Andrew Webster (SMH)

[GA45]

Did you misread what I posted, please feel free to quote me where I said "he's Jack Gibson"? My point was very simple the "Pay haters" hate the fact that Elliott has actually improved, they ignore it, dismiss it, rage against it and in general their biases refuse to accept the reality that their claim on no one improving is false. I'm glad to see that you agree, he has improved.

Go Dogs

Well Montoya , Lewis , Cogger , Napa , JMK, Foran, Jackson, Tolman, Holland, Sue , C.Smith, R.Smith, Ogden , RFM, Chrichton and Britt have all shown substantial improvement since Mr Pay took over as head coach. Resign him because his player development is 2nd to none and he can keep continuing to overachieve no matter what cattle he has And on top of that he’s a true Bulldog (forget the fact he left us for parra). Get it done board!!

 

[TwinTurbo]

No one said Elliott hasnt improved this year.

Here's 6 quotes, there are literally hundreds more, claiming no players have improved and last time I checked Elliott was a player (until he got injured).

This is pays 3rd year and there has been ZERO improvements

As each week passes it becomes increasingly clear that Pay, despite having a poor roster has not improved players

Pay has had 3 years, players have not improved.

I cant see where any players have improved under Pay

no improvement.

I have not seen one player improve since the day he started

In summary, a large number have said it and continue to say it even though it plainly isn't true.

Go Dogs

 

[Bazildog]

FMD, show me a post just one, where I said we were travelling OK.

As a lifetime Bulldogs supporter I absolutely hate the current position we are in and want out as fast as possible. But the hating on everything on here, literally everything (every player, the whole coaching staff, the board, Belmore, etc etc) is not achieving anything, a touch of realism is required and I'm OK with delivering it.

Go Dogs

Sucks to be pigeon holed, doesn't it?? Yes there are plenty on here that have nothing but negative things to say just as there are some on here that sound like a propaganda cheer squad. So if you dont want to be pigeon holed as one or the other then show the same respect.

I am also pissed off as a member and 45 year supporter. Optimism and loudly supporting my club and team thru good times and bad has always been my priority. But I will be fucked if I just sit back and watch us un-necessarily become a laughing stock of the competition. Anyone that likes the idea of having Bulldog people running our club (like me) 100 % wanted Dean Pay to succeed. Bullfrogs daughter and son in law (a Canterbury Legend himself) leading us in the front office was too good to be true, but I wanted it.

But, something is wrong. Yes the cap problem was significant, yes the playing roster was depleted, yes Dean is a rookie Coach. But when our roster was its worst we won 7 from 10, so now staring down the barrel of possibly 2 from 10, those excuses dont cut it.

I dont think Hollbrook or Hook or even Bennett or Bellamy would coach this group to a top 8 finish without adding some better talent in key position, but I am sure that we would certainly be more competitive. As a supporter the floggings are embarrassing.

With all the media storys and crap, the club infighting and supporters ripping into each other, the leaders of our club are doing and saying nothing. (except for that defeated sounding dribble Hill put out..)

The circuit breaker will be an announcement, player signing of significance, sponsor, coaching support or change. Nothing else will stop this shit fight from getting worse.

 

[cntrbry bnkstwn]

10.8 points per game

 

[bradyk]

Sucks to be pigeon holed, doesn't it?? Yes there are plenty on here that have nothing but negative things to say just as there are some on here that sound like a propaganda cheer squad. So if you dont want to be pigeon holed as one or the other then show the same respect.

I am also pissed off as a member and 45 year supporter. Optimism and loudly supporting my club and team thru good times and bad has always been my priority. But I will be fucked if I just sit back and watch us un-necessarily become a laughing stock of the competition. Anyone that likes the idea of having Bulldog people running our club (like me) 100 % wanted Dean Pay to succeed. Bullfrogs daughter and son in law (a Canterbury Legend himself) leading us in the front office was too good to be true, but I wanted it.

But, something is wrong. Yes the cap problem was significant, yes the playing roster was depleted, yes Dean is a rookie Coach. But when our roster was its worst we won 7 from 10, so now staring down the barrel of possibly 2 from 10, those excuses dont cut it.

I dont think Hollbrook or Hook or even Bennett or Bellamy would coach this group to a top 8 finish without adding some better talent in key position, but I am sure that we would certainly be more competitive. As a supporter the floggings are embarrassing.

With all the media storys and crap, the club infighting and supporters ripping into each other, the leaders of our club are doing and saying nothing. (except for that defeated sounding dribble Hill put out..)

The circuit breaker will be an announcement, player signing of significance, sponsor, coaching support or change. Nothing else will stop this shit fight from getting worse.

We've only been flogged three times this year. Two of those were against top four sides (Manly aren't anymore with Turbo out). We were competitive against the Roosters (premiership favourites, difference in rosters night and day) after the first 25 minutes. The Tigers game was disappointing but it was self inflicted (e.g. errors that lead straight to tries). We're 1/8 but we're not going as bad as we should be imo. Eels, Cowboys, Sharks and Rabbitohs (without Hopoate) were all winnable games. We also flogged the Dragons. That's pretty good for what's expected from us and the cattle we have.

 

[TABOO]

Here's 6 quotes, there are literally hundreds more, claiming no players have improved and last time I checked Elliott was a player (until he got injured).

In summary, a large number have said it and continue to say it even though it plainly isn't true.

Go Dogs

Sure. Fine. In a literal sense, people have said 'no one' has improved, I stand corrected if you want to take it word for word.

But what I take out of what everyone is saying is this:
We have gone from average points scored in 2018 from ~17ppg, to 2019 ~12ppg to 2020 ~10.8ppg. (These are estimated without bothering to go back and find the source)
Our defense has gone backwards and more players have regressed than progressed.
Sure, Adam Elliott (Who is in a contract year by the way - Very convenient) is 1 of a 30 player squad (Thats 3.33%) that is improved.
Players who have gone backwards include: Josh Jackson, Reimis Smith, Lachlan Lewis (If you ever rated him), DWZ, Kieran Foran (When he plays is not the player he was when he played last year), Dylan Napa... I can keep going.
You might even say JMK improved slightly (he still isnt where he should be) but this is stretching to say 2 players out of 30 have improved.

So realistically, based on a net position, no one has improved.

 

[bradyk]

Sure. Fine. In a literal sense, people have said 'no one' has improved, I stand corrected if you want to take it word for word.

But what I take out of what everyone is saying is this:
We have gone from average points scored in 2018 from ~17ppg, to 2019 ~12ppg to 2020 ~10.8ppg. (These are estimated without bothering to go back and find the source)
Our defense has gone backwards and more players have regressed than progressed.
Sure, Adam Elliott (Who is in a contract year by the way - Very convenient) is 1 of a 30 player squad (Thats 3.33%) that is improved.
Players who have gone backwards include: Josh Jackson, Reimis Smith, Lachlan Lewis (If you ever rated him), DWZ, Kieran Foran (When he plays is not the player he was when he played last year), Dylan Napa... I can keep going.
You might even say JMK improved slightly (he still isnt where he should be) but this is stretching to say 2 players out of 30 have improved.

So realistically, based on a net position, no one has improved.

We had a better roster in 2018 and we didn't strengthen leading into 2020, we actually lost two starting players. Other teams around us also strengthened (e.g. Cowboys, Tigers) as well as other teams already had better rosters but they weren't clicking for X reason (e.g. Dragons).

 

[TwinTurbo]

Sucks to be pigeon holed, doesn't it?? Yes there are plenty on here that have nothing but negative things to say just as there are some on here that sound like a propaganda cheer squad. So if you dont want to be pigeon holed as one or the other then show the same respect.

I am also pissed off as a member and 45 year supporter. Optimism and loudly supporting my club and team thru good times and bad has always been my priority. But I will be fucked if I just sit back and watch us un-necessarily become a laughing stock of the competition. Anyone that likes the idea of having Bulldog people running our club (like me) 100 % wanted Dean Pay to succeed. Bullfrogs daughter and son in law (a Canterbury Legend himself) leading us in the front office was too good to be true, but I wanted it.

But, something is wrong. Yes the cap problem was significant, yes the playing roster was depleted, yes Dean is a rookie Coach. But when our roster was its worst we won 7 from 10, so now staring down the barrel of possibly 2 from 10, those excuses dont cut it.

I dont think Hollbrook or Hook or even Bennett or Bellamy would coach this group to a top 8 finish without adding some better talent in key position, but I am sure that we would certainly be more competitive. As a supporter the floggings are embarrassing.

With all the media storys and crap, the club infighting and supporters ripping into each other, the leaders of our club are doing and saying nothing. (except for that defeated sounding dribble Hill put out..)

The circuit breaker will be an announcement, player signing of significance, sponsor, coaching support or change. Nothing else will stop this shit fight from getting worse.

I don't consider myself and many others on here as being "a propaganda cheer squad", for myself I just express my opinion and support it with facts and data whenever available. I'm sure as hell not "sitting back" and when it comes time to vote I will. But bleating on with endless negativity in a fan forum without any knowledge of what is actually happening, aside from bullshit journo's reports, is not just a waste of time but totally anti fan. FWIW there are plenty of reasons for our current state, very few if any are excuses.

Go Dogs

 

[TABOO]

We had a better roster in 2018 and we didn't strengthen leading into 2020, we actually lost two starting players. Other teams around us also strengthened (e.g. Cowboys, Tigers) as well as other teams already had better rosters but they weren't clicking for X reason (e.g. Dragons).

This is not about roster deterioration, this is about player deterioration/lack of improvement individually.

 

[bradyk]

This is not about roster deterioration, this is about player deterioration/lack of improvement individually.

You brought up how many points we've scored each year. The degrade was expected. I also believe for the reason I stated in previous post could be the reason you think players are "going backwards". Our team is worse than last year (slightly) whereas other teams have strengthened. We don't have many top players and they're the players that can look good in a roster that isn't competitive.

 

[TABOO]

You brought up how many points we've scored each year. The degrade was expected. I also believe for the reason I stated in previous post could be the reason you think players are "going backwards". Our team is worse than last year (slightly) whereas other teams have strengthened. We don't have many top players and they're the players that can look good in a roster that isn't competitive.

So you disagree that players are going backwards then?

 

[2144superman]

So you disagree that players are going backwards then?

Why are you even bothering with him? IF our situation stayed as-is for the next 5 seasons he'd still make the same excuses.

 

[bradyk]

So you disagree that players are going backwards then?

I'm of the belief that we overachieved last year. If you don't believe that, maybe that's why you think players are going backwards? I'm fine with where Hopoate, DWZ, Foran, Wakeham, RFM and Elliott are at. Reimis has gone backwards, but he went backwards last year. Jackson isn't getting involved for whatever reason. You could say Hopoate and RFM are improved. Wakeham had his best game last week. The rest of the players aren't going to be in the 13 next year. This season is going exactly how it was expected to. I think we're unlucky to not have a couple of extra wins next to our name (those winnable games I mentioned earlier). If we continue to play how we have been (we have lost Hopoate and now Elliott for the season which is massive) I think we'll avoid the wooden spoon which was the objective this season.

 

[GA45]

We've only been flogged three times this year. Two of those were against top four sides (Manly aren't anymore with Turbo out). We were competitive against the Roosters (premiership favourites, difference in rosters night and day) after the first 25 minutes. The Tigers game was disappointing but it was self inflicted (e.g. errors that lead straight to tries). We're 1/8 but we're not going as bad as we should be imo. Eels, Cowboys, Sharks and Rabbitohs (without Hopoate) were all winnable games. We also flogged the Dragons. That's pretty good for what's expected from us and the cattle we have.

Overachieving for the win!!

 

[TABOO]

I'm of the belief that we overachieved last year. If you don't believe that, maybe that's why you think players are going backwards? I'm fine with where Hopoate, DWZ, Foran, Wakeham, RFM and Elliott are at. Reimis has gone backwards, but he went backwards last year. Jackson isn't getting involved for whatever reason. You could say Hopoate and RFM are improved. Wakeham had his best game last week. The rest of the players aren't going to be in the 13 next year. This season is going exactly how it was expected to. I think we're unlucky to not have a couple of extra wins next to our name (those winnable games I mentioned earlier). If we continue to play how we have been (we have lost Hopoate and now Elliott for the season which is massive) I think we'll avoid the wooden spoon which was the objective this season.

Ok Brad.

 

[bradyk]

Ok Brad.

Realism.

 

[AlzzBulldog]

I'm of the belief that we overachieved last year. If you don't believe that, maybe that's why you think players are going backwards? I'm fine with where Hopoate, DWZ, Foran, Wakeham, RFM and Elliott are at. Reimis has gone backwards, but he went backwards last year. Jackson isn't getting involved for whatever reason. You could say Hopoate and RFM are improved. Wakeham had his best game last week. The rest of the players aren't going to be in the 13 next year. This season is going exactly how it was expected to. I think we're unlucky to not have a couple of extra wins next to our name (those winnable games I mentioned earlier). If we continue to play how we have been (we have lost Hopoate and now Elliott for the season which is massive) I think we'll avoid the wooden spoon which was the objective this season.

This is prime example of loser mentality, you a clown

 

[bradyk]

This is prime example of loser mentality, you a clown

It isn't loser mentality because I go into every game knowing we have at least 1% chance we can win the game (% is obviously dependent on calibre of team we're playing). This is just realistic expectations.

 

[B-Train]

If anyone ever got into politics you'd want Bradyk, Horse and Twin Turbo working on your campaign.

You could get caught on live TV shooting heroin while having sex with midget ladyboy prostitutes and they'd still put a positive spin on it and defend you as if you were blameless.

 

[TABOO]

Realism.

I justrecognise when I am wasting my time.