Opinion LESSONS from 2004

Kenya

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Watched the 2004 GF last night. Just to remind me what a champion Bulldogs side looks like.

Huge forward power. We talk a lot about backs but forwards win games.
That team bench had SBW, Asostasi, Corey Hughes & JT. (Steve Price was out injured).
That gf was won with forward power.

Our D was punishing, our middle was tight and our line speed in attack and D was fast. Very fast. We were relentless and gave the opposition very little time - it was an onslaught when we attacked. Very quick play the ball in every ruck.
And very low error count.

We talk a lot about backs but our re-build needs to be about forwards. Starting with a 9.
 

Nasheed

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Nasheed here. They were 30% over the cap.
Give me 30% more cap and I promise I can replicate or come close to replicating it.
 

Nasheed

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No they weren’t by this stage most of those players had to take pay cuts to stay or new contracts
Let’s be real though they did that out of unity and adversity.
They never would have assembled in the first place without the scams.
That’s why when it happened to Melbourne and they all took the same money pledge the nrl stepped in and said ‘fuck that shit u need to let players go’
 

wendog33

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Watched the 2004 GF last night. Just to remind me what a champion Bulldogs side looks like.

Huge forward power. We talk a lot about backs but forwards win games.
That team bench had SBW, Asostasi, Corey Hughes & JT. (Steve Price was out injured).
That gf was won with forward power.

Our D was punishing, our middle was tight and our line speed in attack and D was fast. Very fast. We were relentless and gave the opposition very little time - it was an onslaught when we attacked. Very quick play the ball in every ruck.
And very low error count.

We talk a lot about backs but our re-build needs to be about forwards. Starting with a 9.
Gave me goosebumps reading that and how proud we all were of what our players could do on the field, wearing that CB Bulldogs jersey.
 

Riggs80

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should probably look at the year the tigers won the comp , no wrestle, ruck was quick and really open . Should look what the top 8 sides had in common and I wouldn’t necessarily look at the cows or tigers team
 

seven07

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Let’s be real though they did that out of unity and adversity.
They never would have assembled in the first place without the scams.
That’s why when it happened to Melbourne and they all took the same money pledge the nrl stepped in and said ‘fuck that shit u need to let players go’
Mate it is official, you have officially become the kennel DICKHEAD...
 

Nasheed

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Mate it is official, you have officially become the kennel DICKHEAD...
The fact it provided that reaction from you is because you know it’s true, you just don’t want it to be, but it is.
 

Nasheed

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we were in the top 2 best teams from 2002 to 2006
2002 was building on salary cap breach and the rest was us managing to hold on after the scandal. It fizzled out in 2007
 

alchemist

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2002 was building on salary cap breach and the rest was us managing to hold on after the scandal. It fizzled out in 2007
rubbish

to my last breath, I will believe that our 2002 team was overpaid and not that we had some unfair advantage over rivals and that is evident when you consider the squads the likes of the Roosters, Dragons, Broncos etc. had at the time... even Gus Gould at the time and still in Uncle Nick's pocket wrote in the SMH that he could have gotten our team under the cap... from memory, pre-season projections had us as a finals team but not one of the main contenders (from memory 'Big League' had us finishing 8th)... how was that possible if we had a 30% advantage over the rest of the salary cap compliant league... but in hindsight, people only remember the 17 straight wins and then simply conclude that it was because we were over the cap

and for those doubting me, seriously compare our squads with that of the talent laden Storm from 2006 to 2010

I also think you are being very disrespectful of the team building done by the club in those years... the 'Dogs club won from memory 4 Jersey Flegg premierships in 5 years at that time... we had the NRL's outstanding rookie three years out of four... we were astute with our signings including taking advantage of the Rabbits being kicked out of the comp and the Northern Eagles merger falling apart

just look at our 2004 GF squad

1. Patten - an Illawarra junior signed from the Dragons but hardly a cheque book signing as the Dragons also had is Roberts and for all the General gave us, was not a representative star calibre player
2. El Masri - local junior... played one Origin and one Test match and was great for us but again, not a star player commanding big money
3. Harris - came up through the junior grades and debuted with us... moved to the ESL shortly after the GF and did have a stint with the Cowboys from memory but not much to write about
4. Tonga - signed with us in 2004 from Parramatta for FG opportunity as he was behind representative pair Lyon and Vaealiki at the Eels... simply good recruitment
5. Utai - local junior... part of the famed 2001 jersey flegg team which included Thurston, Elsom, Asotasi, Oliver, Myles etc... NRL rookie of the year in 2002... did play for NZ but seriously, and I do not mean this as disrespect to Utai (I f*+#ing love the guy), what was his career like post 2005 when his body started breaking down and he was being targeted by the opposition with kicks?
6. Anasta - one of the big money players in our squad and we benefited from Souths being kicked out of the comp and our relationship with George Piggins who did not want Braith to sign with the Roosters... had already won the 'LeagueWeek' most overrated award twice by 2004... was not essential to our success... one of the players we clearly overpaid
7. Sherwin - quintessential 'Dogs player... junior, debuted with the club, on his day the second best halfback in the comp and yet, was behind Johns, Kimmorley, Barrett, Orford, Finch, and Gower for the NSW Origin halfback spot... we are not premiers in 2004 without Shifty
8. O'Meley - astute and fortunate recruitment given that the Northern Eagles merger fell apart
9. Perry - with all due respect, would not have gotten a FG spot at any other NRL club
10. Mason - scouted from the Newcastle comp and debuted with us in 2000
11. Maitua - an astute signing from the Rabbits that had been kicked out... could play second row, lock, five-eighth, and left centre and his ability to start the GF in the back row helped us cover for the loss of Price
12. Ryan - signed from the Eels for the 2003 season and was an Origin player already... fair enough
13. Grimaldi - from memory, he debuted with the Dragons but played very few games for them before coming across to us and was part of the club when we made that finals run in 1998... went to England (?) afterwards before coming back to us in 2002-2003

14. Hughes - part of the Hughes clan, debuted with the club, part 1998 run, and another player that got more of a run and undoubtedly more money from us than he would have from any other NRL club
15. Asotasi - part of the great scouting and recruitment the club had in NZ at the time... came up through the grades and debuted with us in 2002 from memory, and re-signed with us for less money despite strong interest from the Storm
16. Thurston - recruited from Toowoomba (?) and came up through the grades including that great 2001 jersey flegg team... debuted with us in 2002 but only started a season in FG in 2004 and we lost him straight away to the Cowboys for 2005
17. SBW - much like Asotasi, scouted and recruited from NZ (was our then NZ scout called Ackland?), came up through the grades, debuted for us that year due to a shoulder injury in 2003 and he actually missed 2 months of the season in 2004 due to an ankle injury... great junior development
18. Price - debuted with the club in the mid-90's, won two premierships, played Origin and Test matches, and captained the club

apart from overpaying our players which I am not trying to downplay and for which we rightly had our points stripped in 2002, we were powerful and did so much right in that period as a club and were successful as a result

and you do a disservice to the club labelling it as simply the result of cheating
 

Nasheed

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rubbish

to my last breath, I will believe that our 2002 team was overpaid and not that we had some unfair advantage over rivals and that is evident when you consider the squads the likes of the Roosters, Dragons, Broncos etc. had at the time... even Gus Gould at the time and still in Uncle Nick's pocket wrote in the SMH that he could have gotten our team under the cap... from memory, pre-season projections had us as a finals team but not one of the main contenders (from memory 'Big League' had us finishing 8th)... how was that possible if we had a 30% advantage over the rest of the salary cap compliant league... but in hindsight, people only remember the 17 straight wins and then simply conclude that it was because we were over the cap

and for those doubting me, seriously compare our squads with that of the talent laden Storm from 2006 to 2010

I also think you are being very disrespectful of the team building done by the club in those years... the 'Dogs club won from memory 4 Jersey Flegg premierships in 5 years at that time... we had the NRL's outstanding rookie three years out of four... we were astute with our signings including taking advantage of the Rabbits being kicked out of the comp and the Northern Eagles merger falling apart

just look at our 2004 GF squad

1. Patten - an Illawarra junior signed from the Dragons but hardly a cheque book signing as the Dragons also had is Roberts and for all the General gave us, was not a representative star calibre player
2. El Masri - local junior... played one Origin and one Test match and was great for us but again, not a star player commanding big money
3. Harris - came up through the junior grades and debuted with us... moved to the ESL shortly after the GF and did have a stint with the Cowboys from memory but not much to write about
4. Tonga - signed with us in 2004 from Parramatta for FG opportunity as he was behind representative pair Lyon and Vaealiki at the Eels... simply good recruitment
5. Utai - local junior... part of the famed 2001 jersey flegg team which included Thurston, Elsom, Asotasi, Oliver, Myles etc... NRL rookie of the year in 2002... did play for NZ but seriously, and I do not mean this as disrespect to Utai (I f*+#ing love the guy), what was his career like post 2005 when his body started breaking down and he was being targeted by the opposition with kicks?
6. Anasta - one of the big money players in our squad and we benefited from Souths being kicked out of the comp and our relationship with George Piggins who did not want Braith to sign with the Roosters... had already won the 'LeagueWeek' most overrated award twice by 2004... was not essential to our success... one of the players we clearly overpaid
7. Sherwin - quintessential 'Dogs player... junior, debuted with the club, on his day the second best halfback in the comp and yet, was behind Johns, Kimmorley, Barrett, Orford, Finch, and Gower for the NSW Origin halfback spot... we are not premiers in 2004 without Shifty
8. O'Meley - astute and fortunate recruitment given that the Northern Eagles merger fell apart
9. Perry - with all due respect, would not have gotten a FG spot at any other NRL club
10. Mason - scouted from the Newcastle comp and debuted with us in 2000
11. Maitua - an astute signing from the Rabbits that had been kicked out... could play second row, lock, five-eighth, and left centre and his ability to start the GF in the back row helped us cover for the loss of Price
12. Ryan - signed from the Eels for the 2003 season and was an Origin player already... fair enough
13. Grimaldi - from memory, he debuted with the Dragons but played very few games for them before coming across to us and was part of the club when we made that finals run in 1998... went to England (?) afterwards before coming back to us in 2002-2003

14. Hughes - part of the Hughes clan, debuted with the club, part 1998 run, and another player that got more of a run and undoubtedly more money from us than he would have from any other NRL club
15. Asotasi - part of the great scouting and recruitment the club had in NZ at the time... came up through the grades and debuted with us in 2002 from memory, and re-signed with us for less money despite strong interest from the Storm
16. Thurston - recruited from Toowoomba (?) and came up through the grades including that great 2001 jersey flegg team... debuted with us in 2002 but only started a season in FG in 2004 and we lost him straight away to the Cowboys for 2005
17. SBW - much like Asotasi, scouted and recruited from NZ (was our then NZ scout called Ackland?), came up through the grades, debuted for us that year due to a shoulder injury in 2003 and he actually missed 2 months of the season in 2004 due to an ankle injury... great junior development
18. Price - debuted with the club in the mid-90's, won two premierships, played Origin and Test matches, and captained the club

apart from overpaying our players which I am not trying to downplay and for which we rightly had our points stripped in 2002, we were powerful and did so much right in that period as a club and were successful as a result

and you do a disservice to the club labelling it as simply the result of cheating
I see the point you’re trying to make. And there’s some interesting points there.
But this is where it falls apart.
It only takes one or two of those players to have been poached elsewhere on money we wouldn’t have offered or a junior elsewhere like Mason deciding to stay out and that team doesn’t win like they do,
 

Kenya

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rubbish

to my last breath, I will believe that our 2002 team was overpaid and not that we had some unfair advantage over rivals and that is evident when you consider the squads the likes of the Roosters, Dragons, Broncos etc. had at the time... even Gus Gould at the time and still in Uncle Nick's pocket wrote in the SMH that he could have gotten our team under the cap... from memory, pre-season projections had us as a finals team but not one of the main contenders (from memory 'Big League' had us finishing 8th)... how was that possible if we had a 30% advantage over the rest of the salary cap compliant league... but in hindsight, people only remember the 17 straight wins and then simply conclude that it was because we were over the cap

and for those doubting me, seriously compare our squads with that of the talent laden Storm from 2006 to 2010

I also think you are being very disrespectful of the team building done by the club in those years... the 'Dogs club won from memory 4 Jersey Flegg premierships in 5 years at that time... we had the NRL's outstanding rookie three years out of four... we were astute with our signings including taking advantage of the Rabbits being kicked out of the comp and the Northern Eagles merger falling apart

just look at our 2004 GF squad

1. Patten - an Illawarra junior signed from the Dragons but hardly a cheque book signing as the Dragons also had is Roberts and for all the General gave us, was not a representative star calibre player
2. El Masri - local junior... played one Origin and one Test match and was great for us but again, not a star player commanding big money
3. Harris - came up through the junior grades and debuted with us... moved to the ESL shortly after the GF and did have a stint with the Cowboys from memory but not much to write about
4. Tonga - signed with us in 2004 from Parramatta for FG opportunity as he was behind representative pair Lyon and Vaealiki at the Eels... simply good recruitment
5. Utai - local junior... part of the famed 2001 jersey flegg team which included Thurston, Elsom, Asotasi, Oliver, Myles etc... NRL rookie of the year in 2002... did play for NZ but seriously, and I do not mean this as disrespect to Utai (I f*+#ing love the guy), what was his career like post 2005 when his body started breaking down and he was being targeted by the opposition with kicks?
6. Anasta - one of the big money players in our squad and we benefited from Souths being kicked out of the comp and our relationship with George Piggins who did not want Braith to sign with the Roosters... had already won the 'LeagueWeek' most overrated award twice by 2004... was not essential to our success... one of the players we clearly overpaid
7. Sherwin - quintessential 'Dogs player... junior, debuted with the club, on his day the second best halfback in the comp and yet, was behind Johns, Kimmorley, Barrett, Orford, Finch, and Gower for the NSW Origin halfback spot... we are not premiers in 2004 without Shifty
8. O'Meley - astute and fortunate recruitment given that the Northern Eagles merger fell apart
9. Perry - with all due respect, would not have gotten a FG spot at any other NRL club
10. Mason - scouted from the Newcastle comp and debuted with us in 2000
11. Maitua - an astute signing from the Rabbits that had been kicked out... could play second row, lock, five-eighth, and left centre and his ability to start the GF in the back row helped us cover for the loss of Price
12. Ryan - signed from the Eels for the 2003 season and was an Origin player already... fair enough
13. Grimaldi - from memory, he debuted with the Dragons but played very few games for them before coming across to us and was part of the club when we made that finals run in 1998... went to England (?) afterwards before coming back to us in 2002-2003

14. Hughes - part of the Hughes clan, debuted with the club, part 1998 run, and another player that got more of a run and undoubtedly more money from us than he would have from any other NRL club
15. Asotasi - part of the great scouting and recruitment the club had in NZ at the time... came up through the grades and debuted with us in 2002 from memory, and re-signed with us for less money despite strong interest from the Storm
16. Thurston - recruited from Toowoomba (?) and came up through the grades including that great 2001 jersey flegg team... debuted with us in 2002 but only started a season in FG in 2004 and we lost him straight away to the Cowboys for 2005
17. SBW - much like Asotasi, scouted and recruited from NZ (was our then NZ scout called Ackland?), came up through the grades, debuted for us that year due to a shoulder injury in 2003 and he actually missed 2 months of the season in 2004 due to an ankle injury... great junior development
18. Price - debuted with the club in the mid-90's, won two premierships, played Origin and Test matches, and captained the club

apart from overpaying our players which I am not trying to downplay and for which we rightly had our points stripped in 2002, we were powerful and did so much right in that period as a club and were successful as a result

and you do a disservice to the club labelling it as simply the result of cheating
Well said mate. And the ‘juniors’ played with passion.
How lethal was the Tonga-Utai pairing.
 
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dogwhisperer

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Let’s be real though they did that out of unity and adversity.
They never would have assembled in the first place without the scams.
That’s why when it happened to Melbourne and they all took the same money pledge the nrl stepped in and said ‘fuck that shit u need to let players go’
What!!!

You do realize players in reserve grade that were part of the squad were on inflated deals because of their connection with the club. Not mentioning any names here but you can work it out.

You do realize we let go of some really good players like Trindall, Travis Norton and Nigel Vagana before 2004.
 

alchemist

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What!!!

You do realize players in reserve grade that were part of the squad were on inflated deals because of their connection with the club. Not mentioning any names here but you can work it out.

You do realize we let go of some really good players like Trindall, Travis Norton and Nigel Vagana before 2004.
Paul Rauhihi, Darren Smith, Brett Howland and Steve Reardon as well from memory
 

dogwhisperer

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Paul Rauhihi, Darren Smith, Brett Howland and Steve Reardon as well from memory
Yeh bro 100%

We did what we had to do to win.

Most teams who won comps back then were over the cap anyway.

You think Bennett would have 7 premiership as coach if he didn’t have the whole state of origin QLD team in the Broncos side in 92,93,97,98,00 & 06.

We won fair and square.

Piss off Nashweed. Troll!!
 
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