News Why Phil Gould knocked back Canterbury Bulldogs

Spoonman84

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Phil Gould knocked back the Bulldogs because he felt that he couldn’t fix the club in only three years.

He’s also fairly happy working with the Warriors.

But it’s the first point that should be treated with interest – and a dose of grim reality – by Bulldogs fans.

Much like the Sharks making a play for Craig Bellamy to be their GM of football, you can’t knock Canterbury management for pitching to Gould to take over the entire football department.

Coach Trent Barrett could see the upside in having Gould helping to pull-in managers, sign players and align the pathways programs.

Yes, Gould ultimately knocked Canterbury back. But so what?

It happens.

The stealth-like pitch at least indicates the club isn’t satisfied with its four wins in the past 16 months and is prepared to look under every rock to fix it.

Striving for a higher standard, a level of expertise and support for incoming Sharks coach Craig Fitzgibbon is also why Cronulla won’t close the door on Bellamy coming to the club in 2023 – even if he re-signs with the Storm for next season, as the entire rugby league world expects.

Where the Dogs stuffed up is not so much the offer to Gould, but the time frame. And the irony is, the Bulldogs know it.

Three years isn’t long enough to turn a footy club around. Sure, you can make a dent, but cleaning up a roster can take years.

The Dragons, Broncos, Wests Tigers, Knights and Titans, to name just a few, still aren’t settled after more than five years of roster mismanagement.

You wonder what Gould would’ve said if the Dogs had offered him an open-ended contract?

We’ll never know.

Gould would be aware of the same home truths that Dogs management have been impressing on members in recent weeks.

The narrative has been that the Dogs hierarchy want wins just as badly and as quickly as the fans do.

The signing of Matt Burton, Brent Naden and Josh Addo-Carr will help that cause.

But the Bulldogs realise that those three players alone won’t return long-term success for a club that wants to play finals football every year.

There’ll be no shortcuts, that’s what is being said – even though the possible recruitment of a 30-year-old Shaun Johnson, on the back of a major Achilles injury, seems exactly that.

Tough conversations will be had at the Dogs during a football committee meeting on Tuesday.

That’s where Johnson – and issues such as how to sign Storm hooker Brandon Smith for 2023 – will be discussed.

One tough discussion has already been had. The possible release of Dallin Watene-Zelezniak – the club’s best player this year – to the Wests Tigers is part of the conversation that points to how much work the Dogs still need to do.

Like the play for Gould, at least they’re working on a solution.

‘DWZ’ is on an impossible-to-believe contract worth around $880,000.

That’s a salary worth more than what representative players Jack Wighton and Jake Trbojevic are earning and Watene-Zelezniak has played six games at fullback and three on the wing this season.

He sure is one lucky guy.

The fact Canterbury are prepared to wear half of his salary on their cap next year is another telltale sign to fans that the Dogs are prepared to take the longest road to the top.

Gould might be right though – it could take longer than three years.

 

B-Train

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The media really love pushing the narrative that it will take ten years til we're competitive again. With the right signings we could be a top four team within two to three years. So I don't buy any of that shit.
 

c-b-b

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It might take 5 years to fix things like junior pathways but it shouldn’t take that long to fix this team. It will take smart recruitment and an eye for talent, I don’t feel people in our recruitment team have that.

If it does players like Burton and JAC will come then leave.
 

Spoonman84

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The media really love pushing the narrative that it will take ten years til we're competitive again. With the right signings we could be a top four team within two to three years. So I don't buy any of that shit.
Not if we don’t have pathways in place which it sounds like we don’t. You can’t buy a full roster. We probably won’t be as bad as we are but competing for comps is what it’s all about and we are light years off that.
 

B-Train

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Why would it take longer than 3 years?
How is it that we did it in 2012 ?
We just need a couple of good signings and will be right.
Exactly. We went from the wooden spoon to minor premiers and grand finalists in one season so fortunes can change quickly..

Not that long ago Parra won numerous spoons and the last few years they've been a top 4 or 6 team.

We've been "rebuilding" for five seasons already. With some decent signings in the next two years we could easily be a top four team.
 

B-Train

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Not if we don’t have pathways in place which it sounds like we don’t. You can’t buy a full roster. We probably won’t be as bad as we are but competing for comps is what it’s all about and we are light years off that.
Both the previous and current administrations have focused on junior development and consequently we've had our best batch of Flegg, Ball and Matts juniors in a decade or more.

As long as the best juniors are retained and most importantly developed and coached well to reach their potential in FG (a problem under Des) then we should be fine. But I agree, you need several juniors in your best 17 to build a team properly.
 

Spoonman84

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Both the previous and current administrations have focused on junior development and consequently we've had our best batch of Flegg, Ball and Matts juniors in a decade or more.

As long as the best juniors are retained and most importantly developed and coached well to reach their potential in FG (a problem under previous Des) then we should be fine. But I agree, you need several juniors in your best 17 to build a team properly.
Having a good batch of junior reps doesn’t necessarily equate to opening a premiership window. It depends on their position and what we already have to see if it all fits. We badly need to sort out 3/4 of our spine and at the minute only Averillo might be able to solve one spot and that’s a big maybe. If we have to go to the market and buy 3 spine players we will have to be very smart about building the roster.

I really hope there’s no truth to DWZ’s salary too because if it’s real you’d have to question who else the previous admin over payed.
 

bradyk

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There's no reason why we can't be a team in and around the eight for the next 3 years, but that's only if we nail recruitment, if we look at our recruitment this year and how that's turned out (it's turned out we had better options coming through the club, so we're wasting more salary cap) if we back that up again next year (JAC and Burton not enough) we're just going to dig the hole even deeper and it'll be another cycle of being in the bottom 4 (as an average, yes we might finish 9th-12th once or twice). You need good players coming through (we have some) and you need to buy experience (not at the end of their careers, still in form to help with development) or the best of the best around them (not blocking pathways), not reject signings (we've made a stack of them).

Now being a top 4 team that can challenge for a premiership, that's about 5 years away and only if we get everything right (which you can probably already say we haven't). My position as a fan I don't want to be the team that can win a premiership every year (I wouldn't say no to it), but I'd rather be a consistent top 8 team that can win it (at least have the chance, make a GF) once every few or so years (what we had under Des). We're a long way away from that atm.
 

B-Train

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Having a good batch of junior reps doesn’t necessarily equate to opening a premiership window. It depends on their position and what we already have to see if it all fits. We badly need to sort out 3/4 of our spine and at the minute only Averillo might be able to solve one spot and that’s a big maybe. If we have to go to the market and buy 3 spine players we will have to be very smart about building the roster.

I really hope there’s no truth to DWZ’s salary too because if it’s real you’d have to question who else the previous admin over payed.
No of course not. But it helps you build a roster as generally your rookie juniors are on modest salaries and it let's you spend more on the rest of the team.

Ideally Rajab and Alamoti are playing FG within two years and Another couple of juniors step up.. It's the development of these kids that is pivotal to our future success.

It's the cap management and signing players that we want to move on after half a season that has been the issue under three different administrations and four different coaches. Until vital roster spots and cap space stops being wasted on poor signings, we won't contend regardless of how good our juniors are.
 

Spoonman84

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No of course not. But it helps you build a roster as generally your rookie juniors are on modest salaries and it let's you spend more on the rest of the team.

Ideally Rajab and Alamoti are playing FG within two years and Another couple of juniors step up.. It's the development of these kids that is pivotal to our future success.

It's the cap management and signing players that we want to move on after half a season that has been the issue under three different administrations and four different coaches. Until vital roster spots and cap space stops being wasted on poor signings, we won't contend regardless of how good our juniors are.
I agree with all of that but who is looking after the junior development and pathways now? Are they just staying stagnant waiting for the new football manager? All this adds to the timeframe.

We need to grow the junior base so that we aren’t relying on only one of two players to kick on and that’s our problem at the minute. Juniors don’t kick on for so many reasons so the bigger the pool we have the more our chances of success increase.

The club just has to sort its shit out get a Football Manager in place ASAP.
 

EzyB

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I agree with all of that but who is looking after the junior development and pathways now? Are they just staying stagnant waiting for the new football manager? All this adds to the timeframe.

We need to grow the junior base so that we aren’t relying on only one of two players to kick on and that’s our problem at the minute. Juniors don’t kick on for so many reasons so the bigger the pool we have the more our chances of success increase.

The club just has to sort its shit out get a Football Manager in place ASAP.
The juniors are actually in good hands, and when we are talking about juniors I’m talking about local comps.
 

Spoonman84

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The juniors are actually in good hands, and when we are talking about juniors I’m talking about local comps.
Yeah JK can take a lot of the credit for that when he was a board member. I’m not sure why the club has such a big problem getting the pathways sorted to be honest.
 

EzyB

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Yeah JK can take a lot of the credit for that when he was a board member. I’m not sure why the club has such a big problem getting the pathways sorted to be honest.
Yeah true.
 

wendog33

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Give Gould a 5 year contract with club option thereafter.

Realisticly 3 years is not enough. Anyone who takes a professional pride in their outcomes, wants to see the job through to fruition. We want that kind of person to oversee a huge job of scouting and recruitment, not to mention fully developing the home grown talent we have. That has been a huge fail at the club for decades really.

We need to start this rebuild back to ascendancy from the top down.

Board appear competent at last but football dept seems rudderless.

We need Gus' presence, and stature in the game, if we possibly can secure him.
 

chisdog

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The media really love pushing the narrative that it will take ten years til we're competitive again. With the right signings we could be a top four team within two to three years. So I don't buy any of that shit.
Exactly. If we were to get a decent hooker & couple of quality props we can make the 8 based on the signings we already have for next year, barring injuries. Astute signings is the key.
 
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