The Israel Folau Bill

[Freakzilla]

Hi @Freakzilla, respectfully, define "race" for us.

You don't know what race means?

 

[Lov_Dog]

You don't know what race means?

I'm trying to understand the sense you are using the word "race".

 

[Freakzilla]

I'm trying to understand the sense you are using the word "race".

The other poster compared not making a cake for a gay marriage to someone not being served for being black.

No one should be forced to make a cake with 2 blokes on it if it against their religion to do so.

 

[Rodzilla]

you can definitely change your race though

 

[Lov_Dog]

The other poster compared not making a cake for a gay marriage to someone not being served for being black.

No one should be forced to make a cake with 2 blokes on it if it against their religion to do so.

That's cool, but can you define "race" ?

 

[CaptainJackson]

1950s

White man: hi baker I'd like a cake for my wedding

Baker: ok what would you like?

White man: I'll take this type of cake and can you please make the bride black

Baker: why?

White man: I'm marrying a black woman

Baker: I won't do inter racial couples, how dare you soil your white race

Today: swap inter racial couples for homosexual couples


How a normal transaction should proceed.

Hi baker I need a cake for my wedding

Baker: which cake do you want?

I'll choose that one thanks and this is the date I need it.

END OF!!!!!!!!!

A baker is paid to bake a fucking cake from a selection of displays a baker already has there.

If that baker has a problem with same sex couples because of religious reasons then that baker better damn sure make sure he doesn't make cakes for people entering their 2nd/3rd/4th etc marriage because divorce is fucking sin too.

Let them bring in this religious freedom bill, I'll take great joy in telling religious people they're fucking cuckoo and belong in mental hospital and that I only tell them because I'm worried for their well being and it's just my way showing I love them.

 

[Freakzilla]

That's cool, but can you define "race" ?

Lol, what's with the 3rd degree about race? I don't have a special definitionfor it that others don't.

 

[MatstaDogg]

Did somebody call for a Baker

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Comparing sexual preference to race is idiotic. You can change your sexual preference, you can't change your race.

Sexual preference can change, but you can't choose to change it. You can't choose to like a different sex.

You can choose your religion though.

 

[JayBee]

he worked on sunday and should be put to death

I rest my case.

Thank you, sir.

 

[TwinTurbo]

Here's what I just don't get ............. Folau quoted the Bible in that unrepentant sinners will go to hell. If you're a non believer then so what, you don't believe in hell anyway. If you are a believer then you already know what the Bible says. So what's actually the problem?

Go Dogs

 

[Freakzilla]

Sexual preference can change, but you can't choose to change it. You can't choose to like a different sex.

You can choose your religion though.

I disagree about choosiing to be gay or not. Religion wasn't even being mentioned.

Anyway it's all irrelevant. The point is you can't force people to do things against their religion.

Not serving anyone who wants to buy what you've already made is wrong but you can't force them to make cakes with 2 men or 2 women on it.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

I disagree about choosiing to be gay or not. Religion wasn't even being mentioned.

Anyway it's all irrelevant. The point is you can't force people to do things against their religion.

Not serving anyone who wants to buy what you've already made is wrong but you can't force them to make cakes with 2 men or 2 women on it.

I tend to support freedom of association. Let the market decide it.

But I can't remember which book in the Bible said, "thou shalt not make cakes for gay dudes"

 

[JayBee]

Another reminder: Folau did absolutely nothing wrong.

Whilst I agree from a LEGAL perspective, it appears he did nothing wrong.

The manner in which he approached the situation on the other hand, I have issues with.

 

[Wahesh]

I tend to support freedom of association. Let the market decide it.

But I can't remember which book in the Bible said, "thou shalt not make cakes for gay dudes"

It's the same thing as supporting them. You aren't doing anything gay but you're supporting them by doing something that the faith stands against.

 

[JayBee]

I tend to support freedom of association. Let the market decide it.

But I can't remember which book in the Bible said, "thou shalt not make cakes for gay dudes"

Here is what you need to understand.

The cake will be part of a ceremony, of which as Christians/Muslims/Jews, this is against their respective faiths. By you involving yourself with it (ie - making a cake), you are condoning the action, of which they believe is a sin. You may not understand religion, you may detest it - but they believe it. For example - I may disagree with ones stance that they, even though born a man, they believe that they are a woman. But they can choose to believe so, and I will continue to disagree - but I am not stopping them from living there life. We can all be against someones lifestyle choices (and I am not saying sexual preference is a choice - but the freedom to marry is a choice), and that also means we do not need to celebrate them.

If you are morally against something, and you stand to lose from it (these people are losing sales), then they have every right to conscientiously object. At the end of the day, either someones' feelings will be hurt, or one's morals trampled. I will never allow my morals to be trampled if it is something I am passionate about.

I hope that clarifies if to for you

 

[Wahesh]

Here is what you need to understand.

The cake will be part of a ceremony, of which as Christians/Muslims/Jews, this is against their respective faiths. By you involving yourself with it (ie - making a cake), you are condoning the action, of which they believe is a sin. You may not understand religion, you may detest it - but they believe it. For example - I may disagree with ones stance that they, even though born a man, they believe that they are a woman. But they can choose to believe so, and I will continue to disagree - but I am not stopping them from living there life. We can all be against someones lifestyle choices (and I am not saying sexual preference is a choice - but the freedom to marry is a choice), and that also means we do not need to celebrate them.

If you are morally against something, and you stand to lose from it (these people are losing sales), then they have every right to conscientiously object. At the end of the day, either someones' feelings will be hurt, or one's morals trampled. I will never allow my morals to be trampled if it is something I am passionate about.

I hope that clarifies if to for you

Well there you go, I couldn't have put it better myself. Well said.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Here is what you need to understand.

The cake will be part of a ceremony, of which as Christians/Muslims/Jews, this is against their respective faiths. By you involving yourself with it (ie - making a cake), you are condoning the action, of which they believe is a sin. You may not understand religion, you may detest it - but they believe it. For example - I may disagree with ones stance that they, even though born a man, they believe that they are a woman. But they can choose to believe so, and I will continue to disagree - but I am not stopping them from living there life. We can all be against someones lifestyle choices (and I am not saying sexual preference is a choice - but the freedom to marry is a choice), and that also means we do not need to celebrate them.

If you are morally against something, and you stand to lose from it (these people are losing sales), then they have every right to conscientiously object. At the end of the day, either someones' feelings will be hurt, or one's morals trampled. I will never allow my morals to be trampled if it is something I am passionate about.

I hope that clarifies if to for you

I've always found it a mixed thing. I support freedom of association, being that any person should be able to choose who they sell to as long as it doesn't cause a larger problem. For example, as long as there's another baker willing to help then a baker should be able to choose to refuse to make the cake.

That said, it's literally no different to a person refusing to serve someone of a certain skin colour. I think that's the main problem with the cake situation and with what Folau did. It's not about what they say or do, but it's about the underlying meaning.

In each instance the stance is that, "I should be free to do what I want because they chose to be that way". Which is complete bullshit. No one chooses to be gay or straight. It's just what they are. So you can understand why they take offence when they are treated like someone who decided to be different.

But I also understand it from the religious perspective. When it comes to faith vs facts, a truly religious person will take faith over evidence. And they will support their beliefs over what society tells them.

 

[Wahesh]

I've always found it a mixed thing. I support freedom of association, being that any person should be able to choose who they sell to as long as it doesn't cause a larger problem. For example, as long as there's another baker willing to help then a baker should be able to choose to refuse to make the cake.

That said, it's literally no different to a person refusing to serve someone of a certain skin colour. I think that's the main problem with the cake situation and with what Folau did. It's not about what they say or do, but it's about the underlying meaning.

In each instance the stance is that, "I should be free to do what I want because they chose to be that way". Which is complete bullshit. No one chooses to be gay or straight. It's just what they are. So you can understand why they take offence when they are treated like someone who decided to be different.

But I also understand it from the religious perspective. When it comes to faith vs facts, a truly religious person will take faith over evidence. And they will support their beliefs over what society tells them.

It's not about them choosing to be gay or straight, it's about them as gay people choosing to get married - that's the difference. We don't have something against people because they are gay. There are a lot of gay people who I work with who I respect and vice versa. There are gay people involved in their religious institutions who chose not to get married because it's against their religion.

 

[TwinTurbo]

I can take offence out of almost anything written or said if I choose to, but that's not the question. What is relevant is if the person writing it or saying it intended for it to offend me. In this case I just can't see anyway that anyone could claim that it was intended to offend them. It's a quote from a rather well known source, that you either believe in or you don't. If you are a believer it can't offend you because you already know what it says. If you aren't a believer it can't offend you because you don't believe in the hell premise.

Go Dogs