What if we have another bad start to the season?

[CaptainJackson]

Personally I don't think he's the 'right' coach as I think we deserve more at this stage. This isn't a hate Pay post, I just haven't seen enough to warrant enough belief that he's the right person to turn us around. In saying that though, who else do you have as coach?

And again this comes back to being realistic about who we are atm, and what we have. The reality is that we'll need to ride the year out with him as coach no matter what, and at the end of the year a new coach will at least have $$$ to play with.

However, maybe Pay doesn continue on with the end of season form and he surprises people including myself. I certainly hope so!

Managing a new coach for 2021, mid season 2020 will be extremely difficult for the club (if it happens), and it will eventually be leaked (just look at the Bennet-Siebold saga). But it's a bullet the club will have to bite (if things aren't ideal).

The thing that concerns me most about pay is Round 1 2019. The lineup was wrong on so many levels and he stuck to it in Rnd 2.

 

[Tassie Devil]

A standard was set in the run home last year. Once you set a standard, any form of regression should be considered a failure.. furthermore, we have strengthened our depth this year and have young players that have a lot more games under their belt.

Fair points and I agree with what you're saying. You're right in that we're in a better position than a year ago. In Pay's words these boys will have 30+ more games in them so will be better. You're right ....

 

[GDR]

Fair points and I agree with what you're saying. You're right in that we're in a better position than a year ago. In Pay's words these boys will have 30+ more games in them so will be better. You're right ....

Just looking for accountability if things go south, not excuses.

But in saying that, I'm am confident that our boys will do us proud if the correct team is selected.

 

[Tassie Devil]

Just looking for accountability if things go south, not excuses.

But in saying that, I'm am confident that our boys will do us proud if the correct team is selected.

Get what you're saying mate and can't knock you for it. I really like that spirit and attitude amongst this playing group and agree that if the right team is selected we'll do reasonably well. However, I just don't feel that the right team will be selected ... well, not before it's too late anyway!

 

[DinkumDog]

Have to agree with this. It's all about expectations ... realistic ones.

Too many on here are losing their shit over things that were never going to be possible anyway. I get that we're the Bulldogs. I get that we should be year in and year out challenging for the ultimate honours. I totally understand all of that.

But we're not in the position to do that, and it's best for all of us to accept that. Personally I'd love to see us competitive week in week out starting with that first game.

But Steve, that means you possess a loser mentality and are accepting of mediocrity .

You’re spot on mate.
We are almost out of the deep trench we were placed in and next year will provide us with roster flexibility we haven’t seen since probably 2015.

Some of our brethren would’ve gotten the bends with some suggestions of the pace of our surfacing .

Whilst we’re unlikely to get to the summit this year, our young squad are definitely capable of punching above their weight.

In the medium term, the business and the brand are positioning for a strong future with a couple of key jigsaw pieces still to go into place, some of which will happen this year.

Soon enough we’ll be back where we belong and all Dogs supporters and hopefully The Kennel will be a happy place but it was never going to be quick.

 

[DinkumDog]

Just looking for accountability if things go south, not excuses.

But in saying that, I'm am confident that our boys will do us proud if the correct team is selected.

I don't see that anyone is above accountability.
Some of the football department staff were moved on last year.
I wish Dean well and if he earns an extension then good luck to him.
But if he doesn't, I don't think he will be automatically provided one.
The question none of his detractors can seem to answer though is who is the alternative for 2021?
There are simply no obvious contenders (at this point).

 

[Bob dog]

Lose the debate making devices.

 

[Tassie Devil]

Lose the debate making devices.

Um .. OK?

 

[Raysie]

Another bad start to the season is just unacceptable.

 

[GDR]

I don't see that anyone is above accountability.
Some of the football department staff were moved on last year.
I wish Dean well and if he earns an extension then good luck to him.
But if he doesn't, I don't think he will be automatically provided one.
The question none of his detractors can seem to answer though is who is the alternative for 2021?
There are simply no obvious contenders (at this point).

I don't really care who tbh.. It wouldn't matter if it was another rookie coach .. all the great coaches were once a rookie.

All I know is, persisting with incompetence is far worse then taking a gamble on a rookie

 

[DinkumDog]

Get what you're saying mate and can't knock you for it. I really like that spirit and attitude amongst this playing group and agree that if the right team is selected we'll do reasonably well. However, I just don't feel that the right team will be selected ... well, not before it's too late anyway!

If that happens then Dean is effectively doing himself out of a job - why would be do that?
He simply must pick the 17 each week he believes will get the chocolates.
Anything else just doesn't add up.

 

[Tassie Devil]

If that happens then Dean is effectively doing himself out of a job - why would be do that?
He simply must pick the 17 each week he believes will get the chocolates.
Anything else just doesn't add up.

Hmm I didn't actually mean he's purposefully picking a team not full of the best players. There's no doubt he wants the best for the club so puts out a team he feels will win the game.

I just question whether the players he puts out there really are the best fit, but as a supporter I don't see the trainings etc so I don't know.

It's a double edged sword here. Let's say he picks Lewis the opening game, and Lewis has a shocker. Every man & his dog on here will be calling for Wakeham to start. I on the other hand will be saying he should stick with Lewis, as if he doesn't then it truly shows he's incompetant and should go.

Pay's been drilling the boys all preseason, will have had 2 trial games to see them perform. When he goes into that opening game he'll have a very good idea of who he wants to be playing and in what way. He'll have run drills, looked at formations etc. etc. If Pay honestly changes the team around after one loss then he's truly lost it for me ...

I know you're all calling for quick changes if the results don't match, but to me that shows weakness, poor selection abilities and untimately someone who really doesn't deserve to coach this club ...

 

[sgodllubsti]

if we have a poor start to the season, I think the pressure will be more on the board than dean pay, its in the board's hands to make the call, lyn and the board will have everything directed at them

 

[DinkumDog]

Hmm I didn't actually mean he's purposefully picking a team not full of the best players. There's no doubt he wants the best for the club so puts out a team he feels will win the game.

I just question whether the players he puts out there really are the best fit, but as a supporter I don't see the trainings etc so I don't know.

It's a double edged sword here. Let's say he picks Lewis the opening game, and Lewis has a shocker. Every man & his dog on here will be calling for Wakeham to start. I on the other hand will be saying he should stick with Lewis, as if he doesn't then it truly shows he's incompetant and should go.

Pay's been drilling the boys all preseason, will have had 2 trial games to see them perform. When he goes into that opening game he'll have a very good idea of who he wants to be playing and in what way. He'll have run drills, looked at formations etc. etc. If Pay honestly changes the team around after one loss then he's truly lost it for me ...

I know you're all calling for quick changes if the results don't match, but to me that shows weakness, poor selection abilities and untimately someone who really doesn't deserve to coach this club ...

100% agree mate. Chopping and changing for the sake of it doesn't work.
I've never believed the 'Pay's Pet's' theory and don't believe (as an example) he'd simply pick Lewis over Wakeham without valid reason.
And yes, the coaching staff would see way more than what the Kennel sees - not just ability, but attitude, combinations etc.
Bottom line is he can't be doing it out of sheer incompetence as some charge.
Inexperience, yes, but he's had two years to improve that and the back end of last year showed us that some of those methods were starting to click.
I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt to see how our season starts before leaping to any conclusions either way and I think the board did exactly the same - extended him by 1 year to have flexibility either way depending on how things are going in our final year of roster restrictions.

 

[DinkumDog]

if we have a poor start to the season, I think the pressure will be more on the board than dean pay, its in the board's hands to make the call, lyn and the board will have everything directed at them

I'm not sure how given they were just re-elected for two years only two weeks ago?
Irrespective Pay's fate is in their hands - it's their call if he stays or goes...

 

[TwinTurbo]

Apart from the $$ out of the cap i dont even see foz out as a setback as he rarely plays anyway

It seems like it doesn't it, but the fact is he has played in 26 games over the 2 years, which is bit more than half, I was surprised it was that many.

Go Dogs

 

[TwinTurbo]

Personally I don't think he's the 'right' coach as I think we deserve more at this stage.

The same old question, who?

People seem to forget that we had an open invitation for any coach to come and join us, with a decent budget to pay them. The result, 3 were interested, 1 looked at the books and walked away and we selected from the other 2.

Go Dogs

 

[CaptainJackson]

A standard was set in the run home last year. Once you set a standard, any form of regression should be considered a failure.. furthermore, we have strengthened our depth this year and have young players that have a lot more games under their belt.

Don't forget though while the team performed well in defense it was only with foran that we had any teeth in attack.

 

[KambahOne]

This is a genuine question, What do we say happens if we have another slow start to the first half of the season just like previous? Will we finally bite the bullet? I look forward to hearing your opinions on this

I don't usually post in this forum as it's your guys inner sanctum, but wouldn't a better question be "would a bad start to the season be acceptable as long as the squad is genuinely putting in and you're seeing improvement?"

From all I've read about Pay and his comments, defence is going to be a focus for your squad in 2020 so if you're losing games 8-6 or 14-10 against the better teams, would many see that as improvement?

 

[Wahesh]

I don't usually post in this forum as it's your guys inner sanctum, but wouldn't a better question be "would a bad start to the season be acceptable as long as the squad is genuinely putting in and you're seeing improvement?"

From all I've read about Pay and his comments, defence is going to be a focus for your squad in 2020 so if you're losing games 8-6 or 14-10 against the better teams, would many see that as improvement?

Not really. We've been losing many close games in recent years. The game against the Storm last year comes to mind. An improvement this year of these narrow loses is narrow victories.