When will it end!?

[KLil]

Its becoming a worrying trend that we are starting to see alot of young players whom have been raised and groomed within certain teams
and as soon as they are noticed, the money comes in and they want releases. Sound familiar?

We see whats onfolding first hand at the dogs with interstate players wanting to go back home and now we see it happening in Canberra with Anthony Milford. Is it time for someone and step in and do something about it or what??

In my opinion there is a simple solution.... There should be a transfer fee in place for certain players when they are contracted to the club when they are young. Once that player wants to leave the club the team that wants to buy him has to pay the club the player is contracted to a fee..

For example

Ben Barba goes to broncos - Broncos pay bulldogs a transfer fee of $100,000 ( this can also be added to salary caps as an incentive for breeding young footballers )

This in my view is compensation for the ex-contracted team and will help deter teams from poaching these players.


What do u reckon?? Cause i think the system is to unfair atm.

 

[Aristidiz]

I've always thought the NRL should introduce a draft and trading system similar to the NBA in America.

Not only will it make the competition more competitive from teams 1 - 16 but it makes 'grooming' young players a non-issue.

At the end of the day sport is entertainment, watching teams flog Parra by 40+ points every week is not entertaining (although many on here would argue otherwise haha).

If Paramatta were to be awarded the #1 draft pick at the end of this season for example and drafted someone like a young Thurston and contracted him for 3 years, by the end of the 2nd year the club could talk with his manager and decide on his future. If he was to look elsewhere for more money/homesickness/etc the club would have the opportunity to trade him, or otherwise risk losing him for nothing. In the end both the club and player have an equal opportunity to determine their future success.

There's a lot more to the NBA's system including several trade exceptions, sign and trade options, ammensty provisions etc. In short it is quite complex. But if the NRL wants to make this game as polished in terms of viewability and entertainment as other sports around the world, they have to make substantial changes in how the game is run at several levels.

 

[jon50n]

Totally agree with the draft and trading system, something needs to be done because as a fan I'm starting to lose what remaining faith I have with the NRL and their lack of leadership skills ...

 

[boggie23]

A draft system won't work as clubs invest in juniors these days. If there was a draft why would the dogs field an under 15,16,18 team when at the end of the day any good juniors will be selected by clubs struggling.

At the end of the day of Barba wants to go we can negotiate with broncos for a release fee. I think we just hit them up for a million or he can wait til 2016 to join them. If they really want him now then they should do what dogs want. A player swap never works out good. So I would rather a financial sum that we can use towards training facilities or scouting out juniors.

There was a system in place in 1992 but that was overturned in the high court as it forced players to move to places they didnt want to.

If we can't get players happy to play for the clubs now that it is 100% their decision to sign with those clubs in the first place what will make you think they will happily go to a team that may be interstate and going poorly.

Draft works in America as the players come from college/high school and have no club affiliation. Won't work here.

If players want to break a contract the club either gets their demands or the player sits out unpaid til contract ends. Or the other option is they play out the legal contract they signed and leave once the terms in that contract have been satisfied.

Broncos seem to be on a rampage to entice players to join them lately.

 

[Aristidiz]

A draft system won't work as clubs invest in juniors these days. If there was a draft why would the dogs field an under 15,16,18 team when at the end of the day any good juniors will be selected by clubs struggling.

At the end of the day of Barba wants to go we can negotiate with broncos for a release fee. I think we just hit them up for a million or he can wait til 2016 to join them. If they really want him now then they should do what dogs want. A player swap never works out good. So I would rather a financial sum that we can use towards training facilities or scouting out juniors.

There was a system in place in 1992 but that was overturned in the high court as it forced players to move to places they didnt want to.

If we can't get players happy to play for the clubs now that it is 100% their decision to sign with those clubs in the first place what will make you think they will happily go to a team that may be interstate and going poorly.

Draft works in America as the players come from college/high school and have no club affiliation. Won't work here.

If players want to break a contract the club either gets their demands or the player sits out unpaid til contract ends. Or the other option is they play out the legal contract they signed and leave once the terms in that contract have been satisfied.

Broncos seem to be on a rampage to entice players to join them lately.

Clubs field under 15, 16 & 18 teams to win in the same way teams field first grade teams, to win games. I don't see your point? The draft and trade system doesn't have to be a duplicate of the American one.

The AFL uses the system well. Talent should be spread across teams throughout the NRL.

Clubs like Melbourne shouldn't be able to keep flooding into their first grade squads quality juniors like they are, while clubs situated in more saturated areas like Western Sydney struggle to find high calibre juniors without having to recruit them from interstate and overseas.

 

[GrogDog]

Quite simply for now I think that a contract is a contract which should be enforced with a case by case basis on releases. Was watching a interview about Milford and it had his mum on it, turns out his dad had a heart attack 18months ago and is now on a weekly check. Please don't call me heartless (no pun intended) but come on I feel for the family but 18 months ago and now on check ups, hardly a reason for an immediate release! I think young players are going where ever they need to, get noticed then chase the money and then use beefed up hardship reasons as the excuse to move back where they wanted to in the first place. Just not on IMO and I see straight through it.

 

[Indiandog]

why not give special concession in salary cap for clubs developing and trying to retain their juniors.

 

[Aristidiz]

Quite simply for now I think that a contract is a contract which should be enforced with a case by case basis on releases. Was watching a interview about Milford and it had his mum on it, turns out his dad had a heart attack 18months ago and is now on a weekly check. Please don't call me heartless (no pun intended) but come on I feel for the family but 18 months ago and now on check ups, hardly a reason for an immediate release! I think young players are going where ever they need to, get noticed then chase the money and then use beefed up hardship reasons as the excuse to move back where they wanted to in the first place. Just not on IMO and I see straight through it.

Good point. The NRL's soft stance on guys like Sonny Bill doesn't help the issue either. The bloke clearly ridiculed not only the Bulldogs but the entire by leaving literally over night mid-contract without notice, and is given a red-carpet entrance back into the NRL only years later.

I'm hoping Greenberg instills some testciles into the commission.

 

[Indiandog]

Good point. The NRL's soft stance on guys like Sonny Bill doesn't help the issue either. The bloke clearly ridiculed not only the Bulldogs but the entire by leaving literally over night mid-contract without notice, and is given a red-carpet entrance back into the NRL only years later.

I'm hoping Greenberg instills some testciles into the commission.

If you have talents like SBW.... i guess you will always be bigger than NRL, it was hard for me too to accept this truth.... sadly this is how the world is these days.

 

[boggie23]

Clubs field under 15, 16 & 18 teams to win in the same way teams field first grade teams, to win games. I don't see your point? The draft and trade system doesn't have to be a duplicate of the American one.

The AFL uses the system well. Talent should be spread across teams throughout the NRL.

Clubs like Melbourne shouldn't be able to keep flooding into their first grade squads quality juniors like they are, while clubs situated in more saturated areas like Western Sydney struggle to find high calibre juniors without having to recruit them from interstate and overseas.

The thing is that clubs invest in players from a young age. Some clubs sign players up from 12-15 years old etc. If we use barba as an example he came to the dogs, we accommodated him for a brief period (before he got his own unit), put him through our under 18s academy, we invested a large sum of money to bring him in, set him up and bulk him/coach him. For him to get selected to go to another club is a waste of that effort. Clubs will stop investing in juniors. What is the point in spending millions of dollars to have a football district run, having rep team, having junior teams when you wont have any of the players come through, because once the draft comes along they are up for grabs.

What needs to happen for your system to work is clubs only have a 1st grade and reserve grade team. So that will pull all the funding out of juniors who are 14, 15 etc years old. Players like Sonny Bill, Thurston, Idris, Barba, Klemmer, Reynolds who came through our academies (under 15, under 18, under 21's/20) wouldnt have played for the club unless we had a draft pick and they were available.

The draft failed in 1992. Unless the under 18s comp is funded by the NRL and there are no club affiliations then it can mean clubs have a reserve team, 1st grade team and under 20s team. But with a system like that there will be fewer professional players coming through (even if each team selects 3-4 new recruits that is only 64 players, there are currently over 450 registered under 20s players)

 

[GrogDog]

I keep saying it but if the nrl actually enforced contracts then players would know to not even bother asking for a release unless its life or death reasons. problem solved!

 

[gibbo2]

Lets not complicate it to much. Teams should be rewarded for identifying and nurturing talent. Maybe a discount system in he salary cap for players who played 20's of under for that club

 

[Chrisaaar]

how about, a contract is a contract, if a player is unhappy wants to move etc, npz, the club cuts the salary by half and the player sits out remainder of contract, if the player still unhappy and complains more - tough shit.

 

[Aristidiz]

The thing is that clubs invest in players from a young age. Some clubs sign players up from 12-15 years old etc. If we use barba as an example he came to the dogs, we accommodated him for a brief period (before he got his own unit), put him through our under 18s academy, we invested a large sum of money to bring him in, set him up and bulk him/coach him. For him to get selected to go to another club is a waste of that effort. Clubs will stop investing in juniors. What is the point in spending millions of dollars to have a football district run, having rep team, having junior teams when you wont have any of the players come through, because once the draft comes along they are up for grabs.

What needs to happen for your system to work is clubs only have a 1st grade and reserve grade team. So that will pull all the funding out of juniors who are 14, 15 etc years old. Players like Sonny Bill, Thurston, Idris, Barba, Klemmer, Reynolds who came through our academies (under 15, under 18, under 21's/20) wouldnt have played for the club unless we had a draft pick and they were available.

The draft failed in 1992. Unless the under 18s comp is funded by the NRL and there are no club affiliations then it can mean clubs have a reserve team, 1st grade team and under 20s team. But with a system like that there will be fewer professional players coming through (even if each team selects 3-4 new recruits that is only 64 players, there are currently over 450 registered under 20s players)

The NRL Commission obviously needs to standup and make it work. They need to fund junior football in this country and not rely on individual clubs financing it through merchandise sales and leagues clubs. I don't agree with the notion that these junior teams have to be unaffiliated with any club.

At the end of the day, kids play Rugby League to have fun, if they are good enough they will realise that they have an opportunity to be drafted into the NRL and will pursue it and play.

Each NRL club will have scouts attending these junior games in the same way they do currently.

In regards to the idea you expressed about not having enough players to choose from, I disagree. There is no reason why a system cannot be put in place with countries like Papua New Guinea and New Zealand that would allow players to be drafted from there. Also, in organisations such as the National Basketball League it is not uncommon for clubs to draft players that they know won't be ready to play for 2-3 years (or longer in some cases). I see no reason why NRL clubs, should they choose to take the risk, couldn't do the same and take a gamble on talent.

 

[KLil]

Transfer fee for developed players + Incentive in salary cap = Solved!

 

[N4TE]

Ben Barba goes to broncos - Broncos pay bulldogs a transfer fee of $100,000 ( this can also be added to salary caps as an incentive for breeding young footballers )

What do u reckon?? Cause i think the system is to unfair atm.

If this was the case The Dogs bank account would make an Arab oil Sheik look poor..

 

[N4TE]

how about, a contract is a contract, if a player is unhappy wants to move etc, npz, the club cuts the salary by half and the player sits out remainder of contract, if the player still unhappy and complains more - tough shit.

This..

 

[no1bulldog]

there used to be a player draft but it was taken to court by a player (Terry Hill) and ruled to be a restriction of trade and was canned......

Hill became embroiled in the "External and Internal Draft" system in the 1991 season when, after agreeing to a playing and employment deal with the Western Suburbs Magpies, he was drafted from the Internal Draft pool by Eastern Suburbs. Hill's initial appeal was overturned and he eventually agreed to a three year contract with Easts. By the end of 1991 the High Court had overturned the draft system and in 1992 Hill was given a release and he was able to move on to Western Suburbs Magpies.[SUP][/SUP]

 

[Hacky McAxe]

It's a difficult prospect looking for a better solution. If you set up a draft then you risk losing good players to other codes. Imagine if a young warriors player is told he has been drafted to Penrith.

A transfer fee is always a good option, and you could set it outside the salary cap but then it could become a hitch in negotiations. What if an average player wants to leave because he's not getting a chance in first grade and another club wants to give him that chance. Club A has no use for the player and would normally let him go but won't let him leave until they get some money for it. Club B is not going to offer money and you're stuck with a Peter Wallace.

I think these things just need to be sorted fast. Milford has officially asked for a release. Canberra can say yes or no and that's done. If they want to hold on to him then don't let him go. If he doesn't put the effort in out of spite then dump him to the NSW cup/QLD cup and watch his career die, or just sue him for breach of contract.

 

[Allan]

There is more than one issue here and trying to solve all of them with one change won't work. Firstly, rugby league is a tribal game supported and financed by fans who are organised into tribes. This is a problem when you have participants including coaches and players who are playing for wages, not for tribal honour. If you are playing for wages/home comfort/convenience/fame etc you are fundamentally in conflict with fans. Fans are irrational on so many levels. We will follow a team even if they are crap. We reserve the right to complain but we will be there.

Rugby League administrators say it is a professional sport and is "entertainment". For the sake of the entertainment they want every supporter to believe that their team is a chance to win every weekend. Again that is a fundamental conflict with coaches and club administrators who are paid to ensure that the team wins every weekend. The rugby league powerbrokers implemented a salary cap to even out the competition and achieve their goal of creating equality in teams (and not coincidentally creating a betting market much like race handicappers). The richer clubs took a while but eventually saw a way around this by creating better training and conditioning and better facilities so that if you have 2 equal halfbacks for instance, one has regular lessons from the world's greatest halfbacks and has heart monitors, real time video etc etc and the other has a coach and conditioner. Over time we can predict which halfback will be more successful.

Into this scenario we have young men who suddenly have a lot of money and free time. Ok, its not the money hey would get in the NFL but $200-400k is still more than they spend for groceries. They are in the news, are interviewed and enjoy celebrity status generally. They shake hands after each game with the opposition, they go clubbing with players from other teams. At some point the distinction of playing for a specific team starts to become worn. Players like Josh Reynolds who appears ready to die for his club become rare things. Players start to believe they can ignore the tribalism of their fans and if they are good enough there is always another club ready to accommodate them.

A draft system does not fit the NRL's view of the future. They see a whole lot of TV viewers who watch games as spectacles and bet on the outcome. Fans at the game are for atmosphere. Look at this year's GF. How many actual fans can afford these prices? How many people who trudged out on rainy Monday nights will get to see the GF live? Not a lot. The future is TV and we fans are simply quaint relics.