2021 will be most significant year in 15 years as a dogs fan.

[bradyk]

The club has been on tilt from the top down this year. 2021 from the top down we have improved in every area and will continue to do so. Depending on the talent we can get to round out the top 30 i don't see why we cant be fighting for the bottom of the 8.

Won or 8 points or less:
Eels
Cowboys
Dragons
Sharks
Dragons
Knights
Eels
Tigers
Warriors
Titans
Rabbitohs

= 11 wins, 7th-8th

We're not far away, but we need to sign difference makers (in key areas), e.g. a player like B. Smith. I still find it hard to be confident with our current roster. Cotric and Flanagan are good signings, but we obviously need a lot more.

 

[albatross]

Brady how exactly could the club ‘have done a lot better’? You said it yourself - the club was placed in a very difficult position, Pay was about the only coach we could attract, we had no money or other enticements to attract talent. As was always stated, 2021 it would change - and voila now we have a coach who appears to be widely respected and money to spend and what do you know, the calibre of talent we can attract has also increased. Pretty simple really.

I'm feeling real positive about '21, but I reckon the club could have done a lot better in the past few years. Other clubs have recruited plenty of low-mid priced players who have been great buys recently. Our buys in that range have been pretty average and none have delivered much. Our recruitment (and retention eg Lichaa) could have been much better, even with the limited dollars we had to spend. It feels like things are back on the right track now though, especially if Flanagan can organise the team and Hetherington goes out and plays footy instead of UFC - Cotric a great buy too.

 

[DinkumDog]

Well, they've all turned out to be players filling the roster with no potential of being anything else, I don't even feel comfortable playing any of them. Napa and DWZ have turned out to be flops on big money. Straight from the get go I never understood the Napa signing, that was a panic signing/decision. They definitely could of done better. I understand we didn't have much money to spend but that isn't really the point. All of those players I've named need to be moved on.

‘Didn’t have the money to spend but that isn’t the point’. That’s EXACTLY the point mate. You either get the Barina or the Tesla depending on what you can afford. I agree Napa wasn’t a great signing and wasn’t the ‘leader’ in the pack we needed. DWZ had a shocking 2020 no dispute but he at least showed us what’s possible in 2019. Let’s see what Baz and co can do with him before writing him off. There’s always going to be players who are seen to not be earning their coin and calls to ‘move them on’ but it’s not as easy as it seems. I doubt Napa will be retained end of 2021 and the continuous improvement of the roster efforts will continue. It’s never a perfect science.

 

[bradyk]

‘Didn’t have the money to spend but that isn’t the point’. That’s EXACTLY the point mate. You either get the Barina or the Tesla depending on what you can afford. I agree Napa wasn’t a great signing and wasn’t the ‘leader’ in the pack we needed. DWZ had a shocking 2020 no dispute but he at least showed us what’s possible in 2019. Let’s see what Baz and co can do with him before writing him off. There’s always going to be players who are seen to not be earning their coin and calls to ‘move them on’ but it’s not as easy as it seems. I doubt Napa will be retained end of 2021 and the continuous improvement of the roster efforts will continue. It’s never a perfect science.

I basically have the same opinion as @albatross above on this topic. I'm just not as optimistic yet in regards to his last sentence. There are players at other clubs on minimum wage that are actually playable. We obviously didn't get the right ones, which means the club/recruitment team could of done a lot better.

 

[DinkumDog]

I'm feeling real positive about '21, but I reckon the club could have done a lot better in the past few years. Other clubs have recruited plenty of low-mid priced players who have been great buys recently. Our buys in that range have been pretty average and none have delivered much. Our recruitment (and retention eg Lichaa) could have been much better, even with the limited dollars we had to spend. It feels like things are back on the right track now though, especially if Flanagan can organise the team and Hetherington goes out and plays footy instead of UFC - Cotric a great buy too.

Liccha was before the worst of the cap problems though, he was seen as a long term replacement for Ennis (clearly a mistake) and some of those calls were when Des had too much power. Recruitment can never be 100% perfect, many factors can determine how well things turn out and of course hindsight is easy. Agree that 2021 is looking a lot brighter now that those cap challenges are behind us and we were able to make space for more talent. Even better we are not yet done, still some spots left and we can strengthen again for 2022. Happier times ahead .

 

[Howie B]

Won or 8 points or less:
Eels
Cowboys
Dragons
Sharks
Dragons
Knights
Eels
Tigers
Warriors
Titans
Rabbitohs

= 11 wins, 7th-8th

We're not far away, but we need to sign difference makers (in key areas), e.g. a player like B. Smith. I still find it hard to be confident with our current roster. Cotric and Flanagan are good signings, but we obviously need a lot more.

Good point about being not far away from a Top 8 but thats partly because there are a fair few ordinary sides around. Our games against the storm, roosters and panthers this year showed us how far we are away from the top teams but when the sharks make the 8 there is no reason we cant.

 

[DinkumDog]

I basically have the same opinion as @albatross above on this topic. I'm just not as optimistic yet in regards to his last sentence. There are players at other clubs on minimum wage that are actually playable. We obviously didn't get the right ones, which means the club/recruitment team could of done a lot better.

That might also come down to coaching though. We had below par on and off the field. I supported Pay because he was doing his best in very difficult position and didn’t need more people hammering him, not because I thought he was a great coach. He was never the long term answer. So, improvements in both the playing and coaching groups should definitely translate into better results. Roll on 2021!

 

[alchemist]

Yes the Parra teams of that 80's era were great but our Dogs team were better. That's why they changed the rules from 5 to 10m because the Dogs were too dominant in the mid 80's. We won the same number of comps and were more competitive across the decade than Parra who dropped off after 86. The dogs failed to defend their title in 81 as a virus hit virtually our entire team which cleared the way for Parra in 81. In 84 when Wok joined and Baa came back to combine with the real GOAT Turvey the Dogs overtook Parra. We should have won in 86 if it weren't for some biased referring to give Cronin and Price a happy ending and Bugden not giving the ball to Turvey to set up the winning try when we were one metre from the tryline seconds before the end. As for the Broncos they entered the comp in 88 with a virtual Origin side but could not make a GF until 92 after they got rid of "King" Wally Lewis. That's how good Wally was in the ARL - couldn't even make a GF with a team full of superstars yet the media declares him the GOAT.
I'm confident the glory days are returning soon for the Dogs, we have a young dynamic attacking coach who was a gun rep half in his era and he's recruited well in the coaching support staff.

my point was actually what a poor club Parramatta is that their premiership success has been confined to a 5 year period when they fielded an all star team but have otherwise sucked for their remaining 67 years and counting... and we must ensure our club does not get mired in similar mismanagement as Parra

as for comparing the greatness of the Eels and Bulldogs teams of the 80's and Mortimer vs Sterling, Lamb vs Kenny, Gibson vs Warren Ryan etc., what I think is clear is that we proved we were the greater club during that decade... we won as the entertainers under Glossop with the Mortimer and Hughes brothers, we then reinvented ourselves as the 'Dogs of War' under Ryan which strangled the comp leading to rule changes (eg. defusing a kick on the full in goal means an optional restart at the 20 metre line), and then won with Gus Gould in 1988 with Terry Lamb our best player... winning with different players and different coaches and different playing ideologies and with injuries (eg. Lamb missed a GF in the 80's and Mortimer played off the bench in 1988 after breaking his arm earlier in the season with Hagan deputising)

 

[Apex Cedar]

2022 will be with this squad
Avo
Carr
Schoupp
Staggs
Cotric
Burton
Flanagan
Thompson
Grant
McLean
Elliot
Toupinoua
Jackson

toomaga
RFM
Topine
Odgen

 

[rainman]

Agree 100% This could all lead to the greatest dynasty ever in dogs history.

Big call

 

[Qld-Dog]

I think Green with his experience will be good for all our younger half's long term, they will all learn a lot, 12 months well spent IMO! now that For is gone.

 

[Qld-Dog]

Sorry, FOZ is gone!!

 

[Bulldog wazza]

Patience didn’t work well for the last board with members...

Patience and process come to mind when building solid foundations.. If one takes shortcuts and wants instant satisfaction.. Ending is simple !this leads to longer dissapointment. Lets be consistent and continue to grow, practice good and healthy process. Follow the lessons taught by the Hansens and Coaches and we will be a powerhouse for years to come.. Key is Patience,consistency and never giving away our core values and principles the new regime will instill in our young pups..

 

[Emdog85]

- Older halve who is a proven performer

Are you referring to Green? If we signed Flanno, I don't think Green will be here since both Flanno and Green are traditional 7s.

I swear I read somewhere that we have released Green? He's going to Newcastle or something? I either read it or dreamt it

 

[Moey]

I love Baz and what he stands for and what he can achieve, he was doing well at manly before backroom drama derailed them. He left Manly in a good state before he left.
And what he has done so far was more than Hasbeen and Pay did for last 5yrs

But im not expecting miracles next year, not even really excited. We have been through so much crap lately that im doing a wait n see approach. For me it's what we do for 2022 and beyond which will show how our club is going..

But am finally excited that we have a halfback and a coach who love to attack. Last time was way back when Barba was around...

 

[Emdog85]

the recent seasons have been the most difficult IMO for Dogs fans in modern times with the habitual struggles, poor results, ugly play, poor recruitment, poor retention, a distinct lack of development of juniors, off field issues, apparent lack of corporate support, board level fights etc.

I feared (and still do) that we were losing the very characteristic our club was known for - being a winning club... and sometimes, winning and losing become habits... as a club, we won 2 premierships within 7 years of our founding but then went almost 4 decades without winning a premiership

for example, people that did not watch the Eels teams of the 80's do not fully appreciate what a great team they were - Sterling, Kenny, Cronin, Price, Grothe, Ella, Gibson (coach) etc... as good a club team as I have watched with 4 premierships including a three-peat... but their fans should f+*#ing riot... they have one of (if not the) biggest junior bases and yet it took them 33 years to win their first premiership, dominated the comp for 5-6 years with a great team and then have suffered another 3+ decade premiership drought... unacceptable for them... great fun for me

Cronulla, Wests, NZ, Gold Coast, Newcastle etc... do you think it is a coincidence or simply bad luck that they continually fail?

the Broncos dominated nearly from the get-go and were the glamour club of the comp... but they came into the comp with a rep standard team, had much of QLD to rely upon, based in a one team city, with plenty of corporate support, with a state of the art stadium built for them, in a city where the cost of living is significantly less than that of Sydney or Melbourne (meaning their salary cap will go further) etc... but what has further expansion into QLD (ie. Cowboys and Titans), greater access to QLD for other clubs (eg. Storm), and mismanagement led to? the Broncos first wooden spoon and a 14 year premiership drought after they won 6 premierships in their first 18 years

I am hopeful of the recent developments with the club... but we have been in a downward spiral for years, a dangerous spiral, and we need a lot of work to correct it

The boys have just forgot how to win and expect losses. Especially this season, it was abysmal. I think with all the changes and new signings things the boys will get that winning feeling again. Things are definitely looking up for our club.

 

[2144superman]

Can't disagree with you there

 

[Alan79]

I think our great club is traveling along very nicely,
the big thing for me was that they come good on fixing the salary cap debacle within their stated time frame which is massive.
We don’t need to see Hilly waving his Pom Poms down at Canterbury Rd every five minutes.
CEO’s are usually tucked away in some cosy office just running the show.
Dealing with people and issues of importance.

Spot on about not needing a CEO that loves the limelight. Greenberg loved getting his face on camera. I was at times impressed with the appearances and initially with moves like signing Hasler. But less publicly, he made a financial decision to save money on junior development. He allowed Hasler to chase quick success with no regard to having a sustainable roster. The culmination of all this was that as soon as a better job offer came his way he jumped ship. Soon after the cap squeeze began and we had substandard juniors to fill the gaps in the roster.

Hill might not be regularly making public appearances. He's not really been in place throughout our proudest moments as a club. But pending the outcome of next season he along with the board could show that they've mostly made wise decisions.

As for the expectations for the coming season. I think we've taken some big steps forward. The staff appointments and recruiting look positive. I think we'll be the most improved team in the comp. But not necessarily a premiership threat next year. Playing finals football regardless of how far we manage to get would be a great result. Getting a positive mindset and overcoming what I see as self doubt throughout our squad will start us on the road back. Improved fitness will take us another step forward. Creating a playing style and structures that will complement our teams abilities will also help. But the question that remains is whether we have the quality in our roster to go beyond gradual improvement to becoming a contender after barely avoiding the spoon.

I'm excited about seeing some improvement. But also tempering my excitement with the thought that it's a large gap between the also rans and the teams that will go deep into the finals.

 

[Nasheed]

Not going to disagree at all, but just want to point out that part of a winning culture is patience. It is going to be important for the team, club, and fans to not throw their toys out of the cot the first time something goes wrong in 2021. By all means don't accept it, but the team especially is going to need to develop maturity around how it deals with setbacks.

Nasheed here,
You're right.
Even Billy Bonds Oakland A holes team (from the money ball movie) went winless in their first 6 games or so before rolling home.

Closer to home. Look at panthers last year. Last for first half of the season then killed it to manage a respectable ten. Then carried it to a 17 game winning streak this year.

 

[DogsOfWar1704]

Even with this year's squad alone we would of played better under baz. Couple decent signings we could even make the 8 with our squad as it is. It's just an attitude problem with us. The squad can definitely play better than they did this year.