Bush Fires

Flanagun

Banned
In the Sin Bin
Joined
May 25, 2011
Messages
22,588
Reaction score
20,580
Everyone is a professor except the actual professors.
 

xreedmatic

Kennel Established
Joined
Oct 11, 2016
Messages
708
Reaction score
1,179
Australian flora and fauna have developed strategies to cope with bush fire over thousands of years and are a necessary part of the ecology,obviously they more intense a Fire becomes the more it affects the ecology.The intensity of the current fires are man made but it’s got fuck all to do with global warming,these fires are created by excessive fuel load on the ground they become so intense the become canopy fires and generate their own weather systems,very little can survive these fires.
The fuel loads that are burning now where created by locking up vast areas of national park to grazing animals.The reduction/outlawing of back burning to reduce emissions and the outlawing of any type of land clearing for fire breaks etc.
So congratulations to the greens who with the help of the Labour Party made all these fine pieces of legislation a reality.
There was a time when Australian foresters kept Australian forests safe and productive. They maintained access tracks bridges and fire breaks, undertook prescribed burning, cleared flammable litter from the forest floor, cut suckers, manned fire lookouts and maintained their own fire-fighting crews in decentralised districts. University-trained professional foresters were supported by tough experienced rangers who learned their job in the bush.

Almost every advance in bushfire management in Australia, from the science of fire behaviour to aerial burning was thanks to our foresters. Into the 1980’s they were regarded as international leaders.

To pay for good forest management, sections of the forest were logged, allowing ground space and sunlight for the swift re-growth of new trees.

And those fading die-hards still beating alarm drums about man-made global warming should be reassured - the use of hardwood and softwood timber in power poles, telephone poles, bridges, wharves, posts, sleepers, haysheds and houses provided long term sequestration of the dreaded carbon. Moreover, growing trees extract CO2 more quickly than mature trees. Win, win, win.

Then we entered the Green Era. Foresters and timber-getters were demonised by urban greens, their tame bureaucrats and academics, and their ABC mates. State forests were converted to National Parks and Wilderness Areas and John Howard created the hated Kyoto Protocol Forests on private land. Timber imports rose.

Every locked-up, un-managed, un-burnt forest inevitably breeds disastrous wild-fires. The combination of heavy fuel load, poor access for fire fighters, drought, hot winds, arsonists and dry lightning has only one assured outcome – a bushfire tragedy for the forest and the neighbours. (Why are no greens chaining themselves to trees now?)

This must change. No enquiries are needed. Anyone without green blinkers can see the evidence daily. So, cut the locks, open the tracks and remove the trash. Then call tenders from local people to use recreation, tourism, timber getting or hunting feral animals to fund proper care and maintenance of our forests. A well-managed forest can pay for its own management and also keep the community safe and happy.

Control must be local. Local Foresters and local fire Wardens must call the shots on when/how to reduce flammable litter, weeds and suckers. Everyone should have the right (maybe the obligation), to fire proof their own properties and boundaries. There should be no more national parks – just local parks. And arson should be treated as terrorism.

The State governments can provide weather forecasts, bushfire warnings, radar information, aerial support and TV performances.

The Feds should return some of their tax receipts to help us to restore the forests we have lost, but otherwise they should keep out of the way.

The urban greens have had their moment in the sun. They seized management of Australian forests from Australian Foresters, and have had every opportunity over the last 25 years to apply their evergreen theories on bushfire management. The result is there for everyone to observe - total and tragic failure.

Far too many bushfires start in National Parks. Few stay in the Parks.

It’s time to get sensible forest policies and professional forest managers back on the job.

Get rid of the Red Bull and the Green Fairies – bring back the White Knights.
 

Dognacious

Kennel Immortal
Staff member
Administrator
Premium Member
NF Draft Champion
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
23,482
Reaction score
10,883
Australian flora and fauna have developed strategies to cope with bush fire over thousands of years and are a necessary part of the ecology,obviously the more intense a Fire becomes the more it affects the ecology.The intensity of the current fires are man made but it’s got fuck all to do with global warming,these fires are created by excessive fuel load on the ground they become so intense the become canopy fires and generate their own weather systems,very little can survive these fires.
The fuel loads that are burning now where created by locking up vast areas of national park to grazing animals.The reduction/outlawing of back burning to reduce emissions and the outlawing of any type of land clearing for fire breaks etc.
So congratulations to the greens who with the help of the Labour Party made all these fine pieces of legislation a reality.
Agree. We have had fires as bad as this before, even 100 years ago, so if its global warming, its in slowmo and been the same for ages. But the government used to do more backburning and fire prevention than it does now, so when a fire happens, theres a lot of fuel for it. Being so dry is also a big factor, but i believe thats more to do with us being on the dry end of the El Nino/El Nina thing where countries on one side of it get more rain than usual and the others less rain than normal, and its changes ends every now and then. I am grateful the local govt here still do burnoffs in winter since I am next to bush here. I don't love it at the time though , it's stinks for a few weeks when they do it. But it's better than losing a house.
 

maroondog72

Kennel Immortal
Gilded
Joined
Apr 6, 2017
Messages
15,087
Reaction score
25,899
There was a time when Australian foresters kept Australian forests safe and productive. They maintained access tracks bridges and fire breaks, undertook prescribed burning, cleared flammable litter from the forest floor, cut suckers, manned fire lookouts and maintained their own fire-fighting crews in decentralised districts. University-trained professional foresters were supported by tough experienced rangers who learned their job in the bush.

Almost every advance in bushfire management in Australia, from the science of fire behaviour to aerial burning was thanks to our foresters. Into the 1980’s they were regarded as international leaders.

To pay for good forest management, sections of the forest were logged, allowing ground space and sunlight for the swift re-growth of new trees.

And those fading die-hards still beating alarm drums about man-made global warming should be reassured - the use of hardwood and softwood timber in power poles, telephone poles, bridges, wharves, posts, sleepers, haysheds and houses provided long term sequestration of the dreaded carbon. Moreover, growing trees extract CO2 more quickly than mature trees. Win, win, win.

Then we entered the Green Era. Foresters and timber-getters were demonised by urban greens, their tame bureaucrats and academics, and their ABC mates. State forests were converted to National Parks and Wilderness Areas and John Howard created the hated Kyoto Protocol Forests on private land. Timber imports rose.

Every locked-up, un-managed, un-burnt forest inevitably breeds disastrous wild-fires. The combination of heavy fuel load, poor access for fire fighters, drought, hot winds, arsonists and dry lightning has only one assured outcome – a bushfire tragedy for the forest and the neighbours. (Why are no greens chaining themselves to trees now?)

This must change. No enquiries are needed. Anyone without green blinkers can see the evidence daily. So, cut the locks, open the tracks and remove the trash. Then call tenders from local people to use recreation, tourism, timber getting or hunting feral animals to fund proper care and maintenance of our forests. A well-managed forest can pay for its own management and also keep the community safe and happy.

Control must be local. Local Foresters and local fire Wardens must call the shots on when/how to reduce flammable litter, weeds and suckers. Everyone should have the right (maybe the obligation), to fire proof their own properties and boundaries. There should be no more national parks – just local parks. And arson should be treated as terrorism.

The State governments can provide weather forecasts, bushfire warnings, radar information, aerial support and TV performances.

The Feds should return some of their tax receipts to help us to restore the forests we have lost, but otherwise they should keep out of the way.

The urban greens have had their moment in the sun. They seized management of Australian forests from Australian Foresters, and have had every opportunity over the last 25 years to apply their evergreen theories on bushfire management. The result is there for everyone to observe - total and tragic failure.

Far too many bushfires start in National Parks. Few stay in the Parks.

It’s time to get sensible forest policies and professional forest managers back on the job.

Get rid of the Red Bull and the Green Fairies – bring back the White Knights.
Well said mate
 

Flanagun

Banned
In the Sin Bin
Joined
May 25, 2011
Messages
22,588
Reaction score
20,580
Thank you professor of all professors
I'm not the professor of all professors, but I do have a doctorate in hysterical leftology from the Greta Thunberg academy!

Seriously, I never claimed to be a professor, but the science is definitely on my side. You have a nice day, now. ;)
 

maroondog72

Kennel Immortal
Gilded
Joined
Apr 6, 2017
Messages
15,087
Reaction score
25,899
I'm not the professor of all professors, but I do have a doctorate in hysterical leftology from the Greta Thunberg academy!

Seriously, I never claimed to be a professor, but the science is definitely on my side. You have a nice day, now. ;)
Yeah time to go hide under the bed with the rest of the green stooges give my regards to bob brown when you see him
 

Dawgfather

Banned
Joined
Nov 28, 2003
Messages
8,835
Reaction score
1,900
This might be an interesting discussion point:

If there has been bigger fires (by area) before (many decades ago), and worse fires (by loss of human life before) (many decades ago), then why is it suddenly climate change exacerbating these fires but not previously?
 

Realist90

Kennel Legend
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
13,949
Reaction score
3,261
I'm not saying arsonists didn't start the fires. You and several others claimed that climate change couldn't have started the fires because arsonists started them.

Im merely pointing out that what you are presenting is a strawman as people aren't saying "Climate change started the fires"
But isn’t it also strawman (if I’m using this word correctly) that whilst they’re not saying explicitly climate change started the fires they’re also not saying arsonists started them and are talking a shit load more about climate change inferring that it indeed is climate change (really global warming but climate change sounds more scientifically sound and less gayish man bear pigish) starting the fires.
 

xreedmatic

Kennel Established
Joined
Oct 11, 2016
Messages
708
Reaction score
1,179
I'm not the professor of all professors, but I do have a doctorate in hysterical leftology from the Greta Thunberg academy!

Seriously, I never claimed to be a professor, but the science is definitely on my side. You have a nice day, now. ;)
The leading advocates of the Climate Change movement are politicians, entertainers, and even children. Climate preachers such as Al Gore and Leonardo DiCaprio lack any formal scientific training whatsoever, and live personal lives of unparalleled luxury while prescribing carbon austerity for the masses.

Yet no one is permitted to point out their scientific ignorance or call attention to their hypocritical lifestyles.

Child advocates such as Greta Thuneberg and the crudely indoctrinated children of the “Sunrise movement” are essentially sock puppets for their shameless activist handlers.

Refuse to bend the knee to these tiny fascists, as Diane Feinstein most recently did, and the mainstream left will relentlessly attack you as an accessory to mass murder.

The Climate Change movement always shouts out revised and updated apocalypse predictions, eerily reminiscent of the stereotypical bum on the sidewalk with that “The End Is Near” sign. “The world will end in X years if we don’t do X” is the constant refrain.

The years always pass, and the apocalypse never happens. Interestingly, this is a characteristic of multiple religious cults (such as the Seekers of Chicago, and the Order of the Solar Temple).

At the moment, we apparently have 12 years to nationalize the entire economy and phase out fossil fuels before we all die a fiery death.

When have the climate leaders been called wrong for their failed predictions? Regardless of the weather, they are always intrinsically correct.

Flood? Climate Change. Drought? Climate Change. No Snow? Climate Change. Too much snow? Climate Change. Hurricane? Climate Change. Lack of hurricanes? Climate Change.

See how this works?

The path to discovery for the Climate Change movement is an intentionally vague discipline referred to as “climate science.” Did you carry out a study on gender and glaciers? Climate Science. Did you think up the worst possible scenarios that have no actual chance of happening (actual portion of latest National Climate Assessment)? Climate Science.

Any “science” that confirms the tenets of the Climate Change movement is deemed “climate science,” while actual scientific research that disputes their conclusions is derided as “denialism.”

The Verdict: It’s a cult
 

Realist90

Kennel Legend
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
13,949
Reaction score
3,261

Hacky McAxe

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Gilded
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
37,038
Reaction score
29,412
Agree. We have had fires as bad as this before, even 100 years ago, so if its global warming, its in slowmo and been the same for ages. But the government used to do more backburning and fire prevention than it does now, so when a fire happens, theres a lot of fuel for it. Being so dry is also a big factor, but i believe thats more to do with us being on the dry end of the El Nino/El Nina thing where countries on one side of it get more rain than usual and the others less rain than normal, and its changes ends every now and then. I am grateful the local govt here still do burnoffs in winter since I am next to bush here. I don't love it at the time though , it's stinks for a few weeks when they do it. But it's better than losing a house.
It's kind of the other way around on both points.

I'm not sure about other states, but NSW reported higher hazard control burns in 2018/2019 than any other period before it. So the reduction in hazard control burns is a bit of a myth. But there has been a reduction in deforestation which is good or bad depending where you stand.

In regard to El Nino/La Nina cycle, we're actually in a neutral period.

The way it works is during an El Nino cycle there's higher drought. During a La Nina cycle there's higher rainfall. It's actually more complicated than that and includes influences from the Indian Ocean Dipole, but El Nino and La Nina are the primary drivers.

Right now we're in the middle. That means we should have fairly decent weather. Not too much drought, not too much rainfall. But the fires are acting like we're in a full El Nino cycle.

So considering how bad it is now, just imagine when we enter an El Nino cycle.
 

Hacky McAxe

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Gilded
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
37,038
Reaction score
29,412
This might be an interesting discussion point:

If there has been bigger fires (by area) before (many decades ago), and worse fires (by loss of human life before) (many decades ago), then why is it suddenly climate change exacerbating these fires but not previously?
It's a complicated issue. Size of fires and loss of life can't support or deny climate influence as there's hundreds of other factors involved including location of the fires, amount of fuel load, and modern technology and fire fighting tactics.

It's like when people say, "there's more cancer today". It's true but it's due to a number of other factors including modern medicine keeping people alive longer and better techniques to detect cancer.

This is why I find it funny when people say "more people died in the past" and also funny when fire fighters say "this is the worst we've seen"

They're comparing it against different things with different variables that haven't been accounted for.
 

Hacky McAxe

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Gilded
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
37,038
Reaction score
29,412
But isn’t it also strawman (if I’m using this word correctly) that whilst they’re not saying explicitly climate change started the fires they’re also not saying arsonists started them and are talking a shit load more about climate change inferring that it indeed is climate change (really global warming but climate change sounds more scientifically sound and less gayish man bear pigish) starting the fires.
Not really. I mean, you just threw out the se strawman there again as they're really not even insinuating that climate change started the fires.

That said, ignoring the arsonists is a problem and provably driven by an agenda. It's not a strawman but it is still a deception problem.
 

Dognacious

Kennel Immortal
Staff member
Administrator
Premium Member
NF Draft Champion
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
23,482
Reaction score
10,883
Yep. Still waiting for you to show me the articles that say "climate change started the fires"

I'll wait.
Yeh sadly they say more than half of all fires are purposely lit or accidentally lit by doing stuff like throwing ciggie butts out car windows. The climate may make the fires worse, but the dickheads lighting them are the bigger issue.
 

Flanagun

Banned
In the Sin Bin
Joined
May 25, 2011
Messages
22,588
Reaction score
20,580
Yeah time to go hide under the bed with the rest of the green stooges give my regards to bob brown when you see him
I'm not hiding, I'm just trying to abide by the requests of mods and to not to get caught up in the game of belittling and caricaturing my ideological opposites. You should try that.
 
Top