Official Round 3 v Manly Match Discussion

D0GMATIC

Kennel Legend
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
12,078
Reaction score
13,664
Whilst it was certainly disappointing to be so close and lose again, it wasn't disheartening. We were in the game for 80 mins like last week. How many times could we say that last year ? We lacked direction and composure. Wakeham going off for a while didnt help. I know this wont be very popular, but we could do worse than give Flanno another shot, his goal kicking and kicking in general play would take some pressure off Burto, and his organisational skills could only help our attack have some structure. If he takes the conversions tonight, we win.
 

D0GMATIC

Kennel Legend
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
12,078
Reaction score
13,664
Whats bloody wrong with our right side defence, no better than with OK.
Okunbor wasnt the problem,he was a symptom of the problem. Burns has a tendency to move in field when defending, which doesn't leave the winger much alternative but to do the same
 

Marki

Kennel Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 16, 2021
Messages
3,063
Reaction score
3,676
Whilst it was certainly disappointing to be so close and lose again, it wasn't disheartening. We were in the game for 80 mins like last week. How many times could we say that last year ? We lacked direction and composure. Wakeham going off for a while didnt help. I know this wont be very popular, but we could do worse than give Flanno another shot, his goal kicking and kicking in general play would take some pressure off Burto, and his organisational skills could only help our attack have some structure. If he takes the conversions tonight, we win.
His conversion attempts weren't horid.
One hit the post, the other just missed from the sideline.
I know Garrick had same type of kicks (10m infield and sideline) and nailed them both but he's a seasoned 85-90% goalkicker and has probably been practising at brookvale all season.

Blaming the goalkicks is a cop-out.
All tries were scored in the first half.
We had all second half to win the game and couldn't. Blame the attack.
 

CrittaMagic69

Kennel Immortal
Premium Member
Gilded
SC H2H Champion
2 x SC Draft Champ
Joined
Nov 15, 2013
Messages
73,003
Reaction score
78,719
The team was overall worse because of Averillo --> Wakeham?
Yes, clearly. The positives from the last 2 weeks weren't there and people seriously want to believe a key change had nothing to do with it? Baz bottled it and it's as simple as that. He made Jake the halfback for a reason and to go away from that after just two games despite some positives signs and combinations building was an incredibly dumb decision. He basically threw away all that we worked on because last week Burton didn't ground the ball, because Naden bombed two tries by not passing to JAC, because Okunbor dogged it with the line wide open, because Waddell was caught short, because TPJ was caught short, etc.

Burton had his worst game for us and it had nothing to do with his halves partner that he worked with the most during pre season being replaced? JMK had his biggest dumbfuck game also, again had nothing to do with the half being replaced? lol please. Wakeham didn't even trial with Burton LOL, it's like it wasn't even a consideration in Baz's mind a couple weeks ago. Nothing but panic stations from Baz once again, more panic leads to more dumb decisions like shifting out best centre to wing or reducing Max Kings minutes because why?? Nothing but down hill from here. Glad everyone on here got what they wanted.
 

Marki

Kennel Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 16, 2021
Messages
3,063
Reaction score
3,676
The problem I have with our team is we still dont have a go-to plan.

Think of this....
Imagine its the 60th minute and we are down by 4 and have the ball returned on our 30m with 6 tackles.

What is our strategy? Do we have one? How many sets or tackles do we need to score? To create a try? Do we have anything? Or do just see out the set and wait for a mistake by the opposition?

There's the problem right there.
 

D0GMATIC

Kennel Legend
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
12,078
Reaction score
13,664
His conversion attempts weren't horid.
One hit the post, the other just missed from the sideline.
I know Garrick had same type of kicks (10m infield and sideline) and nailed them both but he's a seasoned 85-90% goalkicker and has probably been practising at brookvale all season.

Blaming the goalkicks is a cop-out.
All tries were scored in the first half.
We had all second half to win the game and couldn't. Blame the attack.
Im not blaming Burton for the loss. But i think a right footed kicker kicks that goal that hit the post. Garrick doesn't have to worry about being a play maker or kicking in general play either
 

D0GMATIC

Kennel Legend
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
12,078
Reaction score
13,664
The problem I have with our team is we still dont have a go-to plan.

Think of this....
Imagine its the 60th minute and we are down by 4 and have the ball returned on our 30m with 6 tackles.

What is our strategy? Do we have one? How many sets or tackles do we need to score? To create a try? Do we have anything? Or do just see out the set and wait for a mistake by the opposition?

There's the problem right there.
I think Flanno could help with those issues
 

COVENS

Kennel Addict
Premium Member
Gilded
Joined
Sep 18, 2015
Messages
5,044
Reaction score
5,243
Yes, clearly. The positives from the last 2 weeks weren't there and people seriously want to believe a key change had nothing to do with it? Baz bottled it and it's as simple as that. He made Jake the halfback for a reason and to go away from that after just two games despite some positives signs and combinations building was an incredibly dumb decision. He basically threw away all that we worked on because last week Burton didn't ground the ball, because Naden bombed two tries by not passing to JAC, because Okunbor dogged it with the line wide open, because Waddell was caught short, because TPJ was caught short, etc.

Burton had his worst game for us and it had nothing to do with his halves partner that he worked with the most during pre season being replaced? JMK had his biggest dumbfuck game also, again had nothing to do with the half being replaced? lol please. Wakeham didn't even trial with Burton LOL, it's like it wasn't even a consideration in Baz's mind a couple weeks ago. Nothing but panic stations from Baz once again, more panic leads to more dumb decisions like shifting out best centre to wing or reducing Max Kings minutes because why?? Nothing but down hill from here. Glad everyone on here got what they wanted.
Need to re-watch the game but I felt initially that:
1. Jackson was particularly disruptive tonight.
2. The Burns/Schoupp thing was weird - Naden should have shifted to right wing tonight.
3. The middles rotation was bizarre, but affected by the Hetherington injury.
4. There's a disconnect with Burton's role in midfield to attacking positions, he can't be getting tackled on the 4th for no good reason, he should never be serving dummy half either - neither are Wakeham's fault, like they wouldn't be Jake, Kyle or Bailey's fault.
 

D0GMATIC

Kennel Legend
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
12,078
Reaction score
13,664
Yes, clearly. The positives from the last 2 weeks weren't there and people seriously want to believe a key change had nothing to do with it? Baz bottled it and it's as simple as that. He made Jake the halfback for a reason and to go away from that after just two games despite some positives signs and combinations building was an incredibly dumb decision. He basically threw away all that we worked on because last week Burton didn't ground the ball, because Naden bombed two tries by not passing to JAC, because Okunbor dogged it with the line wide open, because Waddell was caught short, because TPJ was caught short, etc.

Burton had his worst game for us and it had nothing to do with his halves partner that he worked with the most during pre season being replaced? JMK had his biggest dumbfuck game also, again had nothing to do with the half being replaced? lol please. Wakeham didn't even trial with Burton LOL, it's like it wasn't even a consideration in Baz's mind a couple weeks ago. Nothing but panic stations from Baz once again, more panic leads to more dumb decisions like shifting out best centre to wing or reducing Max Kings minutes because why?? Nothing but down hill from here. Glad everyone on here got what they wanted.
There were plenty of contributing factors to the loss.
Naden getting pushed back into the in goal when he dawdled away from our goal line.
Burto kicking out on the full
Hethro being injured so early
TPJ being wasted on an edge
Jacko trying to be the ball playing lock he isn't.
Im not sure Wakeham playing, having to go off or Avo's absence was that crucial. I dont think either of the 2 are the answer to our halfback issue.
 

CrittaMagic69

Kennel Immortal
Premium Member
Gilded
SC H2H Champion
2 x SC Draft Champ
Joined
Nov 15, 2013
Messages
73,003
Reaction score
78,719
Need to re-watch the game but I felt initially that:
1. Jackson was particularly disruptive tonight.
2. The Burns/Schoupp thing was weird - Naden should have shifted to right wing tonight.
3. The middles rotation was bizarre, but affected by the Hetherington injury.
4. There's a disconnect with Burton's role in midfield to attacking positions, he can't be getting tackled on the 4th for no good reason, he should never be serving dummy half either - neither are Wakeham's fault, like they wouldn't be Jake, Kyle or Bailey's fault.
It's not like we didn't have disruptions or problems in the other games. Wakeham at best was no better than Jake yet there was a clear drop in the teams and Burtons performance. Burton's possessions were down, the amount of good ball he got was basically 0, his runs were down...He was a non factor and totally played out of the game by his halves partner tonight. Jake should not have been dropped 2 game in and it's a simple as that, there were positives and signs of combinations building the last 2 weeks and Baz pissed it all away. The same would apply if any other half started the season.
 

gbrussell

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Gilded
Joined
Jul 4, 2012
Messages
1,574
Reaction score
2,312
Does anyone know if the rule regarding differential scrum penalties has been changed? The reason I ask this is because in my day the only time you could kick for goal from a scrum penalty was for foul play in the scrum or referee abuse.

Breaking too early just like offside from a scrum does not allow a shot for goal. Thus Cummins in my opinion was wrong to allow us to level the scores at 12 all.

Anyone know if this is another rule that has been changed by the constant fiddling of the NRL

No point sending a query to them, they don't reply.
 

Wearnze

Kennel Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 18, 2010
Messages
2,213
Reaction score
616
So in a 3 week window...

Bulldogs beat Cowboys.
Broncos beat Bulldogs.
Cowboys beat Broncos.
 

TwinTurbo

Kennel Legend
Gilded
Joined
Oct 22, 2018
Messages
9,453
Reaction score
15,702
How did the change from Averillo to Wakeham work out, pretty terrible is my assessment. Burton had by far his worst game of the 3 due to the service he was getting, passing to him multiple times on the 4th tackle for example, stranded, and leaving him out of play for the 5th. Jackson was forced to take the ball up because there was no back line structure for him to link into. I saw none of the fluid play that was present in rounds 1 and 2. Can’t blame the rain, it was no better or worse than previous and the heat/humidity wasn’t anywhere near as stifling as it was up in Toonsville.

Did dropping Okunbor and swapping the RHS centre/winger help the defence, maybe, maybe not, either way it still wasn’t great. I did notice on the Fox coverage at half time that Furner had Burns and Schouppe in the bottom RHS corner of the screen hammering the whiteboard. Second half defence was better, but just another example of why shuffling the backline was not a good idea. The spacing in attack was often horrid, uneven, with mid field bunching and unforgivably compressed to the sideline, how the fark does that happen.

Ours is not an established team, we can’t just slot a player into a well drilled, long developed structure and expect them to fit and not leave us with clunky offense. As I have posted several times, we have a structure that we have worked on for 5 months and it was far too early to make a change in the 1/2. Particularly 2 that play very different styles, styles that don’t lend themselves to the way the rest of the team has trained and practised.

Where to now, do we swap back, that’s not good on so many fronts, especially after 1 game. Wakeham surely has to be given another week to train in the position and another game to prove that his promotion was justified. Against Melbourne in Melbourne, FMD, what a deep end to get thrown into, followed by Penrith the next round. Not really the right time to be changing what has taken all of preseason to develop.

Always a Bulldog
 

NQ Dog

Kennel Participant
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
394
Reaction score
501
NQ do you honestly think that he could possibly score three solo tries?????????? In a game or a season?
Not the point mate. Both wingers yesterday came off their wing throughout the game and no one wants to sack them. No wonder the poor bloke is doin' it tough. He is human.
 

RookieDog

Dogs1
Joined
Oct 1, 2009
Messages
1,557
Reaction score
1,745
and to round out the general sh!tness of yesterday ... in addition to Dogs losing by a stinking field goal, my kid was playing his Zelda BOTW game and "invested" 1000 rupees on resurrecting or rejuvenating his horse which was safely in a stable and had nothing wrong with it. That's 1000 rupees down the drain.

Could yesterday have been any worse?
 

Greenmachine121

Kennel Enthusiast
Premium Member
Ladder Champion
Joined
Jun 11, 2019
Messages
1,346
Reaction score
1,589
From a neutral perspective.

Good.
Vaughn - Dufty - ( can’t believe I’m saying this ) JMK

Under pressure
Burton, JAC , Naden

Bad.
TPJr , Scoupp, JJ ,

Average
The rest

Two things .

Their attack is very very average …. If it’s not an off the cuff thing from Burton or Dufty , it’s way to stilted and predictable ( lol coaching )

Their defence has improved a lot ( again coaching )


Having sat through both my teams awful performance ( more on that in a sec ) and your teams swimming carnival I honestly think you guys have a lot of upside , you need to get your attack right for sure but I wouldn’t be too disappointed with that performance, yeah it sucks to lose close games but I definitely think the doggos are improving.

Now my team …. I was really really disappointed with them this week , I couldn’t give a shit they won as we cannot give a good team that much start and hope to do what we did on Saturday night . It’s a shit performance and a flukey win so was not happy at all
The Mrs couldn’t understand hahah

Chin up fellas I’m sure you will have some great wins this year
 

SweetFA

Kennel Enthusiast
Joined
Apr 23, 2017
Messages
1,149
Reaction score
1,060
How did the change from Averillo to Wakeham work out, pretty terrible is my assessment. Burton had by far his worst game of the 3 due to the service he was getting, passing to him multiple times on the 4th tackle for example, stranded, and leaving him out of play for the 5th. Jackson was forced to take the ball up because there was no back line structure for him to link into. I saw none of the fluid play that was present in rounds 1 and 2. Can’t blame the rain, it was no better or worse than previous and the heat/humidity wasn’t anywhere near as stifling as it was up in Toonsville.

Did dropping Okunbor and swapping the RHS centre/winger help the defence, maybe, maybe not, either way it still wasn’t great. I did notice on the Fox coverage at half time that Furner had Burns and Schouppe in the bottom RHS corner of the screen hammering the whiteboard. Second half defence was better, but just another example of why shuffling the backline was not a good idea. The spacing in attack was often horrid, uneven, with mid field bunching and unforgivably compressed to the sideline, how the fark does that happen.

Ours is not an established team, we can’t just slot a player into a well drilled, long developed structure and expect them to fit and not leave us with clunky offense. As I have posted several times, we have a structure that we have worked on for 5 months and it was far too early to make a change in the 1/2. Particularly 2 that play very different styles, styles that don’t lend themselves to the way the rest of the team has trained and practised.

Where to now, do we swap back, that’s not good on so many fronts, especially after 1 game. Wakeham surely has to be given another week to train in the position and another game to prove that his promotion was justified. Against Melbourne in Melbourne, FMD, what a deep end to get thrown into, followed by Penrith the next round. Not really the right time to be changing what has taken all of preseason to develop.

Always a Bulldog
Wakeham trained as Barrett’s first choice halfback in the preseason- was set back by COVID/ Fiji Xmas trip. Rather than going with Flanagan as second string, Barrett insisted on the “manufactured” half Averillo….. hopefully Flanno has a blinder tonight & J Cook continues improving….until then
 
Last edited:
Top