why hasn't he told Pell to return to Australia to face the Royal Commission?

He did, by Skype. How gracious.

 

[CaptainJackson]

He already faced the royal commission was a big thing last year. It was on every mainstream news station how could you not have seen it?

Really? I mean really?

 

[Realist90]

Sorry i'm not used to this small keyboard. Will retry...


You do realise its not all about you? (Rhetorical question in case you weren't sure).

I have been completely reasoned with pretty much every comment above in this thread today, but of course, you, my stalker would come out to try to make it personal.

Now, I know you aren't the sharpest knife in the Kennel drawer, so i'll type slowly for you (and I will try to get my points right in response as your sentences are so hard to read):

1. I bumped this thread because of the recent comments of the Royal Commission. It's a big story.
2. I have not attacked your beloved Catholicism, hell, I even asked others not to as it just upsets people, and now you're upset, or because you say "fkn lol" in your posts, you are acting cool about it.
3. I said "someone would get offended" in relation to how so many threads in the past have descended into shit because someone brought up religion (whether a believer or not). I used it in the past tense to refer to history on this site. Those who aren't so blinded will read that and understand completely. Again, it really in't about you.

As for Catholics coming out, at no stage have I said that nobody was speaking out. But as a collective those who can be a bit objective can see that the wheels of change will happen very slowly and with very little effect unfortunately. You got a letter? Wow, well then, that's that matter dealt with. The Royal Commission can now finish because the church wrote a letter.

You really need to calm your tits and perhaps play the ball and not the man. I am happy to accept the thoughts of others reading this thread as to where I have said anything hypocritical or incorrect. Would anyone care to comment?

I'm not claiming to be an "intellectual", just someone who thinks a bit before they open their mouth. If that, and considering others makes me a "PC brigadier", fuck, I'll wear the badge with pride, because the way you try to use such phrases as insults says a lot more about you than it does me.

One could stoop to your level I suppose and just throw insults around, but I'd rather not.

I have asked you not to engage with me. So why do you continue to do it? Sad. just so sad.

If you want to discuss the actual issue, then do so without getting butthurt. Or why don't you start your own thread about all the things you hate, and how you're right and everyone else is wrong (despite it being "just my opinion bro fkn lol").

So you don't wanna lower yourself to my level by not throwing insults yet you've continued to insult my lack of intelligence therefore putting yourself above me in the realm of intelligence.
I'm not butthurt one bit about the actual issue of pedo priests not once have I defended nor tried to find a reason for why they've done it they're just evil.
If you don't want me to engage (gay word) with you, then in other threads don't mention my posts and then cry saying omg I didn't mention you.
you wanna talk being objective? Really coming from you? See what I mean. This is where you're a typical leftist. You say shit that you want people to do yet you don't fkn do it when it's your own opinion being questioned.

I used the letter as an example of a way they're talking out against the wrong they've done. There many more organisations and religions who don't even go to these lengths on much worse cases so sit down a bit.

P.s one example of you being a hypocrite is saying I use insults and that you won't "stoop" to that level yet you did. Wait is that irony I'm confused.

 

[Realist90]

He did, by Skype. How gracious.

Unfortunately you're a nobody no matter what you think is gracious or not doesn't really matter in the realm of reality. That's what I think you need to understand but fail to understand.

 

[Realist90]

Really? I mean really?

Ok if he comes what is it gonna change? Do you just want an excuse to protest outside a mans house?