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TwinTurbo

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Exactly we have a whole heap of shirt grabbers in this team
Since the NRL cracked down on hip drops that aren't even hip drops shirt grabbing is pretty much all we are allowed to do. Not to mention the phantom HIA's that get blamed n the tackler. Of course other teams are allowed to lift forearms, knock out players, drop elbows, wrestle, hold down for 4 seconds or more etc etc. But not us, even the slightest hint warrants a penalty.


Always a Bulldog
 
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no1bulldog

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Surely he has less missed tackles than Alamoti? Or do you have to lay a hand on them for it to be a missed tackle?
 

Lynchpin

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You’re saying it was a perfectly executed plan? That the plan was always for Grub to displace Flanagan?
No, he was added to the Top 30 with a purpose in mind; to tide the team over while we sorted out the halves/bench utility, and to bring some experience & enthusiasm to the table...and that's what he did.

No one knew at the time if Flanagan would step up (most knew he probably wouldn't - 3rd year's a charm) or that we'd go out and grab Oloapu to fill a halves spot. What was known is that there was a gap, albeit a temporary one, and Ciraldo decided Reynolds was the man for the job - and he did it. (successfully I would argue).

You're trying to argue that: 'The Grub thing unsurprisingly backfired' while at the same time trying to claim I am using '20/20 hindsight' (implying that I am citing something that worked well, after the event) - well which is it? '20/20 hindsight' or an 'unsurprising backfire'?

Let's cut to the chase. You don't like Reynolds. You don't like that he was invited back. You don't like Ciraldo included him in the Top 30. You don't like that Ciraldo selected and played him in 1st grade. You will look through any lens you can find or manufacture to confirm your preconception: 'He doesn’t belong near a 2023 Top 30.'

Maybe pause, take a seat, and think it through...
 

DinkumDog

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No, he was added to the Top 30 with a purpose in mind; to tide the team over while we sorted out the halves/bench utility, and to bring some experience & enthusiasm to the table...and that's what he did.

No one knew at the time if Flanagan would step up (most knew he probably wouldn't - 3rd year's a charm) or that we'd go out and grab Oloapu to fill a halves spot. What was known is that there was a gap, albeit a temporary one, and Ciraldo decided Reynolds was the man for the job - and he did it. (successfully I would argue).

You're trying to argue that: 'The Grub thing unsurprisingly backfired' while at the same time trying to claim I am using '20/20 hindsight' (implying that I am citing something that worked well, after the event) - well which is it? '20/20 hindsight' or an 'unsurprising backfire'?

Let's cut to the chase. You don't like Reynolds. You don't like that he was invited back. You don't like Ciraldo included him in the Top 30. You don't like that Ciraldo selected and played him in 1st grade. You will look through any lens you can find or manufacture to confirm your preconception: 'He doesn’t belong near a 2023 Top 30.'

Maybe pause, take a seat, and think it through...
There's no lens, seat nor pause needed (but thanks).
There’s just the facts and history.
I'm more than happy to admit I'm not a Grub fan and never really was. His mouth has always been bigger than his talent.
Although young, he was thoroughly outplayed by Gareth Widdop in the 2012 Grand Final.
They say you have to lose one to win one yet in 2014 he was even more outplayed by Luke Keary.

But just like the above the results speak for themselves, he didn't go well at the Tigers nor in England (injury aside) either.
Nor has he gone well in 2023 back at Belmore.

No idea what your point is re: 20/20 or backfire. I'm suggesting you're using hindsight to defend him whilst I predicted that it wouldn't work and I think that's the way it's played out. My pre-season posts on here say that too - that if anything he should've only been brought back to the club for a community role, not an on field role. Yes, there was/is a gap, yes there is a shortage of playmakers across the code so maybe Ciro and Gus felt he was the only choice of a poor set of options - but if he was genuinely helping us, he'd still be in the team and he's not. I’ll happily eat my words at 4pm today if he’s named against the Chooks, but halfway through the season and if he’s not even being used off the bench that’s pretty telling.

Nothing personal mate, just don't agree with you.
 

Hound Dog

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It’s a misleading stat, Reed leads the defensive line, he’s making a lot of tackles under fatigue, hes trying to put on big shots to inspire his team, practically doing everything he can to will his side to victory…. That comes with some missed tackles, wouldn’t swap him for anyone.
This, 100% stats don't always tell the full story, they're definitely useful but doesn't give the full picture.

We've been at this stage for many years, where nearly every player(forwards too) are able to beat the first man, not necessarily a step, they swerve their run and can gain that extra few metres then be able to manage a pass offload or put the defender off so they don't get lined up by the defence- it happens naturally that most of the time viewers won't see this unless we're there standing close in the defensive line.

Reed Mahoney doing what he does, and especially pressure from markers helps against this, as naturally the ball runner will try 'dodging' or swerving from that defence then to be cleaned up by the 'support' defence.

It'll obviously be better having a solid fast unbroken defensive line for the full 80 and they should always work towards it but it's impossible, these tactics help, Mahoney does a great job (the negative is that it counts as a missed tackle by him). The pros outweighs the cons as long as his teammates stay switched on
 

Lynchpin

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Nothing personal mate, just don't agree with you.
Likewise.

No idea what your point is re: 20/20 or backfire.
Really? Even though I explained it explicitly?

There’s just the facts and history.
You're citing neither.
You're offering a subjective view (a negative one) of Reynolds' contribution, which you are of course entitled to.

We disagree (clearly) - which is fine by me. I think he was chosen by Ciraldo to do a limited job (in scope and in duration) and he's done that. Mission accomplished - I don't expect you'll see him in the team this afternoon, nor for the rest of the season unless we get injuries (or possibly, if Fizzler gets a chubby over Burton and keeps him out ahead of Origin 3).
That's not 20/20 hindsight. You could look back (if one could be bothered) and see many, including me, hypothesising that this is how it might pan out.
 

DinkumDog

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You're citing neither.
You're offering a subjective view (a negative one) of Reynolds' contribution
I'm not citing facts and history?

So we didn’t lose the 2012 GF when we were arguably the best team that year? We had a great pack and largely strong backline too. What was our Achilles Heel? I'd argue Reynolds/Keating vs Widdop/Cronk.

Same in 2014, Reynolds and Hodko vs Keary and A Reynolds. Yes, they also had Inglis and Ennis was out, there were factors, but our playmakers were weak.

If, by the time Grub was allegedly entering his prime why did we not keep him? Yes, the Tigers made him a crazy offer which they got almost $0 value from, but we were also smart enough not to enter a bidding war because he just wasn't worth top dollar - ever.

But let's focus on this year. If his 'experience' and 'leadership' were truly valuable, why was he started only for 3 games after Flanagan was dumped before an 18 year old kid (who by your reasoning Grub was 'easing in') replaced him? Why is he not even on the bench as a utility? It's because he's never changed: he can't keep his cool, he can't execute any quality plays and the only truly 'Bulldog' thing about him is that he lives in Belmore and loves the club and community. I don't dislike him personally, I've met him at Accor Stadium Member functions and he's the goofy friendly guy you expect. But I do expect better from high paid (in his prime) first grade halves - and I just don't think he ever really stood up to that measurement.
 

dogzofwar

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Since the NRL cracked down on hip drops that aren't even hip drops shirt grabbing is pretty much all we are allowed to do. Not to mention the phantom HIA's that get blamed n the tackler. Of course other teams are allowed to lift forearms, knock out players, drop elbows, wrestle, hold down for 4 seconds or more etc etc. But not us, even the slightest hint warrants a penalty.


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Not an excuse though you can tackle around the legs
 

TwinTurbo

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Not an excuse though you can tackle around the legs
Of course you can but the ref then screams get off, get off, get off, pushes the defender into allowing a fast play the ball or, if they don't immediately release, penalises them. There is no reward for the classic well executed legs tackle, it's a no win after that.


Always a Bulldog
 

Hound Dog

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I'm interested in Cameron McInnes use this season at the Sharks. They've been doing well, he's been getting a lot of minutes, not sure how it translates in these statistics.
He's your typical hooker (177cm), being used and rotated as a prop of all things, 2nd rower, off the bench and lock playing many minutes.
I don't watch many Sharks games but can see he's being used due to his work and little ball playing. From what I see, he just manages to get quick play the balls and that's probably all the coach wants from him when playing prop (plus his smart and high work rate at tackling).

Pretty much it shows it's not solely about metres gained from a single run but the overall set progress because the defensive line is always going to have to track back 10m, so even if a "prop" makes 7m for eg rather than the usually anticipated 10m, that tackle still results in the defence moving back 10m and possibly caught off guard for a run off a quick play the ball and the other benefits that come from.

Someone like Kurtis Morrin exposes this, it's sometimes beneficial having that smart quick mobile workhorse "prop" rather than your typical big boppers.
I'd like to see what stats indicate or compare with these types of players but the easiest stat to refer to is that Sharks are high on ladder with McInnes playing a lot, that wont obviously indicate much but he would've been dropped by now if it was a bad strat. At the moment he's injured.

There's no set way to play Rugby League, most coaches conform to what's in the norm but most have their own tactics and philosophies.
 

Berries

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I'm not citing facts and history?

So we didn’t lose the 2012 GF when we were arguably the best team that year? We had a great pack and largely strong backline too. What was our Achilles Heel? I'd argue Reynolds/Keating vs Widdop/Cronk.

Same in 2014, Reynolds and Hodko vs Keary and A Reynolds. Yes, they also had Inglis and Ennis was out, there were factors, but our playmakers were weak.

If, by the time Grub was allegedly entering his prime why did we not keep him? Yes, the Tigers made him a crazy offer which they got almost $0 value from, but we were also smart enough not to enter a bidding war because he just wasn't worth top dollar - ever.

But let's focus on this year. If his 'experience' and 'leadership' were truly valuable, why was he started only for 3 games after Flanagan was dumped before an 18 year old kid (who by your reasoning Grub was 'easing in') replaced him? Why is he not even on the bench as a utility? It's because he's never changed: he can't keep his cool, he can't execute any quality plays and the only truly 'Bulldog' thing about him is that he lives in Belmore and loves the club and community. I don't dislike him personally, I've met him at Accor Stadium Member functions and he's the goofy friendly guy you expect. But I do expect better from high paid (in his prime) first grade halves - and I just don't think he ever really stood up to that measurement.
Keating had a job too, he perfectly linked the backline up and created a lot of Barbas space. Reynolds offered absolutely nothing to that team. We win 2 comps with anyone but him in that role.
 

Lynchpin

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He's your typical hooker (177cm), being used and rotated as a prop of all things, 2nd rower
This is impossible. Cannot happen. Can never happen!
He's "too small" to play in the back row or at prop.
The Kennel Brains Trust told me that...
 

D.O.W.

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I'm interested in Cameron McInnes use this season at the Sharks. They've been doing well, he's been getting a lot of minutes, not sure how it translates in these statistics.
He's your typical hooker (177cm), being used and rotated as a prop of all things, 2nd rower, off the bench and lock playing many minutes.
I don't watch many Sharks games but can see he's being used due to his work and little ball playing. From what I see, he just manages to get quick play the balls and that's probably all the coach wants from him when playing prop (plus his smart and high work rate at tackling).

Pretty much it shows it's not solely about metres gained from a single run but the overall set progress because the defensive line is always going to have to track back 10m, so even if a "prop" makes 7m for eg rather than the usually anticipated 10m, that tackle still results in the defence moving back 10m and possibly caught off guard for a run off a quick play the ball and the other benefits that come from.

Someone like Kurtis Morrin exposes this, it's sometimes beneficial having that smart quick mobile workhorse "prop" rather than your typical big boppers.
I'd like to see what stats indicate or compare with these types of players but the easiest stat to refer to is that Sharks are high on ladder with McInnes playing a lot, that wont obviously indicate much but he would've been dropped by now if it was a bad strat. At the moment he's injured.

There's no set way to play Rugby League, most coaches conform to what's in the norm but most have their own tactics and philosophies.
I really like Morrin, good leg speed, decent engine, goes hard and uses every inch of his frame in contact.
 

ILiveForDib

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Yeah sack Mahoney and bring in a passionless prick like Cheese I reckon
 

Dogs Of War

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I'm interested in Cameron McInnes use this season at the Sharks. They've been doing well, he's been getting a lot of minutes, not sure how it translates in these statistics.
He's your typical hooker (177cm), being used and rotated as a prop of all things, 2nd rower, off the bench and lock playing many minutes.
I don't watch many Sharks games but can see he's being used due to his work and little ball playing. From what I see, he just manages to get quick play the balls and that's probably all the coach wants from him when playing prop (plus his smart and high work rate at tackling).

Pretty much it shows it's not solely about metres gained from a single run but the overall set progress because the defensive line is always going to have to track back 10m, so even if a "prop" makes 7m for eg rather than the usually anticipated 10m, that tackle still results in the defence moving back 10m and possibly caught off guard for a run off a quick play the ball and the other benefits that come from.

Someone like Kurtis Morrin exposes this, it's sometimes beneficial having that smart quick mobile workhorse "prop" rather than your typical big boppers.
I'd like to see what stats indicate or compare with these types of players but the easiest stat to refer to is that Sharks are high on ladder with McInnes playing a lot, that wont obviously indicate much but he would've been dropped by now if it was a bad strat. At the moment he's injured.

There's no set way to play Rugby League, most coaches conform to what's in the norm but most have their own tactics and philosophies.
When the Dragons went with that smaller forward pack in the Mary years, they came out of the blocks well, always winning lots of games. But tackling all those big boppers took it's toll and they would fade towards the end of the year. Not to say you don't have a few, it's really how you use them.
 

dogwhisperer

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Did an eye test the other day, optometrist said one of my eyes was blue and the other one was white.
 

Powerslide

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Did an eye test the other day, optometrist said one of my eyes was blue and the other one was white.
Both of my eyes are blue (Iris) and white (Sclera), but eyesight out of one eye is pretty poor...
 
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