Train Discussion Megathread - Etiquette / Strikes / Gripes

[CaptainJackson]

Come on man, if peoples trains don’t arrive they don’t think oh Alex Claassens is on a committee to ensure that Labor are elected and was handing out Labor how to vote cards in a red labor T-shirt at the federal election they blame the current government. That goes with anything.

I’ve said here previously that I think Labor will win in March. I’ve also said I’m leaning towards voting for them but my second worry (after Chris Minns being so western Sydney centric) is that Minns doesn’t seem to have the balls to even call the union and tell them to pull their heads in. He admitted himself that he isn’t happy with the strike action but hasn’t called them.

I think it’s the unions more following what they’ve been instructed at the IRC rather than being ethical. Let’s see how this pans out. I very rarely catch a train so it doesn’t worry me personally but as I’ve touched on, they are all lucky they kept a very good paying job when others didn’t have a job. I’m not anti union but still can’t agree they are ethical at all

The general public think of unions as a collective and think of the unions being the same as Labor, not specifically Alex Classens. And as shown by the SMH calling the previous problem a 'strike' (when it was cancellation by the state government), the public lapped up the SMH's 'strike' headlines and abused train workers. If in this industrial action predicament, the unions are acting unethically then again this is going to blow black on Labor again. So again I don't see how Labor or the unions have planned this to help Labor in next years elections, and again Labor already has ICAC and John Baralillo to use to attack state Libs credibility, they have no need for this industrial action.

Minns not calling the unions and not having sway over them, doesn't this show that while Labor and the Unions have a relationship, that their connections aren't that strong that they can sway the other to do what they want to do.

Again the unions have acted ethically within the realm of industrial action. Workers going on strike and affecting their employers bottom dollar is always going to be 'unethical' in a ways but when coupled with industrial action, the purpose/history of industrial action, then the unions have acted ethically in this current negotiation.

And this idea that they are "lucky they kept a very good paying job when others didn't have a job" is not relevant in wanting better working conditions. Given the concerns about the new trains, it's those train drivers/station guards, who have to live with that trauma when something happens to a passenger.

 

[Natboy]

The general public think of unions as a collective and think of the unions being the same as Labor, not specifically Alex Classens. And as shown by the SMH calling the previous problem a 'strike' (when it was cancellation by the state government), the public lapped up the SMH's 'strike' headlines and abused train workers. If in this industrial action predicament, the unions are acting unethically then again this is going to blow black on Labor again. So again I don't see how Labor or the unions have planned this to help Labor in next years elections, and again Labor already has ICAC and John Baralillo to use to attack state Libs credibility, they have no need for this industrial action.

Minns not calling the unions and not having sway over them, doesn't this show that while Labor and the Unions have a relationship, that their connections aren't that strong that they can sway the other to do what they want to do.

Again the unions have acted ethically within the realm of industrial action. Workers going on strike and affecting their employers bottom dollar is always going to be 'unethical' in a ways but when coupled with industrial action, the purpose/history of industrial action, then the unions have acted ethically in this current negotiation.

And this idea that they are "lucky they kept a very good paying job when others didn't have a job" is not relevant in wanting better working conditions. Given the concerns about the new trains, it's those train drivers/station guards, who have to live with that trauma when something happens to a passenger.

I’ve said my opinion but if the drivers were given a 50% payrise I get the feeling they’d quickly forget about “passenger safety”

 

[CaptainJackson]

I’ve said my opinion but if the drivers were given a 50% payrise I get the feeling they’d quickly forget about “passenger safety”

They were offered a $18,000 bonus each worker, earlier this year to forget the safety requirements, they rejected that bonus.

 

[Natboy]

They were offered a $18,000 bonus each worker, earlier this year to forget the safety requirements, they rejected that bonus.

Yes because they are greedy and want more. Look how much they are already on. Way overpaid

 

[N4TE]

If the 6:33am from Lewisham….Fucking AM doesn’t turn up and it says the next train will be 42 minutes that’s the end of the story fuck off fucking fix it. I don’t give a living shit about the ins and outs you pricks sort that out but fix it.Today

 

[Natboy]

If the 6:33am from Lewisham….Fucking AM doesn’t turn up and it says the next train will be 42 minutes that’s the end of the story fuck off fucking fix it. I don’t give a living shit about the ins and outs you pricks sort that out but fix it.Today

There might’ve been some chewing gum under a seat. It would be so frustrating for you mate

 

[N4TE]

There might’ve been some chewing gum under a seat. It would be so frustrating for you mate

It’s ridiculous like come on I have paid my fares my whole life I don’t expect much but I want an on time train. Otherwise what’s the actual point. Maybe the train will turn up or maybe not.

 

[Natboy]

It’s ridiculous like come on I have paid my fares my whole life I don’t expect much but I want an on time train. Otherwise what’s the actual point. Maybe the train will turn up or maybe not.

It’s not a lot to ask and not cheap for such a poor and unreliable service

 

[N4TE]

It’s not a lot to ask and not cheap for such a poor and unreliable service

I will say I haven’t had a problem with Transport NSW for years but these strikes when you run down to the station because you really want to make the 6:33am and you are all hot and sweaty all your own doing because you fucked around getting ready for work but you still just made it then the train has been canceled anyway because of strikes and next train is 42 minutes. Yep not fucking going down well with the average punter like me.

I could have been home wanking or making paper planes or something more constructive than standing on a fucking platform looking at Instagram and The kennel

 

[Ecca]

Yes because they are greedy and want more. Look how much they are already on. Way overpaid

Overpaid?

I am on a rate of 82,000 per year everything above this is a result of my working late evenings early mornings working 12 days in 14, public holidays and weekends.

I surrender my relationships with those I love and care for in order to provide for them.

Overpaid.... Go and get fucked

 

[Ecca]

Sorry mate you sound like Alex. I’d like to know specifically what the safety issues are if it’s not about pay?

Some I know are in union and some aren’t. What they are reading ie documents from your union, the government, FWC etc. It doesn’t get more official than that.

I hope greed doesn’t backfire because robots won’t strike, call in sick or makes things political

Safety issues.

The camera is partially obscured by the doors when they are open

They have minimal visibility when raining

They don't show things under a metre high when close to the door (so kids)

The driver has 2 backlit screens between them and the track (we all know what light in the car does to visibility whilst driving)

The intercom on the train is placed in a position that requires the driver to let go of the controls to answer.

No one physically watches the train depart the platform (a person's life was saved at Tascott just this week due to the guard having their door open)

The driver checks up to 10 tiny camera images on 1 screen to make sure there are no safety issues prior to departure.

The emergency button instead of going to the driver or guard when pressed goes to a call centre who then will relay the information on to the driver (so there is a delay in responding and potentially a lack of clarity as to the issue)

This is just off the top of my head, and I can assure you there are PLENTY OF OTHERS.

 

[BELMORE]

Safety issues.

The camera is partially obscured by the doors when they are open

They have minimal visibility when raining

They don't show things under a metre high when close to the door (so kids)

The driver has 2 backlit screens between them and the track (we all know what light in the car does to visibility whilst driving)

The intercom on the train is placed in a position that requires the driver to let go of the controls to answer.

No one physically watches the train depart the platform (a person's life was saved at Tascott just this week due to the guard having their door open)

The driver checks up to 10 tiny camera images on 1 screen to make sure there are no safety issues prior to departure.

The emergency button instead of going to the driver or guard when pressed goes to a call centre who then will relay the information on to the driver (so there is a delay in responding and potentially a lack of clarity as to the issue)

This is just off the top of my head, and I can assure you there are PLENTY OF OTHERS.

Just launch MVP and patch later

 

[Blueandwhiteblood1968]

yes and then you get the girls who think the whole train wants to hear their gossip.

and the IPOD that i can hear from the other end of the train!!

Then you have those who like to sing a long with their IPOD!!!

Maybe they should have karaoke on the train.

 

[Natboy]

Safety issues.

The camera is partially obscured by the doors when they are open

They have minimal visibility when raining

They don't show things under a metre high when close to the door (so kids)

The driver has 2 backlit screens between them and the track (we all know what light in the car does to visibility whilst driving)

The intercom on the train is placed in a position that requires the driver to let go of the controls to answer.

No one physically watches the train depart the platform (a person's life was saved at Tascott just this week due to the guard having their door open)

The driver checks up to 10 tiny camera images on 1 screen to make sure there are no safety issues prior to departure.

The emergency button instead of going to the driver or guard when pressed goes to a call centre who then will relay the information on to the driver (so there is a delay in responding and potentially a lack of clarity as to the issue)

This is just off the top of my head, and I can assure you there are PLENTY OF OTHERS.

Mate some of those guards are too fat to walk let alone take safety seriously. CCTV monitors so much these days. You guys need to move with the times and just do your job or we’ll get someone who will. I didn’t mean to offend you but 82k base to drive a train is pretty bloody good and I know you get very good benefits. No one holds a gun to your head to work overtime etc

 

[Ecca]

Mate some of those guards are too fat to walk let alone take safety seriously. CCTV monitors so much these days. You guys need to move with the times and just do your job or we’ll get someone who will. I didn’t mean to offend you but 82k base to drive a train is pretty bloody good and I know you get very good benefits. No one holds a gun to your head to work overtime etc

CCTV will still be used, and is currently used on newer sets to compliment and enhance the human component. The technology purchased by our beloved leaders in no way advanced enough to remove the human factors.

You can tell you're running out of points when you start fat shaming.

Re overtime - it is written into our EA that we must do a reasonable amount of overtime.

And we are required to make ourselves available on one of our days off per fortnight for overtime if needed. So, yeah, gun to our head

 

[Natboy]

CCTV will still be used, and is currently used on newer sets to compliment and enhance the human component. The technology purchased by our beloved leaders in no way advanced enough to remove the human factors.

You can tell you're running out of points when you start fat shaming.

Re overtime - it is written into our EA that we must do a reasonable amount of overtime.

And we are required to make ourselves available on one of our days off per fortnight for overtime if needed. So, yeah, gun to our head

When you’re sitting around watching movies or sleeping on paid standby? I’ve been told that it’s near impossible to enforce any sort of discipline because of the union so not sure what would happen if you said you were too sick to take overtime.

As I said it’s nothing person and I’m not trying to offend you mate but it just seems like it’s more concern about being replaced by technology than worrying about passenger safety.
Paid training without the need for tertiary qualifications or an apprenticeship and starting on that salary is a very good wicket these days.

Honestly if you were each offered a 50k annual payrise with no safety changes would you take it?

 

[Ecca]

When you’re sitting around watching movies or sleeping on paid standby? I’ve been told that it’s near impossible to enforce any sort of discipline because of the union so not sure what would happen if you said you were too sick to take overtime.

As I said it’s nothing person and I’m not trying to offend you mate but it just seems like it’s more concern about being replaced by technology than worrying about passenger safety.
Paid training without the need for tertiary qualifications or an apprenticeship and starting on that salary is a very good wicket these days.

Honestly if you were each offered a 50k annual payrise with no safety changes would you take it?

Stand by are rostered shifts yes, and they are there to cover unexpected sick leave, or when incidents occur etc.

I work on the Intercity side of the ledger, and we are so short staffed I haven't had a standby shift where I got to "sit around" in recent memory.

Unfortunately management think it's their right to tell us to do things we shouldn't do, and force us to work past our shift finish times, and they simply can't do it, then they complain about it.

If I was offered 50k , well, yeah that's a life changing pay raise sure, but, considering I have had 7 people fall between the train and the platform (including young 2 kids) in my time, and the guard is the reason they were saved, I do not think any money could compensate me for the PTSD I would suffer when a kid dies because of my actions, which would be by the book and I wouldn't be held accountable, but which are completely avoidable. So no I wouldn't do it

 

[Natboy]

Stand by are rostered shifts yes, and they are there to cover unexpected sick leave, or when incidents occur etc.

I work on the Intercity side of the ledger, and we are so short staffed I haven't had a standby shift where I got to "sit around" in recent memory.

Unfortunately management think it's their right to tell us to do things we shouldn't do, and force us to work past our shift finish times, and they simply can't do it, then they complain about it.

If I was offered 50k , well, yeah that's a life changing pay raise sure, but, considering I have had 7 people fall between the train and the platform (including young 2 kids) in my time, and the guard is the reason they were saved, I do not think any money could compensate me for the PTSD I would suffer when a kid dies because of my actions, which would be by the book and I wouldn't be held accountable, but which are completely avoidable. So no I wouldn't do it

Fair enough but as I said I get the feeling that all of those safety concerns could be addressed and then something else would pop up. That’s consistently happened with your union so I don’t know why it would change now

I get your point about the overtime but I also know dozens of people who call and abuse roster staff for not giving them enough overtime too. When they are offered OT they say no. You must admit there are a lot of dinosaurs in the rail who are pretty bloody lazy haha

 

[Bob dog]

Sydney Trains not running its electrics because the drivers couldn't log onto Network Control when they should have the old hand held two ways, sure safety is an issue but leaving people stranded is also an issue, trains ran alright thirty years ago.

 

[2144superman]

Yes because they are greedy and want more. Look how much they are already on. Way overpaid

LOL heyyyy ...my ears were burning