News Bulldogs coach Dean Pay denies senior players wishes for mass changes

DinkumDog

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So according to the reports what are the priorities?

When was the report published? Pre or post covid? Pre or post 3 embarrassing losses?

Priorities can change overnight Dinkum. Financial positions can change overnight. Stakeholder interests can change and put pressure of the board to act.

So unless you know any stakeholders or board members personally. Your info may be outdated.
I'm well aware that things can change quickly, thanks.
The footy club is not a public company - it is owned by its members and funders - mainly the leagues club, which has had no revenue for 2 months.
So I'm not sure what you mean by 'stakeholder interests' in that respect.
'Embarrassing losses' doesn't change the money in the bank so is not relevant.
The 1100 or so footy club members might start making noise if things don't improve, yes.
The rest is just noise. If you're interested in more detail and to have a chance to vote who runs the club, join up.
 

B-Train

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His wage compared to other clubs is irrelevant. It's what the club can afford. Why do you think the Steelers aren't sacking Mary? Same problem.
And you know for sure staff have accepted pay cuts? No, you don't. They were stood down without wages during the NRL shutdown - that's it.
Who has suggested 'financial ruin' Ben? No-one. There are many costs to cover - and paying out a coach would not be anywhere near the top of the pile right now.
I praised the club for moving on players did I? There was no choice to be cap compliant Ben. Hence our problems now.
Please - if you're going to push a barrow on a particular outcome - at least stick to the facts - which with this argument you are not.
The Saints situation is completely different as McGregor earns more than double what Pay earns plus he has two years on his deal not one.. And even with a million dollar payout to McGregor, they'll still likely fire him.

The club aren't paying Pay any more money than he'd earn this year anyway so I don't see the huge issue in firing him?

They could always pay any replacement coach less this year and more in the last few seasons of their contract if cash flow was a concern this year. You can still backend contracts, just not as heavily as before.

You firmly believe that the club will never fold, relocate and merge because of our financial strength and the backing of the leagues club and I completely agree. But now you're making it seem like the club is in complete financial despair because of 100k?

Restoring the reputation and appeal of the club is well worth the relatively minor cost of sacking Pay early. Anyway, I'm not going to go round in circles. Let's just agree to disagree.
 

DinkumDog

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The Saints situation is completely different as McGregor earns more than double what Pay earns plus he has two years on his deal not one.. And even with a million dollar payout to McGregor, they'll still likely fire him.

The club aren't paying Pay any more money than he'd earn this year anyway so I don't see the huge issue in firing him?
They could always pay any replacement coach less this year and more in the last few seasons of their contract if cash flow was a concern this year. You can still backend contracts, just not as heavily as before.
You firmly believe that the club will never fold, relocate and merge because of our financial strength and the backing of the leagues club and I completely agree. But now you're making it seem like the club is in complete financial despair because of 100k?
Restoring the reputation and appeal of the club is well worth the relatively minor cost of sacking Pay early. Anyway, I'm not going to go round in circles. Let's just agree to disagree.
I do enjoy the debate Ben :-)
Let's see how it plays out, starting on Monday.
 

wendog33

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The way I see it is this.

He had all of lockdown to decide how he was going to approach that first game. He wouldn't have made those decisions to start with Cogger, Lewis etc. rashly and in all honesty, they would've been the most thought through plans he's made in his lifetime of coaching. Those plans failed spectacularily. Utter embarrassment of a performance which was on the back of his selections.

The argument is what him sticking with the same team shows.

Is it showing that he's stubborn in his ways, refuses to change his approach, sticks to his guns at all costs?

Or is it a coach giving those "well thought out plans" a chance to come to fruition? To stick to those players who he showed loyalty to?

I'm not here trying to say that Pay's right or wrong about things (he's wrong btw). Just trying to understand the madness (imo) behind his selections decisions so far. As much as a majority on here hate him, there needs to be some reasoning behind his decision making as poor as that reasoning might be.
Well we'll see on Monday if he can afford to continue with his selections, bench rotation theories and paper thin gameplan. All up to him and the players to confirm his ineptness or show that his faith and tactics are justified.

We don't have to win either to see and evaluate that.
 

Dogna88

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I'm well aware that things can change quickly, thanks.
The footy club is not a public company - it is owned by its members and funders - mainly the leagues club, which has had no revenue for 2 months.
So I'm not sure what you mean by 'stakeholder interests' in that respect.
'Embarrassing losses' doesn't change the money in the bank so is not relevant.
The 1100 or so footy club members might start making noise if things don't improve, yes.
The rest is just noise. If you're interested in more detail and to have a chance to vote who runs the club, join up.
Sponsors arnt financial stakeholders? If they are making noise. Things will change. They are making noise.
 

DinkumDog

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Sponsors arnt financial stakeholders? If they are making noise. Things will change. They are making noise.
Of course they are, but unlike non- stakeholders such as those expressing outrage on a forum, they have the opportunity to hear the reality and point of view from the club. I haven’t heard of any existing sponsor unrest since Port Macquarie - have you?
 

speedy2460

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Another fake news story. This paper has a history of making up rubbish stories.
 

2ndphase

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He was gone at the end of 08 it was Kevin Moore more then Folkesy.
Yes correct!
That was the year i put 7 grand on the dogs to make the 8 at $3.25.
2008 we got the spoon because SBW left half way through the year.
 

EB18

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If his lost the dressing room then that's all she wrote. Caretaker coach needs to step in immediately.
Coach has lost the dressing shed,players are bewildered by selections and non selections not getting any communication from Coach.
You can rule Jacko out of that group as captain he is loyal to Pay.
 

Squash the Berries!

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Is Hoppa going to be signed again, no this is his last contract, so leave him at centre.

Is DWZ going to be signed again, yes long term option.

Therefore give DWZ more time this year at FB to see if it’s FB or wing going forward.

Is R.Smith going to be resigned again, yes but as a winger therefore he replaces Crichton.

As for Holland & Harper to centre, blood Averillo instead.

If Pay says no to centre and leaves Averillo on the bench then Harper deserves his shot over Holland.
 

speedy2460

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Well McGuire did decided to remain unemployed rather than take charge of the Bulldogs before he eventually accepted the Tigers gig.
Of course he would. He could see we had no money and we had a second tier team. Who would want in.
 

DoggyStyla

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Canterbury coach Dean Pay has resisted making mass changes to his side to take on St George Illawarra despite calls from senior players to shake up the backline.

The Daily Telegraph can reveal a group of four senior Bulldogs players approached Pay following the Bulldogs’ 32-6 loss to Manly in Gosford on Sunday expressing their frustrations at the side’s winless start to the season.

It’s believed the players asked Pay to consider moving Will Hopoate from centre to fullback, Dallin Watene-Zelezniak from fullback to the wing, Reimis Smith from centre to the wing and for Kerrod Holland and youngster Morgan Harper to be selected at centre.

But Pay only made one change for Monday’s clash against the Dragons and that was naming Kieran Foran at five-eighth at the expense of Jack Cogger.

Foran was out injured with a serious shoulder injury he suffered last November while playing in a Test match for New Zealand against Great Britain.

His inclusion will add a much-needed boost and experience into Pay’s spine. Foran’s return also marks the Kiwi international’s 200th NRL match.

The Daily Telegraph can also reveal no deadline has been placed on Pay’s future but the club refused to guarantee he would see out the rest of the season.

Pay, who is off contract at the end of this year, is not only fighting to salvage his career at the Bulldogs but the team’s 2020 campaign.

It’s understood Pay met with CEO Andrew Hill and chairwoman Lynn Anderson on Monday to discuss his future and was told his side’s performance was unacceptable, but was offered any support he needed.

The club remains reluctant to sack Pay mid-season but there is no doubt calls for him to be replaced will only grow louder, particularly from disgruntled fans, if the Bulldogs can’t beat the Dragons, who are also winless and under pressure to find results.

While it is widely accepted Pay is coaching an inferior roster compared to others in the NRL, the Bulldogs entered the season on a high note.

Pay’s team ended last season with five from six wins, giving fans hope that they could improve on their 12th placed finish in season 2020.

But losses to Parramatta, North Queensland and the Sea Eagles to open their 2020 campaign has dampened those hopes.

The Bulldogs could receive a recruitment boost this season if the club is able to secure the release of St Helens forward Luke Thompson from the English Super League. Thompson signed a three-year deal to join Canterbury from season 2021 but the club is exploring ways to get him to Belmore this season.


Canterbury recently baulked at the opportunity to bring back local junior and experienced playmaker Josh Reynolds after they failed to agree the terms of his release with the Wests Tigers.

Former Bulldogs hooker and Cronulla premiership winner Michael Ennis blasted the club’s recruitment decisions after Sunday’s loss to the Sea Eagles. Ennis said pairing up Reynolds with Foran in the halves could help turn around the side’s on-field fortunes.

"If there’s a committee for recruitment, boy, oh boy – fair dinkum, do they want to win footy games?” Ennis said.

“They cannot score a point. Yes, they keep saying we want to bring local juniors through and this is our thing, and that’s fantastic.

“The solution is put Foran in when he’s healthy, and put Reynolds next to him.

"They’re two quality halves who can manage them through this period. Josh’s deal would only be for 18 months.

“It’s frustrating, it’s really frustrating as a former player to see how hard some of their players are working, and the pain they’re going through and not getting any reward for it.”

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/s...s/news-story/be5e187da028715f81ebcd8c8e110f3b
If the oboe is true, he has already lost the dressing room, goodbye Pay!
 

Farcanrefs

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Is Hoppa going to be signed again, no this is his last contract, so leave him at centre.

Is DWZ going to be signed again, yes long term option.

Therefore give DWZ more time this year at FB to see if it’s FB or wing going forward.

Is R.Smith going to be resigned again, yes but as a winger therefore he replaces Crichton.

As for Holland & Harper to centre, blood Averillo instead.

If Pay says no to centre and leaves Averillo on the bench then Harper deserves his shot over Holland.
How do you know Hoppa won't be resigned?

In relation to DWZ get off the juice. He has been diabolical in the 3 games at FB. Blind Freddy can tell he's a winger. He ain't a FB's ar....hole.
 

Malla

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Of course he's gonna deny it but we all know bloke has a target on his forehead.

If we lose to shitty dragons this week he does not deserve to be bulldogs coach.

Agree that he inherited a pretty average squad with a tough salary cap situation, but he had 3 years to at make adjustments. We haven't seen an improvement in the juinors and players skill development, we haven't been able to recruit anybody with any impact - the only one, CHN, we sack for something that wasn't sackable in my opinion, not when you have players like Cody Walker assaulting someone on camera and he gets away with a couple weeks. Anyway, Pays had more than enough time to prove his worth. Even if as a club we were still below par but we could see that we were improving, we would have a better opinion on Pay but he's just a bad coach, surrounds himself with the wrong people and clearly has a bad eye for talent.

Please quit. Do yourself a favour.
 

Malla

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How do you know Hoppa won't be resigned?

In relation to DWZ get off the juice. He has been diabolical in the 3 games at FB. Blind Freddy can tell he's a winger. He ain't a FB's ar....hole.
Winger or Centre at best... not a fullback. Positional play is crap, can't catch an up and under kick anymore. Tried to save a 40/20 last week that wasn't even a 40/20 and had the presence of mind to try and flick it back in field where there was no blue and white jersey in sight. Absolute shit house fullback.

This is where Pay fails as a coach. He needs to be the one to give DWZ that hard truths that he is not going to play fullback. He doesn't have the balls to do that.
 

GA45

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People making decisions at the club are ultimately responsible for this, even me not being a fan of Pay can see that they haven't done enough to support him. I personally don't think it would change our football all that much, Pay simply isn't good enough and you can't micromanage all the things he does.
Put how do we know that they haven’t offered help and Pay has declined it? Has Pay gone to them to ask for help? It goes both ways and one party may have rejected the offer for help who knows.
Pays selections shows he doesn’t want to be saved to be honest
 

berries1935

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I feel if we lose this week they might come out and announce who will coach next year. Not necessarily sack pay but tell him this year is it, our own "last dance" hahaha....... If you were a player thinking of signing for the club the first question is who is the coach (after money). We need to confirm our coach fro next year before players will sign for the club. Sort it out quickly so we can move on as a club
 

CrittaMagic69

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Put how do we know that they haven’t offered help and Pay has declined it? Has Pay gone to them to ask for help? It goes both ways and one party may have rejected the offer for help who knows.
Pays selections shows he doesn’t want to be saved to be honest
You're scenarios still make both the Board and Pay look bad.
 

GA45

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You're scenarios still make both the Board and Pay look bad.
The only thing we know is that Pay is struggling as a Head Coach. As someone else said this board didn’t appoint Pay so maybe they have never wanted him as head coach and are using him through this shit period.
 
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