Climate Change

belmore_utd

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The thing that shocks me most is that China has more renewable energy per capita than most other countries. They're leading the world in renewables. And per capita, them and India don't use much. Australia smashes them in emissions per capita.

You should know this though. As you always seem to know more than the doctors, and the climate scientists, and all experts. Honestly, they should just give you the Nobel prize for arguing against the experts on everything.
And you just nod your head in agreeableness with chat gpt like a good little goyim.

Lol you trust Chinese data?
They are not even transparent about demographics let alone heavy industry capacity ffs

If you really truly believed in it to the extent you cry about it then you would acknowledge that China has more carbon emissions than the entire developed world combined.
The environment doesn't give a shit about per capita emissions.
Just like poor and struggling CDN's give a shit about regular macroeconomic metrics like gdp to debt ratios.

On one of the hottest countries on the planet that is sparcely populated at the arsehole end of the world where exports and imports are counted in carbon emissions, Australia is providing mining minerals and farm exports that are relied upon and transported vast distances and should be given (carbon) credit for doing so, not punished.

Yeah we should all follow China and India's lead everyone and have most of the labour force living in abject poverty and squalor that'll lower co2. Climate solved
 

Hacky McAxe

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And you just nod your head in agreeableness with chat gpt like a good little goyim.

Lol you trust Chinese data?
They are not even transparent about demographics let alone heavy industry capacity ffs

If you really truly believed in it to the extent you cry about it then you would acknowledge that China has more carbon emissions than the entire developed world combined.
The environment doesn't give a shit about per capita emissions.
Just like poor and struggling CDN's give a shit about regular macroeconomic metrics like gdp to debt ratios.

On one of the hottest countries on the planet that is sparcely populated at the arsehole end of the world where exports and imports are counted in carbon emissions, Australia is providing mining minerals and farm exports that are relied upon and transported vast distances and should be given (carbon) credit for doing so, not punished.

Yeah we should all follow China and India's lead everyone and have most of the labour force living in abject poverty and squalor that'll lower co2. Climate solved
China is 29% of the global emissions. If they were true that "China has more carbon emissions than the entire developed world combined" then they'd have to have at least 45% if the emissions as the non-developed world takes up bugger all.

Your last paragraph seems to show a weird level of cognitive dissonance. You're complaining that China and India are the highest emitters, even though each person in China and India emits less than half of what each Australian emits. And you criticise them for poverty. But you want them to emit less meaning that every person in China and India would be even deeper in poverty.

China and India's problem is that they have large population in small space compared to Australia. You say per capita doesn't matter, yet 98% of Australia is unpopulated. Do you really want to count the emissions by land mass including the unpopulated deserts?

Seriously dude. This is why I criticise you for ignoring all of the experts and thinking you know better. You don't even have the first bit of understanding of the problem yet you think you know more than everyone else.

I'll openly admit that I know fuck all. I spent years studying earth sciences and I still know fuck all. But I know how greenhouse gases work. I know the basics of how earth system works. With my limited knowledge, I know man induced climate change is real. The rest I leave up to the experts because I know that I don't know 1% of what they know.
 

speedy2460

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Tim Flannery is one person. He's also a sign of bad government policy. He's not a climate scientist.
Agree. Neither is AL Gore, but they both made a considerable income from promoting this farce.
 

TwinTurbo

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China is 29% of the global emissions. If they were true that "China has more carbon emissions than the entire developed world combined" then they'd have to have at least 45% if the emissions as the non-developed world takes up bugger all.

Your last paragraph seems to show a weird level of cognitive dissonance. You're complaining that China and India are the highest emitters, even though each person in China and India emits less than half of what each Australian emits. And you criticise them for poverty. But you want them to emit less meaning that every person in China and India would be even deeper in poverty.

China and India's problem is that they have large population in small space compared to Australia. You say per capita doesn't matter, yet 98% of Australia is unpopulated. Do you really want to count the emissions by land mass including the unpopulated deserts?
You have touched on the real issue with fighting Climate Change, no one can stop 3rd world countries (and/or portions on their population) wanting to become 1st world. Firstly it's immoral to say you can't have what we have, and secondly it's impossible to enforce.

Just an example, access to refrigeration is considered one of the most important measures of a country's progress out of 3rd world conditions. Around 220 million Chinese do not have access to refrigeration, in India it's around 955 million, that requires electricity with China building 100 new coal fired power stations this year and India 40. That's why comparing emissions by population is a furphy when not all of the population has access to emissions producing appliances. In India 100% of its emissions are produced by ~30% of its population, statistics at work.

Comparing a country's CO2 emission by population is nothing more than a measure of its development and as China and India continue to develop their emissions by person will ultimately increase. The fact is China is currently #1 in CO2 emissions and India is #3 and by 2030 China is projected to produce over 50% of the world's CO2 emissions. Based on population India, with a large % of its population currently underdeveloped, will eventually surpass China as the world's #1 emitter.


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Natboy

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What percentage of global emissions does Australia contribute? How do our power bills compare to other countries? What difference will Australia make to global warming by putting in wind turbines everywhere?
 

John Matrix

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What percentage of global emissions does Australia contribute? How do our power bills compare to other countries? What difference will Australia make to global warming by putting in wind turbines everywhere?
Was about 1% iirc
 

Doogie

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So I live in a long cul-de-sac but at the end of it, there's a mechanic with 3 kids with hotted up cars. These kids smash out of the street at 30-40km above the speed limit, its only a matter of time before they smash into someone or something.

So should I drive 30-40km above the speed limit as well? Would save me a few minutes in travel time. And I only drive in and out once a day. These kids are in and out multiple times per day.

How do I turn to them and tell them they need to slow down if I'm busting the speed limit?

This is not a difficult argument.
 

Cook

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Wow is that it? The world must be laughing at us when that’s all our prime minister ever talks about on his junkets
Pathetic hey. Sick of hearing about the shit. We all know China don’t give a f—k, so why should we. I get more annoyed seeing pigs leave there rubbish behind along our waterways. Send these lazy pricks to jail I reckon.
 

Natboy

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Pathetic hey. Sick of hearing about the shit. We all know China don’t give a f—k, so why should we. I get more annoyed seeing pigs leave there rubbish behind along our waterways. Send these lazy pricks to jail I reckon.
I’m all for reducing our impact on the environment but surely we can concentrate on practices that don’t force our power bills to be ridiculously high and windmills ruining properties & views etc. It’s got out of hand but the young people are so brainwashed now that’s what they’ll vote for unfortunately
 

Hacky McAxe

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You have touched on the real issue with fighting Climate Change, no one can stop 3rd world countries (and/or portions on their population) wanting to become 1st world. Firstly it's immoral to say you can't have what we have, and secondly it's impossible to enforce.

Just an example, access to refrigeration is considered one of the most important measures of a country's progress out of 3rd world conditions. Around 220 million Chinese do not have access to refrigeration, in India it's around 955 million, that requires electricity with China building 100 new coal fired power stations this year and India 40. That's why comparing emissions by population is a furphy when not all of the population has access to emissions producing appliances. In India 100% of its emissions are produced by ~30% of its population, statistics at work.

Comparing a country's CO2 emission by population is nothing more than a measure of its development and as China and India continue to develop their emissions by person will ultimately increase. The fact is China is currently #1 in CO2 emissions and India is #3 and by 2030 China is projected to produce over 50% of the world's CO2 emissions. Based on population India, with a large % of its population currently underdeveloped, will eventually surpass China as the world's #1 emitter.


Always a Bulldog
That's a good point. Especially in India where the caste system leads to massive polarisation. We also can't control population or poverty in other countries. I once copped a ban from Facebook because someone asked me the most effective way to stop climate change, and I said, "obviously it's not an option, but the quickest way would be to nuke China"

The issue I have with Australians pushing climate denial isn't because we have a large impact on climate change (we don't), it's because:

1) it makes us look bad on the global scale. When ScoMo served as PM, Australia were seen as a climate villain. Even China were laughing at us because they are way ahead of us in the transition to renewables (51% VS 32%)

2) we have the resources to become a renewable export powerhouse. But we refuse to because we would rather delay the inevitable death of coal as the primary resource. We could be future proofing the Australian economy, but we won't

We rely on China for a large amount of our energy exports. With China transitioning faster than any other country, eventually they won't need our resources. Which means that we'll sell coal to 3rd world countries for 10% of our current sale value. By then it will be too late to transition our economic system.
 

Hacky McAxe

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Wow is that it? The world must be laughing at us when that’s all our prime minister ever talks about on his junkets
Other way around. Australia has been heavily criticised for not doing enough. ScoMo's stance almost got us kicked out of COP

 

Hacky McAxe

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Pathetic hey. Sick of hearing about the shit. We all know China don’t give a f—k, so why should we. I get more annoyed seeing pigs leave there rubbish behind along our waterways. Send these lazy pricks to jail I reckon.
Percentage of energy from renewables:

Australia = 32% Renewables
China = 51% Renewables
 

Natboy

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Hacky McAxe

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I’m all for reducing our impact on the environment but surely we can concentrate on practices that don’t force our power bills to be ridiculously high and windmills ruining properties & views etc. It’s got out of hand but the young people are so brainwashed now that’s what they’ll vote for unfortunately
Climate policy is never very good. It's like most government policies. It's more about looking like you're doing the right thing, rather than doing the right thing.

Albo could introduce policy that advances climate policy of Australia in actual effective ways, but he wouldn't benefit from it. The next PM would. No Australian PM will do anything that may benefit the next PM.
 

Natboy

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Percentage of energy from renewables:

Australia = 32% Renewables
China = 51% Renewables
If you do a side by side bar chart of that and then add actual total emissions it would be crazy though
 

Hacky McAxe

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I wish we got kicked out of COP. Scott Morrison hasn’t been the prime minister since May 2022
If we got kicked out of COP that would be the end of the Australian economy. We would cop (pun) massive cuts to trade. Australia would become the country that no one wants to touch.
 

Natboy

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Climate policy is never very good. It's like most government policies. It's more about looking like you're doing the right thing, rather than doing the right thing.

Albo could introduce policy that advances climate policy of Australia in actual effective ways, but he wouldn't benefit from it. The next PM would. No Australian PM will do anything that may benefit the next PM.
I agree but Albo won’t be in power for our net zero target
 

Natboy

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If we got kicked out of COP that would be the end of the Australian economy. We would cop (pun) massive cuts to trade. Australia would become the country that no one wants to touch.
I doubt it. I thought it was all about trade with China. They would still trade with us
 
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