Incredible Turnaround in Defence

[InGusWeTrust]

100%

A lot of our own fans and opposition fans have ignored that.

We started the first 2 rounds away against 2 full strength and top 8 expected sides in Parra and Sharks.

Played a Rabbitohs team at the time expected to finish top 8 at the least. We should have won that game too.

Shock every man and their dog by beating a Roosters side at one stage favourites for the Premiership.

Go down to Melbourne and got them shitting themselves. We should have won that game.

Had you have told me we'd even jag 3 wins from the opening rounds leading into the BYE, I'd have told you you're dreaming.

Key now is to back it up with a far easier upcoming draw (exluding the Penrith game).

On the flipside, they probably overrate Storm who have had only 2 away games. In 2 of their home games (maybe more but just off the top of my head) they only just got the win at the death. Versus us and Wahs. This can also be seen as a good quality though.

The point is, without looking at the details, it’s easy to say team a is crap or team b is great. I still think Storm are one of the better sides, but their 5/2 home/away split so far has probably made them look better.

 

[InGusWeTrust]

I think the biggest thing is we’ve had such a team this year that has not sat there and waited for opportunity, they have taken it upon themselves and executed what CC wants. The morale is through the roof, seeing them together after games laughing and enjoying each other’s company. Massive credit goes to the club for getting critta and making him captain. It’s made reed and burton focus solely on their game and it’s become a great turn around for their seasons.

I remember a lot of people here last year saying we got the wrong Penrith coach, have you not seen what’s happening at the warriors? Jeez they have a better team overall and the titans beat them. They got flogged the other week. I think what CC has done wit the team we have has been wonders, if CC gets us in the top 8, won’t surprise me if his coach of the year.

Oi, what’s wrong with the Wahs?! They were awesome yesterday handing Titties their first win bwahaha

 

[KiwiDog7]

Agree, he is not elite but the point was they copped 60 last night, it wasn't because of Flange. If the rest of the drags put in the effort that he did they probably don't concede 60.

he made 15 tackles and missed 7 which equates to a tackle efficiency of 62%

 

[Chris Harding]

As opposed to the business end when travel, injury and fatigue are a bigger problem to manage leading into the finals? If anything one team towns like the Storm and Warriors are disadvantaged by travel. In the last 5 weeks of this season the Storm have two trips to Sydney and two to Queensland. The Wahs two to Sydney and one to Brisbane. Any professional outfit knows it’s the whole season that you have to manage and at the end of the day every team gets the same number of home games. There’s simply no evidence to speak of ‘corruption’ or ‘favouritism’ - it’s just disgruntled fans thinking that it’s somehow deliberately stacked against them when it’s not.

Agree with your points, but some teams get a tougher draw than others when you look at how many times they face the top sides during the season.

 

[gbrussell]

Agree with your points, but some teams get a tougher draw than others when you look at how many times they face the top sides during the season.

The draw can never be completely fair unless every team plays every other team an equal number of times, which at present is impossible.

What also isn’t fair is the allocation of Channel 9 Thursday and Friday night games, when teams who play regularly in those time slots get the advantage of better exposure for their sponsors, and more importantly more time than their next opponent to prepare for their next game.

i do get frustrated that one particular team North of the Border, get more than their fair share of those games.

 

[DinkumDog]

Agree with your points, but some teams get a tougher draw than others when you look at how many times they face the top sides during the season.

It’s not a perfect science Chris - there are so many inputs to the draw and despite complex software algorithms that create it, it’s impossible to get perfect or please everyone. 2023 onwards created more complexity with an odd number of teams but also provides a three byes for each team (in 2022 we had one bye) so I’m sure the teams welcome the extra break given the extra workload. An 18th team (assuming it happens) will add further complexity. I’m quite sure Optimal Planning Solutions make best efforts in creation of the draw - otherwise they wouldn’t also have business from the NFL, MLB, EUFA, AFL etc…

 

[DinkumDog]

The draw can never be completely fair unless every team plays every other team an equal number of times, which at present is impossible.

What also isn’t fair is the allocation of Channel 9 Thursday and Friday night games, when teams who play regularly in those time slots get the advantage of better exposure for their sponsors, and more importantly more time than their next opponent to prepare for their next game.

i do get frustrated that one particular team North of the Border, get more than their fair share of those games.

All about the money. Ponies (and now Dolphins) fans want to watch their team(s) on TV and live. With more games in Brisneyland they’re more likely to go to a game (ticket and other revenue) than stay home and watch two out of town teams on TV. Equally, those who stay home but still prefer to watch Queensland teams generate more eyeballs which means Nine sell those ad slots for a higher rate which in turn allows them more money when they have to stump up for the broadcast rights which fund the club grants and pay the players. Every renewal the NRL wants more money and Nine have to find it from somewhere. That’s why both were in favour of a second Brisbane area team - they could hear the cash register ringing. And yes they would get input to the draw creation - i’d want it too if I was handing over billions to the NRL. I doubt an 18th team will come from Perth or PNG (FNQ) when considering money. I’d say another NZ team gets a look in if anything. Whatever happens will come down to money.

 

[wendog33]

Article from 2019 seems to suggest, from the company spokesman, they do various algorithisms based around all the input from Ch9, NRL, Fox, the club requests, the must have games on certain dates and club traditional rivalry, venue availability etc., then present the many several variations to the NRL and the NRL ultimately decide which variation they prefer of those many options provided to them. Fascinating stuff.

Unbelievable complexity behind the NRL draw

The phenomenal complexity of every season's draw means a sophisticated software firm in Canada is best-placed to assemble each season's NRL Telstra Premiership schedule.

www.nrl.com

 

[flamebouyant]

I know it's early but if this trajectory continues I hope we can have him as our coach for many years to come like Bellamy... Like I said if.

Thats why Gus signed him for 5 years! He knew what he was getting. In fact everything Gus predicted has come to fruition. He fixed our junior systems and our junior teams are all firing, and we are more then competitive this year as he also suggested.
Next year we will be expected to make the 8 and compete for the title, and not just by our supporters expectations.

 

[flamebouyant]

It’s mainly health and fitness.
We did not have the players fit enough to play this type of defence, and had a lot of injuries. Have been somewhat luckier this year with health but their fitness has improved immensely which is key to why defence has been better.
It’s all about effort areas. For example for is not acceptable is Kautoga’s zero effort in getting in front of Blore who ends up scoring the game winning try. A missed tackle is not as bad where you make the effort to get in front. He showed zero effort and cost Dogs the game. Doubt he see’s any first grade for a while now (unless injuries)

Disagree regarding him seeing fg!! Sure he made that mistake, and was subsequently dropped to reserve grade. But he was absolutely on fire last weekend!! Unstoppable. He was demoted, and then busted his arse to show he deserved consideration for first grade again.

 

[gbrussell]

All about the money. Ponies (and now Dolphins) fans want to watch their team(s) on TV and live. With more games in Brisneyland they’re more likely to go to a game (ticket and other revenue) than stay home and watch two out of town teams on TV. Equally, those who stay home but still prefer to watch Queensland teams generate more eyeballs which means Nine sell those ad slots for a higher rate which in turn allows them more money when they have to stump up for the broadcast rights which fund the club grants and pay the players. Every renewal the NRL wants more money and Nine have to find it from somewhere. That’s why both were in favour of a second Brisbane area team - they could hear the cash register ringing. And yes they would get input to the draw creation - i’d want it too if I was handing over billions to the NRL. I doubt an 18th team will come from Perth or PNG (FNQ) when considering money. I’d say another NZ team gets a look in if anything. Whatever happens will come down to money.

I agree with your comments. Regardless of what they are doing and the monetary reasons, it is impossible to make a draw that is completely fair to all teams. Clubs apparently are allowed to rank in order the teams that they wish to play at home, and thus weaker teams can decide to play teams like Penrith and Melbourne just once (and that being away).

I also think the best option for team 18 is another team in NZ. PNG would be a logistical nightmare, and we have enough teams in Queensland. Where a second NZ would play is an interesting conundrum. Since the earthquake put paid to the best stadium in Christchurch (Lancaster Park), the Super Rugby team the Crusaders have been playing at a much smaller venue.

The best stadium on the South Island is the completely enclosed Forsyth Barr in Dunedin where the Bulldogs took a game to a few years ago.

I would think Wellington or Hamilton might be the best option, provided as you suggest the funding is there.

 

[Phalangist]

I agree with your comments. Regardless of what they are doing and the monetary reasons, it is impossible to make a draw that is completely fair to all teams. Clubs apparently are allowed to rank in order the teams that they wish to play at home, and thus weaker teams can decide to play teams like Penrith and Melbourne just once (and that being away).

I also think the best option for team 18 is another team in NZ. PNG would be a logistical nightmare, and we have enough teams in Queensland. Where a second NZ would play is an interesting conundrum. Since the earthquake put paid to the best stadium in Christchurch (Lancaster Park), the Super Rugby team the Crusaders have been playing at a much smaller venue.

The best stadium on the South Island is the completely enclosed Forsyth Barr in Dunedin where the Bulldogs took a game to a few years ago.

I would think Wellington or Hamilton might be the best option, provided as you suggest the funding is there.

it needs to be New Zealand or Perth, I would include both. Not sure what’s better Wellington or Christchurch.All three locations are great for tv with the different time zones

 

[wendog33]

Disagree regarding him seeing fg!! Sure he made that mistake, and was subsequently dropped to reserve grade. But he was absolutely on fire last weekend!! Unstoppable. He was demoted, and then busted his arse to show he deserved consideration for first grade again.

Yeah he was horrible with that miss but did seem to take the stuff up onboard and really picked his game up. Shows he listens and is accountable.

 

[wendog33]

I agree with your comments. Regardless of what they are doing and the monetary reasons, it is impossible to make a draw that is completely fair to all teams. Clubs apparently are allowed to rank in order the teams that they wish to play at home, and thus weaker teams can decide to play teams like Penrith and Melbourne just once (and that being away).

I also think the best option for team 18 is another team in NZ. PNG would be a logistical nightmare, and we have enough teams in Queensland. Where a second NZ would play is an interesting conundrum. Since the earthquake put paid to the best stadium in Christchurch (Lancaster Park), the Super Rugby team the Crusaders have been playing at a much smaller venue.

The best stadium on the South Island is the completely enclosed Forsyth Barr in Dunedin where the Bulldogs took a game to a few years ago.

I would think Wellington or Hamilton might be the best option, provided as you suggest the funding is there.

PNG not just a logistical nightmare. Our son worked for a short time doing a shut down in PNG. The Aussies got threatened. Man handled by security. Couldn't do a thing about it. 2 weeks in he got spat on the back as they queued in the mess. He turned and saw it was PNG security. Couldn't do a thing he said bc they totally control the environment.

Money was unbelievable but he packed his bags and left the next day asap he could get a flight out, bc he knew he wasn't gonna put up with that and had to if he stayed. The security situation is very volatile.

 

[DinkumDog]

I agree with your comments. Regardless of what they are doing and the monetary reasons, it is impossible to make a draw that is completely fair to all teams. Clubs apparently are allowed to rank in order the teams that they wish to play at home, and thus weaker teams can decide to play teams like Penrith and Melbourne just once (and that being away).

I also think the best option for team 18 is another team in NZ. PNG would be a logistical nightmare, and we have enough teams in Queensland. Where a second NZ would play is an interesting conundrum. Since the earthquake put paid to the best stadium in Christchurch (Lancaster Park), the Super Rugby team the Crusaders have been playing at a much smaller venue.

The best stadium on the South Island is the completely enclosed Forsyth Barr in Dunedin where the Bulldogs took a game to a few years ago.

I would think Wellington or Hamilton might be the best option, provided as you suggest the funding is there.

I’m not sure about the first part - the ‘ranking’ bit - that seems not only potentially unfair but would just add more complexity to preparing the draw. Do you have any source for that? I ask not because I’m trying to disagree but would genuinely like to know if that’s true.

The rest, yes, we agree.

 

[gbrussell]

I’m not sure about the first part - the ‘ranking’ bit - that seems not only potentially unfair but would just add more complexity to preparing the draw. Do you have any source for that? I ask not because I’m trying to disagree but would genuinely like to know if that’s true.

The rest, yes, we agree.

I’ve heard Annesley raise that in his briefings. A fair while ago. If it’s changed I haven’t heard about it.

 

[DinkumDog]

I’ve heard Annesley raise that in his briefings. A fair while ago. If it’s changed I haven’t heard about it.

Interesting, thanks.
Something to raise next time I’m talking to club leadership, see what they know/think about this.

 

[D0GMATIC]

PNG not just a logistical nightmare. Our son worked for a short time doing a shut down in PNG. The Aussies got threatened. Man handled by security. Couldn't do a thing about it. 2 weeks in he got spat on the back as they queued in the mess. He turned and saw it was PNG security. Couldn't do a thing he said bc they totally control the environment.

Money was unbelievable but he packed his bags and left the next day asap he could get a flight out, bc he knew he wasn't gonna put up with that and had to if he stayed. The security situation is very volatile.

The PNG idea is purely political. And it could really turn into a political nightmare tbh. The NRL are stupid to consider it. I know it's PNG's national game and all, but it's not the least bit practical of safe

 

[TwinTurbo]

Clubs apparently are allowed to rank in order the teams that they wish to play at home, and thus weaker teams can decide to play teams like Penrith and Melbourne just once (and that being away).

I’m not sure about the first part - the ‘ranking’ bit - that seems not only potentially unfair but would just add more complexity to preparing the draw. Do you have any source for that? I ask not because I’m trying to disagree but would genuinely like to know if that’s true.

I’ve heard Annesley raise that in his briefings. A fair while ago. If it’s changed I haven’t heard about it.

I have certainly heard it mentioned numerous times that Clubs can request certain dates, venues and their opposition based on history, rivalry, tradition, ground availability and capacity etc. They can also give up home games based on financial grounds, for example apparently in previous years we gave up home games for Magic Round.

This is the most definitive publication I have seen of the draw from back in 2012 when Optimal Planning Solutions was appointed;

The process behind the draw

They're the Canadian company behind some of the biggest world sporting organisations’ schedules and their software has been working overtime to finish the draw.

www.nrl.com

With 192 individual events to schedule across venues that involve multiple hirers, while trying to match requests of the 16 clubs, it is an enormous logistical exercise.

"No other sport puts such a priority on club requests.

“It is a number of steps further than just picking each round. The broadcasters are asking for certain matches and time slots and the process of moving just one game can totally change the whole draw.

The algorithm of the Game Scheduling Software calculates the best possible draw derived from a set list of parameters dictated by the sport, in this case, the NRL.

These parameters can range from travel, amount of day and night fixtures, availability of venues, the turnaround between games, consecutive games away from home and the gap between return fixtures to name a few.


I can't say as I have ever read or heard anything that resembles club requesting who they play based on ranking (eg; where they finished last season or what their roster looks like).


Always a Bulldog

 

[DinkumDog]

I have certainly heard it mentioned numerous times that Clubs can request certain dates, venues and their opposition based on history, rivalry, tradition, ground availability and capacity etc. They can also give up home games based on financial grounds, for example apparently in previous years we gave up home games for Magic Round.

I can't say as I have ever read or heard anything that resembles club requesting who they play based on ranking (eg; where they finished last season or what their roster looks like).

Yeah, it makes sense in terms of the traditional derbies ie: Easter, Anzac, June LWE etc but I assume the NRL already accounts for those in the draw so interesting that the clubs could lobby for other changes, some which may be accommodated, others probably not.