Pay's Pets

Moey

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This is supposed to be a rebuild year with an eye of trying out players, giving youngsters a go to see where they are at and then use that info to target players in the player market.

You bought Meaney, use him, give him a shot and let him learn and grow into position. If still sit then we definitely need to buy a rockstar Fb. But by leaving hoppa there, it proves nothing

Montoya, fml, in the real world he would have been sacked for continued poor performance. Under Pay he keeps getting rewarded.

Holland has been woeful in defense since he made his debut, and it showed yesterday. We should have kept Jmoz until Harper was ready.

Foran looks frustrated out there. Top player surrounded by imbeciles. Only so much you csn do.

Lewis, really really really bad game yesterday. Hope its a 1 off but from what he showed yesterday, its going to be a long 2nd year syndrome for him.

Elliot... yea he has heart. Yeah he plays hard but fcuk me he is as useless as tits on a bull. Jacko should be at lock.

JMK is fuckin useless. Fullstop
Lichaa not far behind him.

Point is, Pays selections and recruitment has been diabolical. His use of the bench is shit, wont blood youngsters unless absolutely necessary. His game plan yesterday was aa farce. 1 trial game only... cmon...

I understand we dont have many players to choose from, i get that, but no way warriors score that much yesterday. Shitload of those tries were due to woeful defense u expect from under 12s.

Next week he will pick the exact same fucking team...
 

D.O.W.

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After today's embarrassing display the feel good vibe of the preseason is well and truly gone...

Pay has built the squad he wants and it scared me all along that the club let him have so much of a say in the construction of the roster when no one knows if Pay is the long term coach or not..

Either way, Des was rightly roasted for persisting with certain players despite their lack of form and talent and Pay has proven to do the same with:

Lichaa
Marshall-King
Montoya
Elliott

The first three aren't first grade standard at all and it's pathetic that we haven't addressed the hooker situation.

Pay will be on thin ice if they have a few more performances like this. What do the people that wanted to re-sign him before the season think now?
Great post, whilst yesterdays result has stirred up a lot of emotion, Pay needs to make ballsy changes.

A no bullsh!t policy on performances has to be front of mind.

Lichaa was terrible today, the young bloke in Canterbury Cup in the 9 would have been better or move Foran into 9 and elevate Cogger to firsts, he appears to be a good game manager.

CHN, RFM, Fualalo and Hopoate were our best today the rest didn’t show up or underperformed.

Our starting pack lacks intimidation, there seems to be a myth to our pack as being strong, it hasn’t been that way since the days of Klem, Kas, Graham, Jacko and Finucane... before that, we had arguably the best pack in the history of rugby league (Price, Mason, O’Meley, Asotasi, SBW, Ryan).

The forwards simply didn’t lay a good enough platform for our halves. In saying that, our last tackle options were disgraceful. Have been for years!! Shifty Sherwin at 40yo would do a better job...
 

joedog

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If pay dosent change that team we will get smashed every week i know its a rebiuld year and he has limited options but he gotta do something. Even put chn and hoppa in the centres and put meaney full back. And fill the bench with forwards fuck jmk off all together useless.
 

B-Train

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Great post, whilst yesterdays result has stirred up a lot of emotion, Pay needs to make ballsy changes.

A no bullsh!t policy on performances has to be front of mind.

Lichaa was terrible today, the young bloke in Canterbury Cup in the 9 would have been better or move Foran into 9 and elevate Cogger to firsts, he appears to be a good game manager.

CHN, RFM, Fualalo and Hopoate were our best today the rest didn’t show up or underperformed.

Our starting pack lacks intimidation, there seems to be a myth to our pack as being strong, it hasn’t been that way since the days of Klem, Kas, Graham, Jacko and Finucane... before that, we had arguably the best pack in the history of rugby league (Price, Mason, O’Meley, Asotasi, SBW, Ryan).

The forwards simply didn’t lay a good enough platform for our halves. In saying that, our last tackle options were disgraceful. Have been for years!! Shifty Sherwin at 40yo would do a better job...
I've said for years old man Shifty would outplay the likes of Holdsworth, Roberts, Keating, Foran and the other illustrious halves we've had since...

Kimmorley was the only decent one and he was at the end of his career.

It really has been a long term issue similar to Parra trying to replace Sterling. Not that Sherwin was a long term great like Sterlo, but we haven't had a long term solution since.

I still think Lewis is a long term answer at 5/8th. But playing with an A grade hooker and an imbezzling fraud bystander like Foran does Lewis no favours and doesn't let him play his natural game.

Foran needs to be dropped and never to play for the club again if he doesn't prove within the next month that he even wants to pretend to earn his money and get involved. If it were up to me I would have torn up his contract and paid him out whatever they owe him halfway through last year.
 

Howard Moon

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I honestly don’t think he’d know what to do with it if he did. He rolls the dice on fringe first graders unwanted by their previous clubs. Look at all of his signings:

C.Smith - decent
JMK - wtf
Crichton - wtf
Napa - good
CHN - good
Sue - undecided
John Olive - I don’t know what to say
Clay priest - wtf
Meaney - wtf
Cogger - wtf

Not a good strike rate here my friend...
Cogger and Meaney are like 20... can't really make a judgment on them yet... thought they were both pretty good yesterday in the ISP.. I thought Olive was here prior to Pay? or are you saying we re-signed him? Crichton is probably all we could get tbh but yeah, not much better than what we had in reserves... JMK is the big one, the fact he continues to be picked is my question mark on Pay
 

SPEARTAKVIDREFS

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After today's embarrassing display the feel good vibe of the preseason is well and truly gone...

Pay has built the squad he wants and it scared me all along that the club let him have so much of a say in the construction of the roster when no one knows if Pay is the long term coach or not..

Either way, Des was rightly roasted for persisting with certain players despite their lack of form and talent and Pay has proven to do the same with:

Lichaa
Marshall-King
Montoya
Elliott

The first three aren't first grade standard at all and it's pathetic that we haven't addressed the hooker situation.

Pay will be on thin ice if they have a few more performances like this. What do the people that wanted to re-sign him before the season think now?
How did Pay build the Squad he wanted? What cash flow did he use to build the Squad he wanted? What star recruits where available to purchase for next to nothing last year? What star recruits stopped and thought last year " Jeez the bulldogs look like a fantastic opportunity. Been blazing along playing dezball for years and i really like the fact there shedding players left right and centre to free up cap space. I wouldnt mind taking a major paycut to get in on that action and Id love to play along side Montoya"
 

B-Train

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How did Pay build the Squad he wanted? What cash flow did he use to build the Squad he wanted? What star recruits where available to purchase for next to nothing last year? What star recruits stopped and thought last year " Jeez the bulldogs look like a fantastic opportunity. Been blazing along playing dezball for years and i really like the fact there shedding players left right and centre to free up cap space. I wouldnt mind taking a major paycut to get in on that action and Id love to play along side Montoya"
No doubt he took over a bad situation but to be honest he probably wouldn't have gotten the job if it were more appealing to more credentialed coaches.

In keeping Lichaa and playing him, signing JMK, Napa, Chrichton, CHN, Sue, Meaney, Cogger and a few others he's put his own imprint on the team.

He did well by promoting Smith, Lewis and Martin but now he's dropped Martin and persists with Elliott who's average and keeps playing Montoya for some bizarre reason.

It's not all his fault, and he's done some good things but his stubbornness and persistence with his pet projects is very worrying and needs to be addressed otherwise they'll prove to be his undoing.
 

Moey

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Put it this way, if Andersons were in charge no way they would have chosen Pay as head coach. He will be gone 100% by end of year if things dont improve.
 

SPEARTAKVIDREFS

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No doubt he took over a bad situation but to be honest he probably wouldn't have gotten the job if it were more appealing to more credentialed coaches.

In keeping Lichaa and playing him, signing JMK, Napa, Chrichton, CHN, Sue, Meaney, Cogger and a few others he's put his own imprint on the team.

He did well by promoting Smith, Lewis and Martin but now he's dropped Martin and persists with Elliott who's average and keeps playing Montoya for some bizarre reason.

It's not all his fault, and he's done some good things but his stubbornness and persistence with his pet projects is very worrying and needs to be addressed otherwise they'll prove to be his undoing.
I dont get Montoya or JMK. I suppose I see alot of it as apples to oranges. People rate Holland. People saying Hoppa as one of the better fullbacks in the comp. I like Hoppa but hes average. Thats how far weve fallin. I cringe when I see Montoya out there. Perhaps looking in from the outside we dont know whats going on. Where talking about the dynamics of a first grade NRL team full of reserve graders trying to be competitive. I believe we need some quality signings but thats a ways off yet. Pay has a mammoth challenge. Im not saying he's our answer. I hope he can see our deficiencies and make improvements. The coming months will tell. Watching the Storm the other night - thats years of hard work, dedication, stability and a coach who isnt a softcock. There a machine.
 

LFC Bulldogs

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Put it this way, if Andersons were in charge no way they would have chosen Pay as head coach. He will be gone 100% by end of year if things dont improve.
100% true.
If my memory is correct Chris Anderson was coaching us when the super league war broke out. Dean Pay was the 1st to defect and sign with Parra.
Anderson told him " get the fuck out my office" or words to that effect when he informed him of his decision.
He will probably be shown the door even if things do improve. The Andersons don't forget.
 

coach

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winning 4 out of the last 5 games in the back end of the season and that too with a far worst squad than now, means nothing?
Far worst squad ?
I would say j moz b moz d Klemmer we had a better team last year
 

pillow

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Fittler just said in the parra penriff game if your 9 isn’t getting out of dummy half and being dangerous, you’re very easy to mark up one on one. This is spot on our problem, no team is worried about lichaa or jmk in dummy half. We won’t win shit with either of those useless fucks in our lineup
 

Indiandog

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Far worst squad ?
I would say j moz b moz d Klemmer we had a better team last year
I am sure we won most of the last games without Klemmer or he had minimal contributions in those games. I am
Sure he was not part of the couple of wins we had without him.

Jmoz and bmoz are obviously a loss but replaced by return of Foz, CHN and Napa.
 

GA45

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This is supposed to be a rebuild year with an eye of trying out players, giving youngsters a go to see where they are at and then use that info to target players in the player market.

You bought Meaney, use him, give him a shot and let him learn and grow into position. If still sit then we definitely need to buy a rockstar Fb. But by leaving hoppa there, it proves nothing

Montoya, fml, in the real world he would have been sacked for continued poor performance. Under Pay he keeps getting rewarded.

Holland has been woeful in defense since he made his debut, and it showed yesterday. We should have kept Jmoz until Harper was ready.

Foran looks frustrated out there. Top player surrounded by imbeciles. Only so much you csn do.

Lewis, really really really bad game yesterday. Hope its a 1 off but from what he showed yesterday, its going to be a long 2nd year syndrome for him.

Elliot... yea he has heart. Yeah he plays hard but fcuk me he is as useless as tits on a bull. Jacko should be at lock.

JMK is fuckin useless. Fullstop
Lichaa not far behind him.

Point is, Pays selections and recruitment has been diabolical. His use of the bench is shit, wont blood youngsters unless absolutely necessary. His game plan yesterday was aa farce. 1 trial game only... cmon...

I understand we dont have many players to choose from, i get that, but no way warriors score that much yesterday. Shitload of those tries were due to woeful defense u expect from under 12s.

Next week he will pick the exact same fucking team...

Can tell your a Dib and Des fan. With what money was pay meant to be recruiting stars? And Foran gets a pass by you?? Give it up
 

gazza

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100% true.
If my memory is correct Chris Anderson was coaching us when the super league war broke out. Dean Pay was the 1st to defect and sign with Parra.
Anderson told him " get the fuck out my office" or words to that effect when he informed him of his decision.
He will probably be shown the door even if things do improve. The Andersons don't forget.
Not quite correct for my memory of it. As I recall it McCracken was the defector and enticed Pay and Dymock to also take the huge money the ARL with Packer’s money offered to respond to the Super League threat. The stories abound of Gus Gould & Co signing players to big bucks. Just ask one of the best club men of all time for the dogs Barry Ward who signed with ARL and ended up playing with the Roosters. Allowed him his dream of full time footballer and off the drink truck run. I missed the op to catch up on inside gossip on a Saturday morning when Barry delivered those soft drinks.
 

dogluva

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Fittler just said in the parra penriff game if your 9 isn’t getting out of dummy half and being dangerous, you’re very easy to mark up one on one. This is spot on our problem, no team is worried about lichaa or jmk in dummy half. We won’t win shit with either of those useless fucks in our lineup
I watched the Canterbury Cup and Jesse Marschke looked a cut above Lichaa. Nice direct crisp passing and good acceleration out of dummy half....only problem is he is unproven in top grade and isn't in our top 30 nor development meaning no first grade opportunity for him. We are stuck with what we have....

TOP 30:
Adam Elliott, Aiden Tolman, Brandon Wakeham, Chris Smith, Christian Crichton, Corey Harawira-Naera, Danny Fualalo, Dylan Napa, Fa'amanu Brown, Francis Tualau, Jack Cogger, Jayden Okunbor, Jeremy Marshall-King, John Olive, Josh Jackson, Kerrod Holland, Kieran Foran, Lachlan Lewis, Marcelo Montoya, Michael Lichaa, Nick Meaney, Ofahiki Ogden, Raymond Faitala-Mariner, Reimis Smith, Renouf To'omaga, Rhyse Martin, Sauaso Sue, Will Hopoate, Zac Saddler

DEVELOPMENT PLAYERS:
Tui Katoa, Morgan Harper, James Roumanos, Jarred Anderson
 

Alan79

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I'm hopeful that we got our worst game out of the way for the year. I wasn't able to watch it so I can't comment on individual performances. But from what I've read Lichaa dished up more of the same which is like putting a brick under the accelerator of our forward pack. If they get hammered by a fast moving defensive line when attacking to start the match it's a huge legup to the opposition. I'm hopeful he sees little NRL time this year.



The Warriors had a pretty strong backline to work with. It doesn't excuse poor defence. But getting steamrolled through the middle won't have helped them. We have to sort out the play the ball asap and if that means dropping Lichaa I'm hopeful it happens before the forwards lose all heart.



As far as I'm concerned the forward pack hasn't gone backwards in quality. But our backline is going to miss the mozzes. As much as people think they're long in the tooth, they still offered stability and experience. We didn't have the money in the kitty to splash on quality replacements. But with some shuffling I hope we get it right soon. I rate Meaney as a genuine prospect. Hoppa is probably a better centre at this stage than Montoya. Not writing Montoya off completely, but he was down on confidence last year and it might've been an injustice to hope he'd pick any up for the first game without some football under his belt.



I'm not sure what the answer is. But I'd start with getting our forwards rolling by finding a solution at #9. Take that brick out from under the accelerator and we might get on the front foot with the forwards. JMK mightn't be creative, but if he's at least decisive let him start or promote someone else. Coffee has a footy brain and organisational skills. Maybe he's the answer even if he's lacking a bit in defence.



As far as it goes with Pay. I wasn't confident that he was the answer. But it's his future on the line if he's not able to get the team firing. So I doubt he'll play favourites if players don't perform. The club will be looking to go on the front foot with recruitment. So I think Pay will have a timeline by which the front office will expect significant results. If he's not up to scratch early on I expect someone else will be given the chance to improve the roster for next season.



We all knew that we have to climb out of a hole this year. It's not a pretty start, but the level of anger about it is fairly incomprehensible. Any big loss hurts. But it's a long season and as long as we don't repeat performances like this it's still immensely salvageable.
 
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