Was 2012 bad for the Bulldogs?

[Como Dog]

Now before you all jump in and say "Yes, Des started coaching us" I wanted to make a different point.

Back in 2012 we were playing average footbal until we went on a run around mid season and probably should have won the grand final. We had a revolutionary new playing style that was hard to combat. On paper I remember thinking we were an average team particularly with Reynolds and Keating in the halves. James Graham in reality was our half back and we essentially rode on the back of a big forward pack and Ben Barba's career best form.

The problem was this football was only good for a season as the element of surprise was gone and it masked our lack of quality halves and a strong kicking game.

Had we performed averagely that season, we would have probably recruited new players in key positions over the next couple of seasons. I think we would have been able to attract high quality players. However, I think even Des was so surprised with our success in 2012 that he stuck with that same core group of players and didn't change our style of play, probably to our detriment.

If someone else was overseeing recruitment and retention and we built a new spine back then, I believe we could be in a very different and much better situation now.

 

[Raysie]

This is the first time someone has brought up 2012 reminding us we weren't anything flash to start the year off. Yes we won the first 3 games in a row, however there was a period people seem to forget early on that year where we'd lost 5/7 games between Rounds 4-10.

As you say other than our flashy surprise attack thanks very largely to Barba and bringing in guys mid-season like Inu, we were pretty much the same as we are now. Our kicking game was still very poor, our halves as a whole were pretty much just backup players - while our halfback was our Prop forward.

 

[Boxer]

Difference is that the players actually gave a shit and played with pride something we have been missing for a long time.

 

[D.O.W.]

Now before you all jump in and say "Yes, Des started coaching us" I wanted to make a different point.

Back in 2012 we were playing average footbal until we went on a run around mid season and probably should have won the grand final. We had a revolutionary new playing style that was hard to combat. On paper I remember thinking we were an average team particularly with Reynolds and Keating in the halves. James Graham in reality was our half back and we essentially rode on the back of a big forward pack and Ben Barba's career best form.

The problem was this football was only good for a season as the element of surprise was gone and it masked our lack of quality halves and a strong kicking game.

Had we performed averagely that season, we would have probably recruited new players in key positions over the next couple of seasons. I think we would have been able to attract high quality players. However, I think even Des was so surprised with our success in 2012 that he stuck with that same core group of players and didn't change our style of play, probably to our detriment.

If someone else was overseeing recruitment and retention and we built a new spine back then, I believe we could be in a very different and much better situation now.

Clubs find it hard to replace players when they break contract, it throws a spanner in the works from a player management perspective. When you really think about it, Barba started the problems when he left us high and dry to link up with the Broncos.

 

[BMOC]

This is the first time someone has brought up 2012 reminding us we weren't anything flash to start the year off. Yes we won the first 3 games in a row, however there was a period people seem to forget early on that year where we'd lost 5/7 games between Rounds 4-10.

As you say other than our flashy surprise attack thanks very largely to Barba and bringing in guys mid-season like Inu, we were pretty much the same as we are now. Our kicking game was still very poor, our halves as a whole were pretty much just backup players - while our halfback was our Prop forward.

4 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs 6–20 Newcastle Knights Sun 25 Mar 2012, 3:00pm AEDT Stadium Australia
5 Gold Coast Titans 20–30 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs Sun 1 Apr 2012, 2:00pm AEST Robina Stadium
6 South Sydney Rabbitohs 20–10 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs Fri 6 Apr 2012, 4:00pm AEST Stadium Australia
7 Melbourne Storm 12–6 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs Sat 14 Apr 2012, 5:30pm AEST Melbourne Rectangular Stadium
8 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs 10–12 Manly-Warringah Sea Eagles Fri 27 Apr 2012, 7:35pm AEST Stadium Australia
9 Parramatta Eels 12–46 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs Fri 4 May 2012, 7:35pm AEST Stadium Australia
10 Canterbury Bankstown Bulldogs 14–25 Gold Coast Titans

I remember the period you are talking about. We had a shocker against the Knights in round 4. The Melbourne and Manly games which we lost actually remind me of how we are playing now. That Melbourne game we had so much possession in the second half, we had so many sets in their 20m line yet could not score. In fact i remember my dad even saying that the dogs suck in attack. Similarly, we opened the scoring against Manly with Barba's beautiful line break. But, we could not score again when we had numerous attacking opportunities in their end of the field. Ahhhh makes me wonder if Attack has always been an issue for us with Des. maybe we were all blinded by Barba's line breaks

 

[Oatley Dog]

Now before you all jump in and say "Yes, Des started coaching us" I wanted to make a different point.

Back in 2012 we were playing average footbal until we went on a run around mid season and probably should have won the grand final. We had a revolutionary new playing style that was hard to combat. On paper I remember thinking we were an average team particularly with Reynolds and Keating in the halves. James Graham in reality was our half back and we essentially rode on the back of a big forward pack and Ben Barba's career best form.

The problem was this football was only good for a season as the element of surprise was gone and it masked our lack of quality halves and a strong kicking game.

Had we performed averagely that season, we would have probably recruited new players in key positions over the next couple of seasons. I think we would have been able to attract high quality players. However, I think even Des was so surprised with our success in 2012 that he stuck with that same core group of players and didn't change our style of play, probably to our detriment.

If someone else was overseeing recruitment and retention and we built a new spine back then, I believe we could be in a very different and much better situation now.

It was an innovative strategy and one that took a little time to settle, but once it did we were very good for most of the season. then Jammer nibbled on Billy and we lost our primary driver of the strategy for the first half of 13 and we had a few other injuries that slowed us down. 14 was when Barba went off the rails and so did a lot of our attacking plans. We still got the to the GF though so pretty good effort all round. 15 was when BMoz was supposed to replace Barba and we were looking at a good year ahead. Then he blew his knee in the first few rounds - back to Perrett again and we struggled. 16 Bmoz still has infected knee for what 15 rounds and so Hoppa has to step in and have a crack. Ran out of legs in the back end due to not training there but still went OK> Here we are in 17 but the problem for us is that while the strategy had value all the key players are older and slower. So Jammer is at walking pace, Tolman not much better, our backrowers are smaller and more mobile which is good, but not relevant to a power forward game and our 2 big bopper benchies are frankly pathetic this year. That's why the strategy doesn't work. Add to that the capacity of opposition teams to slow down the play the ball along with no-one with speed trailing the ball carriers and we have the problems we do. It is one of the things that Reynolds does pretty well and so I would hope he will back up a fair bit this weekend. Mbye can too but he is doing the organising so he can't do both. Along the way the interchange went from 10 to 8 meaning the big blokes would get even more tired. When it goes to 6 we will be shot ducks if we don't change.

 

[Boldslug]

In 2012, didn't we use a wrap around tactic in attack that caused a change to the obstruction rule, as the media kept complaining about it?

 

[blueyedsamurai]

In 2012, didn't we use a wrap around tactic in attack that caused a change to the obstruction rule, as the media kept complaining about it?

Yes, this was one of our main attacking options and when they changed it in 2013 we haven't recovered.

 

[Dogs1938]

Yes, this was one of our main attacking options and when they changed it in 2013 we haven't recovered.

That's why Barba was so good.

 

[ElMagicElMasri]

Tbh all we had to do in that GF was kick behind a few times early. I can 100% see Des telling them to stick to the structure and it's easy to understand given we finished first. I do remember us scoring like that against Manly in week 1 of the finals I think - why we didn't in the GF is ridiculous. Can't believe that game still burns me ffs.

 

[Dognacious]

Dont think 2012 was a problem. Back then we didnt know mbye would not be a good 7 and whether Lichaa was worth losing Ennis over. But after some years we have discovered swapping Ennis for Lichaa was the worst decision ever, and Mbye will never be a great 7. Hes a running player, or passer. Not a kicker really and not an organiser.

What pisses me off with Des is hes determined to persist with mbye at 7 and lichaa 9 (for any part of the game) despite neither of them showing any sign of getting better at it. Yet he ignored Frawley was firing at 7 and controlling the kicking game, on his preferred side.

After a few losses i would have switched frawley and mbye when reynolds was out. But no. 4 losses later and they are named thay way again this week. Cept Reynolds is back so we should see frawley at 7 for part of the match and lichaa benched. So we are a chance.

Lichaa is a very good defender and can run good. But his service and reading of the game arent good enough for hooker. Maybe he would go ok in the backs? If i was coach i would have moved him there ages ago.

 

[BULLDOG 4 LIFE]

We had to win the comp in 2012. We had it all over Melbourne in the regular season,
and were easily the best team all year.

Des was plain out coached in the G.F.

Their right edge kept jamming in on us, and all we needed to
do was try a few grubbers and kicks to break their rhythm and
keep them guessing, but we didn't.

I suppose that stubbornness to deviate from the game plan
was a sign of what was to come from Hasbeen, and the misery
and pain that has followed.

 

[GUSLER]

No, 2014 was the killer. All these plodders and fat slobs were resigned after 2014

 

[Rodzilla]

the 2012 attack was way overrated, we scored just 40 and 60 less points in the last 2 season when people thought our attack was shit, so we were about 2pts better off per game

the real thing that made 2012 great was the defense

 

[Rodzilla]

btw we did build a new spine since then, perrett was great in 2014, hodkinson was ok that year, lichaa was the worst signing we could make to replace ennis, mbye has done very little, hopoate works hard but is unconvincing

 

[Dogtime]

Dont think 2012 was a problem. Back then we didnt know mbye would not be a good 7 and whether Lichaa was worth losing Ennis over. But after some years we have discovered swapping Ennis for Lichaa was the worst decision ever, and Mbye will never be a great 7. Hes a running player, or passer. Not a kicker really and not an organiser.

What pisses me off with Des is hes determined to persist with mbye at 7 and lichaa 9 (for any part of the game) despite neither of them showing any sign of getting better at it. Yet he ignored Frawley was firing at 7 and controlling the kicking game, on his preferred side.

After a few losses i would have switched frawley and mbye when reynolds was out. But no. 4 losses later and they are named thay way again this week. Cept Reynolds is back so we should see frawley at 7 for part of the match and lichaa benched. So we are a chance.

Lichaa is a very good defender and can run good. But his service and reading of the game arent good enough for hooker. Maybe he would go ok in the backs? If i was coach i would have moved him there ages ago.

Team sheet this week shows Mbye at 7, Frawley interchange. Lichaa has been better this year at hooker...dont know that hes a back. I must say the way we play seems to be draining the players of enthusiasm. No wonder Klemmer has asked for a release.

You are right though and so is this thread....our success in 2012 masked basic deficiencies in our football talent. Then 2014 we were nothing like one of the top 2 sides but had a lucky finals run. The Clubs Directors, CEO and coach point to these GF appearances as SUCCESS. But in the scheme of things, our inaction to address fundamental deficiencies has now led us to where we are now....something like 5 wins from our past 18 games and not getting any better.

Paul Kent unfortunately has a line....coaches shouldnt listen to fans...if they do before long they will be sitting with them. My solice is though that mine and all doggies fans frustrations with the coach and team over the last 3 years is now being echoed very loudly by all commentators and the media. Something has to give because Hasler and Dibb and the Board will not survive a media led assassination...which is exactly what will happen if we continue to ignore our deficencies, have a coach who is delusional about Mbye, and fails to come up with a gameplan that the players can execute.

 

[craigo]

Difference is that the players actually gave a shit and played with pride something we have been missing for a long time.

I scored a few free tickets from that legend giving away some tickets the other day. Taking my wife and daughter to game. I was a member since late 90s went to every game everywhere until we got whipped by Souths in grand final. I might tell her I'm gong to toilet but really sneak off to 40m line run down to fence and yell out my 2 years of frustration at the players and hopefully bring some pride back into the team. If we don't win this game I can't see myself ever going to a game again. As I have to travel up from the gong for doggies games

 

[Berries]

The day Des dropped Keating who ran direct to the line and opened up the sweeping back line movement was the day we struggled.

 

[blueyedsamurai]

The day Des dropped Keating who ran direct to the line and opened up the sweeping back line movement was the day we struggled.

We were struggling before that, I remember everyone calling for his head in 2013.

 

[ElMagicElMasri]

The day Des dropped Keating who ran direct to the line and opened up the sweeping back line movement was the day we struggled.

Yep - Keating most underrated Dogs player since 2000