News Jack De Bellend Megathread

[Northern Beaches dog]

Why isnt a 7-5 Jury decision in either way considered?

I mean, no one knows for a fact what happened in that room.

 

[wendog33]

I got $42 each day for a couple of days.

The 2 young offenders trashed, stole property and pleaded not guilty.

We all showed up but a few days into the case, we found out they decided to plead guilty. The judge asked us to come into the court, thanked us and explained what had happened overnight.

)Hope they got extra time added onto the slap on the wrist they would have got for wasting time and causing so much unnecessary expense

 

[Chrisaaar]

Do you get paid to be in a jury in Australia?

In New South Wales, for trials lasting up to 10 days, all jurors receive $106.30 a day, or $531.50 a week. For trials lasting more than 2 weeks, the amount paid increases to $247.40 a day, or $1196 a week, if you are employed. If you're unemployed, it stays at $106.30 per day.

So depending on your employee / what you earn you can lose money being in a jury.

 

[CroydonDog]

In New South Wales, for trials lasting up to 10 days, all jurors receive $106.30 a day, or $531.50 a week. For trials lasting more than 2 weeks, the amount paid increases to $247.40 a day, or $1196 a week, if you are employed. If you're unemployed, it stays at $106.30 per day.

So depending on your employee / what you earn you can lose money being in a jury.

My friend who is currently trying to get out of jury duty has been told by his employer they will cover the difference between his normal salary and the jury payment for up to 2 seeks only. The trial he is being called for is estimated to go for 2 months.

He is of Chinese background. I suggested he turns up sprouting communist propaganda or just saying he doesn't speak English.

 

[Chrisaaar]

My friend who is currently trying to get out of jury duty has been told by his employer they will cover the difference between his normal salary and the jury payment for up to 2 seeks only. The trial he is being called for is estimated to go for 2 months.

He is of Chinese background. I suggested he turns up sprouting communist propaganda or just saying he doesn't speak English.

Yep... You're lucky if you have an employer that will cover you the difference the entire case. Goodluck if it's a long one.

Should wear a doggies jersey, will probably be banned from jury duty for life

 

[Smartseal]

It doesn't take a lot to get out of jury duty.

I always have 2 excuses (aka reasons)
#1: Self employed, i'm too important
#2: I dont consider myself to be of sound character to stand in judgement of my fellow man (this is the most important reason)..............
.......
.......
.......
& yet even though i have admitted to my deficiencies I get asked at least twice a year, so you wonder why the legal system is fucked????????? (particularly in Qld)

 

[steeliz]

Are you aware you live in a country where people are afforded the presumption of innocence.

You don’t become guilty simply because a girl accuses you of something.

Are you aware that even though he wasn't found guilty, he also wasn't exonerated?

The girl also has the presumption that she is telling the truth.

As always telling half the story.

 

[Dawgfather]

Are you aware that even though he wasn't found guilty, he also wasn't exonerated?

The girl also has the presumption that she is telling the truth.

As always telling half the story.

No. That is not how the presumption of innocence works.

If someone has not been convicted in a court of law, they are an innocent person.

 

[wendog33]

In New South Wales, for trials lasting up to 10 days, all jurors receive $106.30 a day, or $531.50 a week. For trials lasting more than 2 weeks, the amount paid increases to $247.40 a day, or $1196 a week, if you are employed. If you're unemployed, it stays at $106.30 per day.

So depending on your employee / what you earn you can lose money being in a jury.

$106?! ...Geez yet another example of getting paid more in NSW than Qld. Not fair

 

[BDPScarface]

I'm surprised by how many people don't understand this principle:

https://www.ag.gov.au/rights-and-pr...-sector-guidance-sheets/presumption-innocence

What is the presumption of innocence?
The presumption of innocence imposes on the prosecution the burden of proving the charge and guarantees that no guilt can be presumed until the charge has been proved beyond reasonable doubt.

 

[steeliz]

No. That is not how the presumption of innocence works.

If someone has not been convicted in a court of law, they are an innocent person.

He wasn't found innocent or guilty.

Yes a presumption of innocence but he also has accusations that have yet to be proven that they are false.

You are backing DeBellin because of a hung jury and condemning the girl for the same reason.

As always you tell half a story to suit your narrative.

 

[doggieaaron]

Gunna be a fun xmas lunch at the debellin household

 

[BDPScarface]

He wasn't found innocent or guilty.

Yes a presumption of innocence but he also has accusations that have yet to be proven that they are false.

You are backing DeBellin because of a hung jury and condemning the girl for the same reason.

As always you tell half a story to suit your narrative.

Read the link. The onus is on the prosecution to prove guilt. The presumption of innocence carries and continues beyond a verdict, unless the verdict is that of guilt.

People really struggle with symmetry and assymetry. The principle of presumption of innocence is exactly to force an assymetrical reading of guilt or innocence. Or we carry on these arguments ad infinitim.

The fact that the jury could not deliver a guilty verdict, not just a verdict, reaffirms innocence. The presumption continues until the next jury verdict (or beyond another non verdict, which seems the most likely outcome again).

I think this is a blindspot of western democracies. There's a "justice no matter the cost" principle that just creates more injustice than it seeks to remedy. There's so much of this type of thinking... "no lives lost to XYZ disease", yeah but what about all the lives lost because in the pseudo-war you wage on it, etc.

It's ok if hysteria and exploitation can be kept out of such "principled stances"... but invariably hysteria and exploitation inject into processes, and the principled stance is now tyranny.

 

[BDPScarface]

Gunna be a fun xmas lunch at the debellin household

That's the farce of the situation. This'll be the third xmas lunch since the incident.

 

[wendog33]

Gunna be a fun xmas lunch at the debellin household

Partner may have felt pressured? ...sympathetic towards the impact leaving would have on his court case so reluctantly decided to stay with him for appearances sake.

Now, however, with a further delay and her unfairly being in the spotlight, she may not be so willing?

The press have been filming and following her around. She may be sick of it and the humiliation?

Or she might be fully supportive and start going to the court house with him during the next court case.

Dumb bloke.

 

[Dawgfather]

He wasn't found innocent or guilty.

In Australia and other western democracies, until a judge or jury finds you guilty, you are an innocent person.

 

[Dawgfather]

Partner may have felt pressured? ...sympathetic towards the impact leaving would have on his court case so reluctantly decided to stay with him for appearances sake.

Now, however, with a further delay and her unfairly being in the spotlight, she may not be so willing?

The press have been filming and following her around. She may be sick of it and the humiliation?

Or she might be fully supportive and start going to the court house with him during the next court case.

Dumb bloke.

Can confirm she's staying with him for the long haul.

 

[Cappuccino]

Juries are an interesting beast.

Whilst they can be seen to reflect the values of the community (the whole judged by your peers thing), juries also of course have no legal experience, and lets face it, nobody actually wants to do it. They also don't have to provide their reasoning for their verdicts.

Mrs CD recently was excused because she is currently breastfeeding/caring for our baby. A colleague said he once got out of it by getting his boss to write a letter saying his future employment depended on him being at work for an important client. I have another friend in Sydney who is currently trying to work out how to get out of it.

As Norm Crosby said:

"

When you go into court you are putting your fate into the hands of twelve people who weren't smart enough to get out of jury duty.

"

Juries are a very interesting beast.

Situational intelligence is massively a massively underrated concept in relation to this. You just need to look on this site, in this thread to see it.

Essentially its the ability to get data and facts and make a reasonable viewpoint on it, and the ability to critically think when presented with new facts.

The amount of people I know who are extremely talented and smart in their field, often are the ones that think they know about other subjects too. This can explain why you have reasonably intelligent people believing in concepts like anti vaccinations and bat shit crazy fringe political ideals.

People can be insanely talented in one area, and absolute dumbasses in other areas and have absolutely no idea.

By what odds do these 12 people have a rounded viewpoint? Then times that by the crazy amount of trials worldwide over an extended period of time. I know it goes through a vetting process. Its like a job interview, you never know what you've got/gotten yourself into until you start and get comfortable or the person starts and shows their true colours.

You look into the justice project in the states and the amount of convictions that get over turned each year and wonder how these people concluded someone was guilty beyond doubt.. Its astounding

 

[Cappuccino]

Partner may have felt pressured? ...sympathetic towards the impact leaving would have on his court case so reluctantly decided to stay with him for appearances sake.

Now, however, with a further delay and her unfairly being in the spotlight, she may not be so willing?

The press have been filming and following her around. She may be sick of it and the humiliation?

Or she might be fully supportive and start going to the court house with him during the next court case.

Dumb bloke.

shes pregnant again...

 

[wendog33]

shes pregnant again...

Won't ask lol