NSW Upper House blocks Government's bid to freeze public sector wages as coronavirus hits economy

[Wahesh]

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06-02/coronavirus-nsw-government-wage-freeze-blocked/12313388

Look I think it's almost impossible for us to avoid a recession now, however the Liberals blocking a pay rise if down right insulting:

• Firefighters enduring a summer from hell putting their lives on the line tackling one of our worst bushfire seasons ever - which mind you has devastated many small communities
• Doctors and nurses on the frontline fighting Covid 19 putting themselves at risk while helping those who have the virus - 3000+ in NSW
• Teaches facing frustration having to rely on their internet to work from home as well as returning to the schools which gives them added chance of catching the virus from a student not showing symptoms
• Tens of thousands of Public Servants having to work from home using their internet and not having access to office facilities - not to mention stinging local cafes who rely on us for support

Yet Aunty Gladys thinks that a small 2.5% payrise is too much (which was already cut from 4% when the Libs came in back in 2011).

On top of this, Autny Gladys keeps on fapping on about how good the Opal card is. I'm not going to deny that the Opal card is good, but FFS that was 7 freaking years ago when she was Transport Minister. Since then, she's been Treasurer, and now Premier, and she STILL goes on about that (even though Labour laid the blueprints for that).

Then there's the whole SFS fiasco AND NOW the ANZ stadium fiasco.

I think the State Government's time is just about up. I can't see them winning the next election at this rate.

 

[The DoggFather]

They deserve the pay rise plus more.

Cut the salaries of the useless public servants and members of parliament in the cushy government jobs and give to the real public servants.

 

[BELMORE]

Wtf at your last 2 points... seriously are you retarded? First two. Great. Doing their job they chose to do. The 2.5% will save shit loads and will be able to be injected into more pressing part of the economy (eg people that lost their job). They should be frozen for 12 months. It’s not a big deal long term for the individuals but for the next 12 months it’s massive for the country.

 

[Wahesh]

Wtf at your last 2 points... seriously are you retarded? First two. Great. Doing their job they chose to do. The 2.5% will save shit loads and will be able to be injected into more pressing part of the economy (eg people that lost their job). They should be frozen for 12 months. It’s not a big deal long term for the individuals but for the next 12 months it’s massive for the country.

There are other ways around it, they did this to try and get points with the voters but it backfired.

 

[BELMORE]

There are other ways around it, they did this to try and get points with the voters but it backfired.

Wtf are you on about

 

[Cook]

Boo hoo, firefighters I know earn well in excess of 100k a year. On top of this they spend half there shifts sleeping and working out in a gym on the premises. Some tell me they often don’t leave the station on an entire 24 hour shift. Privatise the lot, than they’ll see how the real world operates.

 

[Wahesh]

Wtf are you on about

Well look, they want to save money, right? Now they're taking this to the IRC. How much money is that going to cost them? How much time is that going to cost them? Now I'm not saying that saving $3,000,000,000 is easy, BUT there are other ways around it. Not moving the Power House Museum to Parramatta to start with. That's just part of the "fair go for the west" bullshit. Look how much money it's cost them. What about the ANZ and Telstra Stadium fiasco that's never ending?

She wants to stop us from going in recession. Newsflash... yesterday it was all but confirmed by Josh Frydenberg that we are officially in a recession.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ia-is-in-a-recession-but-worse-is-yet-to-come

The other 2 points I raised are valid as well for us who are experiencing them.

Example... here I am working from home now. I am using my home internet. I do not have access to office facilities such as printer/photo-copier/scanner and constantly have communication/ICT issues, and my internet phone usually drops out and disconnects. So what I'm paying for privately has to be utilised for work purposes, and I do not get reimbursed for it.

As for teachers, image trying to teach from home and do everything electronically. It's not feasible at all. Being a teacher is tough at the best of times let alone trying to do it from home.

 

[Wahesh]

Boo hoo, firefighters I know earn well in excess of 100k a year. On top of this they spend half there shifts sleeping and working out in a gym on the premises. Some tell me they often don’t leave the station on an entire 24 hour shift. Privatise the lot, than they’ll see how the real world operates.

Yet when they are called to duty, they are often putting their lives on the line, not just in bushfire season, but when there are other things such as house or apartment fires.

I reckon if there is a freeze, it should be on the senior public servants, such as ones earning over $150,000 a year. They can afford it.

 

[BELMORE]

Well look, they want to save money, right? Now they're taking this to the IRC. How much money is that going to cost them? How much time is that going to cost them? Now I'm not saying that saving $3,000,000,000 is easy, BUT there are other ways around it. Not moving the Power House Museum to Parramatta to start with. That's just part of the "fair go for the west" bullshit. Look how much money it's cost them. What about the ANZ and Telstra Stadium fiasco that's never ending?

She wants to stop us from going in recession. Newsflash... yesterday it was all but confirmed by Josh Frydenberg that we are officially in a recession.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ia-is-in-a-recession-but-worse-is-yet-to-come

The other 2 points I raised are valid as well for us who are experiencing them.

Example... here I am working from home now. I am using my home internet. I do not have access to office facilities such as printer/photo-copier/scanner and constantly have communication/ICT issues, and my internet phone usually drops out and disconnects. So what I'm paying for privately has to be utilised for work purposes, and I do not get reimbursed for it.

As for teachers, image trying to teach from home and do everything electronically. It's not feasible at all. Being a teacher is tough at the best of times let alone trying to do it from home.

How fkn sheltered are you? Complaining about having IT issues at home. Paying for your internet which you already paid for.... you sound like one of those shit ***** at work that never have a crack and go outside the box to do a good job.

And your teachers comment holy shit... you have not spoken to any teachers have you.

you do realise things in the world change and if you don’t adapt then you are left for dead. You can’t just expect help (unless you are a whinging loser).

At the end of the day, a 12 month wage freeze for the public sector in order to save billions has a minuscule effect on individuals, and a massive effect on the Australian Economy and society. Long term it’s going to be worse for everyone if they don’t cop it. And also, they aren’t losing anything they don’t have.

 

[Cook]

Yet when they are called to duty, they are often putting their lives on the line, not just in bushfire season, but when there are other things such as house or apartment fires.

I reckon if there is a freeze, it should be on the senior public servants, such as ones earning over $150,000 a year. They can afford it.

I’d also say freeze on all also. I know my company is deep in negotiations and we’re not going to get an increase on pay, definitely not next year. On the life in danger not really. Maybe overseas but ours are trained not to enter if it’s not safe to do so. It’s one of the cruisiest jobs on planet. Hence why there’s so many old ones still employed and hanging on.

 

[hayes]

First the pay rise 2.5% was only given after which we delivered savings prior.

I'm not against the pay rise put on hold but why aren't department head declining their pay rises given last month to them like the smallest pay rise for them was 30k to 80k. Mike Fuller was the most 80k. Now all these departments heads salary are around 300 k more than the Prime Minister.

The average public servant would be around 2k.

 

[Dawgfather]

Public service wage rises frequently out page wage increases in the private sector.

I would be ok with a 12 month freeze on public sector wages at a time when the private sector wages have gone backwards.

 

[Alan79]

The thing to be careful about with things such as this are that any legislation put in place here would probably be a backdoor way to permanently give the government the ability to implement wage freezes. Legislative changes aren't often temporary.

 

[Wahesh]

A lot of people have the mindset that all public servants are bludgers. I am a public servant with well over a decade of experience. Now when I first started working in the public service, as you would expect, it was an entry level position, year 1, general scale, which is the lowest of the low. That entry level position was busy. Then I have progressively worked my way up and have found that the work gets busier and busier as you progress. Last year for instance, I started a new position that came complete with a 3 month backlog of work I had to catch up on. It took my 2 months to finally get up to date while having the worst manager to date on my back all the time.

Public Servants are bludgers? LMAO. That's an urban myth. I dare someone who says that to sit in my job for a day, and if they can survive the day without their brain frying, they can take the job.

 

[Wahesh]

Public service wage rises frequently out page wage increases in the private sector.

Yes, but let's also keep in mind the private sector employees are generally paid better and have fringe benefits - nothing like that is in the public sector.

 

[Dawgfather]

Yes, but let's also keep in mind the private sector employees are generally paid better and have fringe benefits - nothing like that is in the public sector.

I guess it depends which jobs you are comparing.

I know in my profession I would be able to land a job with comparable salary (although my superannuation would be higher in the public sector). The downside would be that I wouldn't have the potential to earn the bonuses which I earn in my private sector job.

But on the other hand my lifestyle would be 10x better in public sector. I'd have a job which I basically couldn't be fired from and from what I hear I'd have heaps of leave because as soon as you work longer than your 7.6 hour day you get flex time.

 

[Riggs80]

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06-02/coronavirus-nsw-government-wage-freeze-blocked/12313388

Look I think it's almost impossible for us to avoid a recession now, however the Liberals blocking a pay rise if down right insulting:

• Firefighters enduring a summer from hell putting their lives on the line tackling one of our worst bushfire seasons ever - which mind you has devastated many small communities
• Doctors and nurses on the frontline fighting Covid 19 putting themselves at risk while helping those who have the virus - 3000+ in NSW
• Teaches facing frustration having to rely on their internet to work from home as well as returning to the schools which gives them added chance of catching the virus from a student not showing symptoms
• Tens of thousands of Public Servants having to work from home using their internet and not having access to office facilities - not to mention stinging local cafes who rely on us for support

Yet Aunty Gladys thinks that a small 2.5% payrise is too much (which was already cut from 4% when the Libs came in back in 2011).

On top of this, Autny Gladys keeps on fapping on about how good the Opal card is. I'm not going to deny that the Opal card is good, but FFS that was 7 freaking years ago when she was Transport Minister. Since then, she's been Treasurer, and now Premier, and she STILL goes on about that (even though Labour laid the blueprints for that).

Then there's the whole SFS fiasco AND NOW the ANZ stadium fiasco.

I think the State Government's time is just about up. I can't see them winning the next election at this rate.

Im actually ok for wage freeze . As public servants they really haven’t had to sacrifice like the rest of the community ... remember “we are all in it together “. They are not getting cuts in income , they are not being sacked. just a wage freeze .

‘yes those essential services do fantastic jobs but
- firefighters putting lives on the line But how many were volunteers fighting and helping out
- nurses and doctors . Yes again great job ... but did they get inunadated with cases? (Normal flu season hits hopsitals harder ) , I think max overall 200 cases was look after by nsw health At any one time with most being mild and self quarantining at home and don’t forget all the things done to try help them out , some got free temp accomodation , special supermarket times
- teachers , blah what they did they do, schools closed they did online and went back to work only now with hardly any cases left
- working from home , many from private sector did as well with same issues , don’t know why this point brought up

if anything the real heroes were the supermarket employees , working face to face and not complaining not talking about strike actions , not demanding pay rises or benefits

I really don’t see the problem with a wage freeze , the actions caused by the government closed down the private sector with many losing jobs or wage cuts etc with the public service still receiving their income and no threat to their existing incomes

 

[Wahesh]

I guess it depends which jobs you are comparing.

I know in my profession I would be able to land a job with comparable salary (although my superannuation would be higher in the public sector). The downside would be that I wouldn't have the potential to earn the bonuses which I earn in my private sector job.

But on the other hand my lifestyle would be 10x better in public sector. I'd have a job which I basically couldn't be fired from and from what I hear I'd have heaps of leave because as soon as you work longer than your 7.6 hour day you get flex time.

You're right - it depends on the type of work. I choose public sector for work/life balance, and also so I'm not rorted with long hours - which is something I copped while working private.

The public sector flex agreement is different among agencies. Some have it, other don't, and those that do have it can be on a different awards than other agencies. Mine for instance is flex time is added when you work above 7 hours core time. If you work outside these core hours and it's not agreed to be overtime, you get nothing extra. Best thing is that long service leave is accumulated after 7 years (not 10) and you can never be pressured into taking it - whereas private sector can force you to take it.

 

[Wahesh]

Im actually ok for wage freeze . As public servants they really haven’t had to sacrifice like the rest of the community ... remember “we are all in it together “. They are not getting cuts in income , they are not being sacked. just a wage freeze .

‘yes those essential services do fantastic jobs but
- firefighters putting lives on the line But how many were volunteers fighting and helping out
- nurses and doctors . Yes again great job ... but did they get inunadated with cases? (Normal flu season hits hopsitals harder ) , I think max overall 200 cases was look after by nsw health At any one time with most being mild and self quarantining at home and don’t forget all the things done to try help them out , some got free temp accomodation , special supermarket times
- teachers , blah what they did they do, schools closed they did online and went back to work only now with hardly any cases left
- working from home , many from private sector did as well with same issues , don’t know why this point brought up

if anything the real heroes were the supermarket employees , working face to face and not complaining not talking about strike actions , not demanding pay rises or benefits

I really don’t see the problem with a wage freeze , the actions caused by the government closed down the private sector with many losing jobs or wage cuts etc with the public service still receiving their income and no threat to their existing incomes

If you want to know where the money can be saved in the public sector, let me tell you...

• Cutting (terminating) ALL contractors
• Contractors get paid more than permanent/temporary employees
• About 25% of the Government workforce are contractors
• Whenever the Liberals come into power, they say "We are cutting 10,000 public service jobs"
• The voters cheer saying the public service is full of bludgers, however who does the 10,000 jobs that have just been cut? Contractors. The Liberals say that 10,000 jobs have been cut (everyone cheers), but they don't go on to say that 10,000 contractors are now being engaged and charging 3-4 times the cost to do the same job
• Terminate contractors, and if the work is not permanent, hire 10,000 TEMPORARY employees who are on the same wage and benefits as permanents, except they are not permanent
• It's all about perception.

 

[Cook]

If you want to know where the money can be saved in the public sector, let me tell you...

• Cutting (terminating) ALL contractors
• Contractors get paid more than permanent/temporary employees
• About 25% of the Government workforce are contractors
• Whenever the Liberals come into power, they say "We are cutting 10,000 public service jobs"
• The voters cheer saying the public service is full of bludgers, however who does the 10,000 jobs that have just been cut? Contractors. The Liberals say that 10,000 jobs have been cut (everyone cheers), but they don't go on to say that 10,000 contractors are now being engaged and charging 3-4 times the cost to do the same job
• Terminate contractors, and if the work is not permanent, hire 10,000 TEMPORARY employees who are on the same wage and benefits as permanents, except they are not permanent
• It's all about perception.

Your right but beauty of contracting out is, when the workloads gone so are they. No people hanging round doing nothing and don’t have to pay them out. All liabilities are passed onto the principal contractor. I’ve worked in both public and private sectors. Probably 15 years in public. The conditions and workloads I found were and are way ahead of the private sector. The amount of leave we got whether sick, flexis, long service was way above award. I was always busy, but I chose to be. Many people stood back and did nothing, and got away with it. Or just side shifted to another section/department