Should Shane Flanagan and James Hird coach again?

Cappuccino

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Like a spruiker from Clive Palmer’s United Australia Party shoving how-to-vote flyers in your face on election day, Shane Flanagan is pushing hard to become the next coach of the Bulldogs.

So hard it won’t surprise if it costs him the job.

He reached out to the club a week after Trent Barrett’s departure and in recent days has pitched up on 2GB and Fox Sports — the two media outlets for whom he’s worked since the NRL deregistered him four years ago.
Flanagan told a Fox Sports podcast on Tuesday: “I’m sure Gus or whoever is in charge of that responsibility, if they’re interested, come and give me a ring over the next couple of weeks, we’ll go from there, but at the moment I’ll just sit back.”

You there, Gus? Something? Helloooooo?

If they’re to engage with him, the Bulldogs general manager Phil Gould and the club’s board will need to be sure they can trust Flanagan, who has been more than prepared to extol his own virtues but is still haunted by his past mistakes.

Indeed, the way some have airbrushed over his past indiscretions which had seen him twice suspended from the NRL as he agitates for the Bulldogs job has been quite remarkable.
It would be nice to know if Flanagan, after all these years, takes any responsibility as head coach for what happened at Cronulla in 2011 when controversial sports scientist Stephen Dank was allowed to administer players with banned substances.

It would be nice to know if Flanagan has learned anything from his four-year exile after the NRL discovered he breached the conditions of his year-long suspension in 2014 for failing in his “duty of care” to his players.

Meanwhile, as Flanagan eyes a possible return to coaching, the other prominent coach at the centre of the “darkest day in Australian sport” is considering his own tale of redemption.

Former Essendon coach James Hird joined GWS Giants as a “leadership consultant” in January but now finds himself on the coaching staff after head coach Leon Cameron resigned earlier this month.

It’s unlikely the struggling Western Sydney franchise will appoint Hird as its senior coach, especially with four-time premiership winner Alastair Clarkson on the market, but there’s little doubt he wants back in, as confirmed by his former Bombers mentor, Kevin Sheedy, in a recent interview.

Should Hird be afforded a second chance? Should Flanagan be afforded a third?

Some maintain neither man should be allowed anywhere near a group of young athletes ever again, such was the impact of the drug saga that occurred while they were head coaches of their respective clubs and playing groups.
Yet both the AFL and NRL insist they’ve done their time, ticked all the right boxes and can’t, let alone won’t, stand in their way.
Perhaps the relevant question is whether an AFL or NRL club would be interested to take on a coach carrying so much baggage.

In Hird’s case, there’s a belief he wasn’t a particularly great coach anyway. He returned to Essendon from his year-long ban but resigned at the end of 2015 with a winning percentage of 48 per cent.

Flanagan, however, won a premiership at the Sharks in 2016, their first in 50 years of existence. Success has many fathers but he deserves a large slice of the credit.
The Bulldogs need more than just a hard-headed coach prepared to make tough decisions. They need someone who can work hand-in-glove with Gould.
People join the dots and say the two men are represented by the same person — veteran agent Wayne Beavis — but so was Anthony Griffin. How did that work out?
Flanagan’s son, Kyle, is an issue, as it often is when a father is coaching his son. He told 2GB on Saturday he would be strong enough to drop him if he felt it was best for the team but not everyone at Belmore is convinced.

He gave unsolicited advice to Barrett last year about how to play his son, just as he tried to give advice to Trent Robinson at the Roosters the year before that.
If he was appointed coach, could the Bulldogs trust Flanagan to dispassionately drop Kyle if the time came? What if Gould didn’t want to renew his contract? What if he found a better halfback?

Flanagan says he could work with Gould, but he’s shown before he has issues with authority.

When he returned to the game in 2015, NRL officials suggested he address his peers at a pre-season coach’s meeting. It was a chance to tell the other coaches what he’d learned, what he’d got wrong, how they could avoid the same grave error of letting mysterious high-performance types wielding syringes full of unknown substances into their club.

Flanagan didn’t see the point but eventually got up, grumbled a few words and sat down. No contrition was shown for the damage the supplements scandal had done to the game. It went down like a bad prawn with his fellow coaches.

Then, in 2018, after Sharks chief executive Barry Russell self-reported possible salary-cap breaches, the NRL ordered a forensic audit of the club’s books.
In doing so, it discovered Flanagan had defied the rules of his 2014 ban by negotiating contracts with players.

The smoking gun was a series of emails sent from his Sharks email address to his private one — that old trick! — but what isn’t commonly known is how the integrity unit also discovered Flanagan cheating on his homework.

One of the conditions of his return was completion of a compliance and ethics course. The audit discovered Flanagan had asked others to do the essays for him. When challenged by NRL investigators, he thought nothing of it.

When contacted on Thursday, Flanagan strongly denied this, insisting “all the work was my own”.

Flanagan deserves his chance again. It might even be at the Bulldogs, although you sense they would’ve talked to him by now if they were interested.
But if this one-man election campaign is to continue, he should stop telling us what he’s done — and start telling us how he’s changed.
(For the record, Flanagan has rejected repeated interview requests from this column for over two months, saying he didn’t want to be seen to be pitching up for a job).

 

LordSidious66

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A bit rich coming from the same organisation whose refs pretty much help the opposition win against us [emoji23][emoji23]
 

hayes

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You do know there a difference between Fairfax and Nationwide news
 

B-Train

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Good article by Webster which highlights the pros and cons of Flanagan..

He'll get another chance eventually and it might be with us. But the way he's constantly carrying on in the media about wanting the job and now the talk of "We haven't seen Kyle's best footy and I can get it out of him" should be raising alarm bells..

Because Flanagan's ego, arrogance and inability to listen to authority at Cronulla is what led to his downfall more than the peptides saga itself. Judging by his recent comments it doesn't seem like he's learnt his lesson and may talk himself out of the job.
 

Philmus

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he hasn't even got the job yet and the smear campaign has begun. welcome to the dogs shaneo
 

DinkumDog

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Told yers, the bloke is a grub and I’m still hoping he doesn’t get the job - especially so because he might be considered ‘the best available’. We’re better off talking Potter into staying longer (if we need to) to find the ‘right’ coach longer term. This decision is so critical and cannot be botched. In my view Flanagan is a NO.
 

B-Train

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he hasn't even got the job yet and the smear campaign has begun. welcome to the dogs shaneo
There's no smear campaign. Whenever a coach is talked about for a vacancy, the media talk about their past successes and failures on their record.

If Shane wasn't in the media so much and let the coaching search run its course then all of these stories wouldn't be popping up. Flanagan is creating this whole situation which the club probably wouldn't be happy with..
 

Scoooby

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Welcome to the BULLDOGS Shane F, only coach available that want here from others named mentioned,

And take us to the top of that ladder once again. Because it’s where we belong.

kind regards,
Scoooby :grinning:
 

Dognacious

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Good article by Webster which highlights the pros and cons of Flanagan..

He'll get another chance eventually and it might be with us. But the way he's constantly carrying on in the media about wanting the job and now the talk of "We haven't seen Kyle's best footy and I can get it out of him" should be raising alarm bells..

Because Flanagan's ego, arrogance and inability to listen to authority at Cronulla is what led to his downfall more than the peptides saga itself. Judging by his recent comments it doesn't seem like he's learnt his lesson and may talk himself out of the job.
What's with the constantly saying in the media he wants the job part? Heard him say it once, and the media keep repeating it. If he did repeat it though it's probably because stupid journos keep asking him about it.
 

Disposable Hero

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Bring Dank with you too flanno. Mightbharden some of the boys up.
Could you imagine knockondumdum on the dank juice!!!
 

B-Train

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What's with the constantly saying in the media he wants the job part? Heard him say it once, and the media keep repeating it. If he did repeat it though it's probably because stupid journos keep asking him about it.
He's done about four or five separate interviews with different journos in the past two weeks. He works for Fox and knows all of the people asking the questions. It's not a coincidence they're running so many articles campaigning for him.

This isn't Flanagan's first rodeo. He knows what he's doing and how the media works. He's milking his connections for all they're worth because he's desperate for the job.
 

bradtalo

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He's definitely not perfect but remember few are. Barrett was the perfect type of guy (too perfect / nice) and we saw how that worked out.

I just really believe our playing group would respond best to someone like Flanagan who they know has won a comp so will respect more than any coach who hasn't. They wouldn't listen to Barrett and I doubt they'll listen to any inexperienced coach. A lot of them have a loser mentality now (just easier to lose than lift) so it's a big job and they need someone tough who can motivate them and punish them when they don't do it right. Yes Paul Green is experienced but he lost the dressing room at the end too. Flanagan never really lost the dressing room / players whilst coach
 

Dognacious

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He's done about four or five separate interviews with different journos in the past two weeks. He works for Fox and knows all of the people asking the questions. It's not a coincidence they're running so many articles campaigning for him.

This isn't Flanagan's first rodeo. He knows what he's doing and how the media works. He's milking his connections for all they're worth because he's desperate for the job.
Yeh I dunno. In any case I don't see a problem with him being keen for the job, even if he was purposely repeating his interest. I was more concerned earlier that he wouldn't want the job, its not for everybody.
 

Bazildog

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Told yers, the bloke is a grub and I’m still hoping he doesn’t get the job - especially so because he might be considered ‘the best available’. We’re better off talking Potter into staying longer (if we need to) to find the ‘right’ coach longer term. This decision is so critical and cannot be botched. In my view Flanagan is a NO.
Yeah, I was with you mate and agreed with your views about Pay for a long time but then when it was obvious that he was not the future I debated with you about the timing of moving him on. I wanted to see the club pull the trigger and chase the big name coaches and you wanted to wait and see to. We waited "because he deserves a better roster or his players" and only pulled the trigger when it was after all the decent coaches were gone, and we ended up with....Barrett. You know mate that I was always against the idea of Flannagan coaching us especially when there was any chance of Bellamy, Bennett, Robinson or someone like Shaun Wane. But they all are off the table and we desperately need an experinced winning coach and not some has been that never was or another "potential rookie".

There's no smear campaign. Whenever a coach is talked about for a vacancy, the media talk about their past successes and failures on their record.

If Shane wasn't in the media so much and let the coaching search run its course then all of these stories wouldn't be popping up. Flanagan is creating this whole situation which the club probably wouldn't be happy with..
True mate, but maybe he knows something we dont. Barrett was a fantastic speaker and a rubbish coach, Flannagan by record is tough successful coach that might not be the best public speaker and also has a few black marks. We desperately need a strong successful coach so if we believe Gould has control of the clubs future and thinks he can handle Flanagan, we should hire him now I reckon.
 

B-Train

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Yeh I dunno. In any case I don't see a problem with him being keen for the job, even if he was purposely repeating his interest. I was more concerned earlier that he wouldn't want the job, its not for everybody.
I'm glad he's keen for the job. But talking about how he'd handle Kyle over and over again before he's even got the job isn't ideal and puts the club in an awkward position. If he bit his tongue for a while til an announcement was made, it would be better for everyone.
 

B-Train

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Yeah, I was with you mate and agreed with your views about Pay for a long time but then when it was obvious that he was not the future I debated with you about the timing of moving him on. I wanted to see the club pull the trigger and chase the big name coaches and you wanted to wait and see to. We waited "because he deserves a better roster or his players" and only pulled the trigger when it was after all the decent coaches were gone, and we ended up with....Barrett. You know mate that I was always against the idea of Flannagan coaching us especially when there was any chance of Bellamy, Bennett, Robinson or someone like Shaun Wane. But they all are off the table and we desperately need an experinced winning coach and not some has been that never was or another "potential rookie".



True mate, but maybe he knows something we dont. Barrett was a fantastic speaker and a rubbish coach, Flannagan by record is tough successful coach that might not be the best public speaker and also has a few black marks. We desperately need a strong successful coach so if we believe Gould has control of the clubs future and thinks he can handle Flanagan, we should hire him now I reckon.
I understand why we'd hire Flanagan. He might be the coach we need considering the circumstances and how bad the alternatives are. But I still maintain that Kyle should be moved on before he gets the job because it creates massive problems and distractions and Shane has already shown he'll make excuses for him. Kyle is not worth the fuss, so move him on and if Shane still wants to coach, which he would, then the job is his..
 

Bazildog

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I understand why we'd hire Flanagan. He might be the coach we need considering the circumstances and how bad the alternatives are. But I still maintain that Kyle should be moved on before he gets the job because it creates massive problems and distractions and Shane has already shown he'll make excuses for him. Kyle is not worth the fuss, so move him on and if Shane still wants to coach, which he would, then the job is his..
I agree, and I am sure that process is already being discussed. Gus placed Naden, now he can place mini-vag.
 

B-Train

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I agree, and I am sure that process is already being discussed. Gus placed Naden, now he can place mini-vag.
Hopefully. The media keep referring to it as something the club want to avoid so hopefully there's some truth to that. That kind of nepotism and unwanted headlines of "he dropped/won't drop his son etc" we don't need. After six years of being a basketcase on and off the field, we need as few distractions as possible.
 

DinkumDog

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Yeah, I was with you mate and agreed with your views about Pay for a long time but then when it was obvious that he was not the future I debated with you about the timing of moving him on. I wanted to see the club pull the trigger and chase the big name coaches and you wanted to wait and see to. We waited "because he deserves a better roster or his players" and only pulled the trigger when it was after all the decent coaches were gone, and we ended up with....Barrett. You know mate that I was always against the idea of Flannagan coaching us especially when there was any chance of Bellamy, Bennett, Robinson or someone like Shaun Wane. But they all are off the table and we desperately need an experinced winning coach and not some has been that never was or another "potential rookie".
But who was available back then - Hook?
Hardly setting the world on fire at Kogarah.
Bellamy in my view was never leaving Melbourne and Bennett was always headed back to Queensland. So I don’t think much has changed and I do think Pay would’ve done better with Barrett’s roster than Barrett did. Apart from that Flanagan is a Karmichael :-).
 
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