Opinion Tall timber

[D.O.W.]

"Revelation" lol calm down.

If DWZ didn’t join us mid-season, we run last or second last at best last year.

He was a revelation..for the Bulldogs.

 

[Kempsey Dog]

But I'm not even talking about what he has or hasn't done at Penrith. I'm only concerned what he does at our club and so far he has been a revelation to our team imo.

We didn't make the 8 though... So that's not revolutionary in my eyes. Did he set up tries with cut out passes on a sweep? Did he kick to his outside men if something was on ? He lacks vision when it comes to ball playing. Like few others have said playing off passion only gets you so far eg Josh Reynolds

 

[Natboy]

We didn't make the 8 though... So that's not revolutionary in my eyes. Did he set up tries with cut out passes on a sweep? Did he kick to his outside men if something was on ? He lacks vision when it comes to ball playing. Like few others have said playing off passion only gets you so far eg Josh Reynolds

We were set to make the 8 until he got injured

 

[DinkumDog]

We were set to make the 8 until he got injured

Courtesy of that Nathan Brown grub from Parra-doesn’t-matta. Can’t wait for Round 1!

 

[Natboy]

Courtesy of that Nathan Brown grub from Parra-doesn’t-matta. Can’t wait for Round 1!

Exactly! We would’ve beaten the cowboys, farewelling their stadium or not!

 

[Kempsey Dog]

We were set to make the 8 until he got injured

Nah we still needed results to fall our way. It was a fun ride, but we were never making it

 

[Natboy]

Nah we still needed results to fall our way. It was a fun ride, but we were never making it

We’ll never know but one thing I know is we wouldn’t have been close without that signing

 

[wendog33]

We're going in circles because you refuse to accept the fact that spine players need to produce points and instead have warped some weird argument and made ridiculous claims.

DWZ can run as hard as he wants, tackle as hard as he wants, be as inspirational as much as he wants, but if he can't improve our attacking output then he isn't a solution at fullback, simple as that.

His ability as a ball runner and ball player is very limited. Yes he runs hard, yes he can attack the spaces Infront of him or beat a defender, but right now ask anything more from him and he struggles.

So no I don't think he is a bad player, I think he is a very good player but limited so have doubts over his longterm future in the fullback role. He can just as easily play centre or wing and still run as hard as he wants, tackle as hard as he wants and be as inspirational as he wants.

I'm just really having a hard time trying to understand why people are declaring certain players a dead certainty in the spine when not one of them has actually delivered what we need and are part of the worst performing spine in the competition.

Your harsh..but accurate. He has been great for us and I wont knock him but he is very limited in creating anything. We need a Patton or Silva type at least with such an unaccomplished halves pairing as Cogger/Lewis.

Hoping he develops his fb game but he hasn't been so outstanding that the recruitment team shouldn't be looking for a complete fullback who has all the required talent IMO.

 

[NPC83]

Your harsh..but accurate. He has been great for us and I wont knock him but he is very limited in creating anything. We need a Patton or Silva type at least with such an unaccomplished halves pairing as Cogger/Lewis.

Hoping he develops his fb game but he hasn't been so outstanding that the recruitment team shouldn't be looking for a complete fullback who has all the required talent IMO.

Patton’s kick returns where as penetrating as throwing a raw sausage at a brick wall...

 

[Natboy]

Patton’s kick returns where as penetrating as throwing a raw sausage at a brick wall...

Agreed. DWZ definitely has more impact and the people criticising him will never be pleased

 

[TwinTurbo]

We're going in circles because you refuse to accept the fact that spine players need to produce points and instead have warped some weird argument and made ridiculous claims.
DWZ can run as hard as he wants, tackle as hard as he wants, be as inspirational as much as he wants, but if he can't improve our attacking output then he isn't a solution at fullback, simple as that.
His ability as a ball runner and ball player is very limited. Yes he runs hard, yes he can attack the spaces Infront of him or beat a defender, but right now ask anything more from him and he struggles.
So no I don't think he is a bad player, I think he is a very good player but limited so have doubts over his longterm future in the fullback role. He can just as easily play centre or wing and still run as hard as he wants, tackle as hard as he wants and be as inspirational as he wants.
I'm just really having a hard time trying to understand why people are declaring certain players a dead certainty in the spine when not one of them has actually delivered what we need and are part of the worst performing spine in the competition.

It seems to me that you don't like DWZ, in that you want someone better in the FB position for us. If that's your position then you surely must have someone in mind, someone who is better in the areas you describe, someone who is available for 2020 or 2021. Someone that we can fit into our limit cap space for 2020, someone who is unsigned, or looks likely to leave his current club. Obviously we have plenty of space for 2021, with 15 players off contract next year, so someone for 2021 perhaps.

I'd also like to question the logic of your attack on DWZ's abilities. You say "he runs hard, yes he can attack the spaces Infront of him or beat a defender" that to me sounds like a pretty formidable arsenal for a fullback. What is required is for the players around him to be ready to support him when he, for example, "beats a defender". As the season went on that realisation started to appear, but a full pre season of training with the back rowers, wingers and centres who need to be ready to support him when he does. When that happens the opposition has to recognise the support players which then spreads the defence and gives the fullback more options, more space to work in. The effectiveness of a fullback is not just his own abilities but those around him. An obvious example, Tedesco is a much more effective player in the Chooks and NSW teams surrounded by class players that attract the defence than he was at the Tiggers where the opposition could concentrate on him, limiting his opportunities.

Next, you claim that DWZ has "not actually delivered what we need", I believe if we ran a survey on that you may well be a minority of one. I'm sure you saw the same as we all did, that what he delivered lifted the team by his abilities on the field, not just what resulted directly from it but by the attitude lift that it gave to the team as whole. Not just on the field but off it as well. Personally I'm looking forward to watching him deliver ever more this year as the players around him learn how to support his abilities.

Lastly, your claim that we have "the worst performing spine in the competition", personally I can't name one of the Titan's spine players that I would swap for ours. Similarly the DragOns, even if he only plays half a season I'd rate Foran over Norman any day. Cowboys, seriously you rate their spine over ours? The Warriors, obviously RTS is one of the best players in the NRL (many would say the best if he had the support around him), Green does OK, but on the whole I'd rate our spine higher. Knights fall aware rapidly after Ponga (rapidly taking over from Boyd as the most overrated player in the NRL) and Pierce. Who, aside from Cleary is better in the Panthers spine?

I did note your choice of words in "worst performing" (past tense?) since we didn't finish last last season then surely it's a bit rich to claim we have the worst performing spine. What's it based on, points scored by the spine? Hardly a reasonable comparison when several of the others teams spine players kick goals and our goal kickers are outside backs. Since we experienced a large number of positional changes early in the season the full year stats for the spine don't truly represent what a settled team would produce. I don't know about yours but my crystal ball is still rather cloudy about how our spine will go in 2020, that story is yet to be written.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

 

[CrittaMagic69]

It seems to me that you don't like DWZ, in that you want someone better in the FB position for us. If that's your position then you surely must have someone in mind, someone who is better in the areas you describe, someone who is available for 2020 or 2021. Someone that we can fit into our limit cap space for 2020, someone who is unsigned, or looks likely to leave his current club. Obviously we have plenty of space for 2021, with 15 players off contract next year, so someone for 2021 perhaps.

I'd also like to question the logic of your attack on DWZ's abilities. You say "he runs hard, yes he can attack the spaces Infront of him or beat a defender" that to me sounds like a pretty formidable arsenal for a fullback. What is required is for the players around him to be ready to support him when he, for example, "beats a defender". As the season went on that realisation started to appear, but a full pre season of training with the back rowers, wingers and centres who need to be ready to support him when he does. When that happens the opposition has to recognise the support players which then spreads the defence and gives the fullback more options, more space to work in. The effectiveness of a fullback is not just his own abilities but those around him. An obvious example, Tedesco is a much more effective player in the Chooks and NSW teams surrounded by class players that attract the defence than he was at the Tiggers where the opposition could concentrate on him, limiting his opportunities.

Next, you claim that DWZ has "not actually delivered what we need", I believe if we ran a survey on that you may well be a minority of one. I'm sure you saw the same as we all did, that what he delivered lifted the team by his abilities on the field, not just what resulted directly from it but by the attitude lift that it gave to the team as whole. Not just on the field but off it as well. Personally I'm looking forward to watching him deliver ever more this year as the players around him learn how to support his abilities.

Lastly, your claim that we have "the worst performing spine in the competition", personally I can't name one of the Titan's spine players that I would swap for ours. Similarly the DragOns, even if he only plays half a season I'd rate Foran over Norman any day. Cowboys, seriously you rate their spine over ours? The Warriors, obviously RTS is one of the best players in the NRL (many would say the best if he had the support around him), Green does OK, but on the whole I'd rate our spine higher. Knights fall aware rapidly after Ponga (rapidly taking over from Boyd as the most overrated player in the NRL) and Pierce. Who, aside from Cleary is better in the Panthers spine?

I did note your choice of words in "worst performing" (past tense?) since we didn't finish last last season then surely it's a bit rich to claim we have the worst performing spine. What's it based on, points scored by the spine? Hardly a reasonable comparison when several of the others teams spine players kick goals and our goal kickers are outside backs. Since we experienced a large number of positional changes early in the season the full year stats for the spine don't truly represent what a settled team would produce. I don't know about yours but my crystal ball is still rather cloudy about how our spine will go in 2020, that story is yet to be written.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

Oh god lol

 

[TwinTurbo]

Oh god lol

I was actually going to say the same about your post, but I thought that would be lame, much better to respond in a manner appropriate to what it deserved.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

 

[CrittaMagic69]

I was actually going to say the same about your post, but I thought that would be lame, much better to respond in a manner appropriate to what it deserved.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

Because your thoughts are in a different galaxy along with making ridiculous assumptions, there's no point to continuing the conversation.

 

[CrittaMagic69]

Your harsh..but accurate. He has been great for us and I wont knock him but he is very limited in creating anything. We need a Patton or Silva type at least with such an unaccomplished halves pairing as Cogger/Lewis.

Hoping he develops his fb game but he hasn't been so outstanding that the recruitment team shouldn't be looking for a complete fullback who has all the required talent IMO.

Some on here can't seem to grasp the idea that a spine player needs to be a creative outlet, probably the same people that suck Lewis off because of his defence. They also can't seem to understand that I'm more than happy for DWZ to play at fullback again next season and give him the opportunity to improve certain areas in his game.

 

[wendog33]

Some on here can't seem to grasp the idea that a spine player needs to be a creative outlet, probably the same people that suck Lewis off because of his defence. They also can't seem to understand that I'm more than happy for DWZ to play at fullback again next season and give him the opportunity to improve certain areas in his game.

My thoughts exactly.

They get wound up about others opinions...next minute when it suits them, they themselves point out shortcomings in players and the roster and how Pay and the players need AT LEAST a 50/50 win loss record after first 10 games.

I dont get it. Poor pets much.

 

[TwinTurbo]

Because your thoughts are in a different galaxy along with making ridiculous assumptions, there's no point to continuing the conversation.

OK I get it, you have no response and so you resort to avoiding a discussion, one that you know you can’t possibly win. Next I’m sure you will resort to personal insults, the last call of a desperate poster without a proper argument to defend.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

 

[CrittaMagic69]

OK I get it, you have no response and so you resort to avoiding a discussion, one that you know you can’t possibly win. Next I’m sure you will resort to personal insults, the last call of a desperate poster without a proper argument to defend.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

Congratulations @TwinTurbo, you are the winner for todays internet discussion! A moderator will soon be in contact and arrange for you to receive your prize!

 

[DinkumDog]

My thoughts exactly.

They get wound up about others opinions...next minute when it suits them, they themselves point out shortcomings in players and the roster and how Pay and the players need AT LEAST a 50/50 win loss record after first 10 games.

I dont get it. Poor pets much.

I’m interested Wendog - how would you judge a decent start to the season - adequate improvement over the last two? A 50% win/loss ratio in the first 10 games seems fair for starting to frame decisions for 2021 and beyond - both coaching and squad?

 

[Kempsey Dog]

It seems to me that you don't like DWZ, in that you want someone better in the FB position for us. If that's your position then you surely must have someone in mind, someone who is better in the areas you describe, someone who is available for 2020 or 2021. Someone that we can fit into our limit cap space for 2020, someone who is unsigned, or looks likely to leave his current club. Obviously we have plenty of space for 2021, with 15 players off contract next year, so someone for 2021 perhaps.

I'd also like to question the logic of your attack on DWZ's abilities. You say "he runs hard, yes he can attack the spaces Infront of him or beat a defender" that to me sounds like a pretty formidable arsenal for a fullback. What is required is for the players around him to be ready to support him when he, for example, "beats a defender". As the season went on that realisation started to appear, but a full pre season of training with the back rowers, wingers and centres who need to be ready to support him when he does. When that happens the opposition has to recognise the support players which then spreads the defence and gives the fullback more options, more space to work in. The effectiveness of a fullback is not just his own abilities but those around him. An obvious example, Tedesco is a much more effective player in the Chooks and NSW teams surrounded by class players that attract the defence than he was at the Tiggers where the opposition could concentrate on him, limiting his opportunities.

Next, you claim that DWZ has "not actually delivered what we need", I believe if we ran a survey on that you may well be a minority of one. I'm sure you saw the same as we all did, that what he delivered lifted the team by his abilities on the field, not just what resulted directly from it but by the attitude lift that it gave to the team as whole. Not just on the field but off it as well. Personally I'm looking forward to watching him deliver ever more this year as the players around him learn how to support his abilities.

Lastly, your claim that we have "the worst performing spine in the competition", personally I can't name one of the Titan's spine players that I would swap for ours. Similarly the DragOns, even if he only plays half a season I'd rate Foran over Norman any day. Cowboys, seriously you rate their spine over ours? The Warriors, obviously RTS is one of the best players in the NRL (many would say the best if he had the support around him), Green does OK, but on the whole I'd rate our spine higher. Knights fall aware rapidly after Ponga (rapidly taking over from Boyd as the most overrated player in the NRL) and Pierce. Who, aside from Cleary is better in the Panthers spine?

I did note your choice of words in "worst performing" (past tense?) since we didn't finish last last season then surely it's a bit rich to claim we have the worst performing spine. What's it based on, points scored by the spine? Hardly a reasonable comparison when several of the others teams spine players kick goals and our goal kickers are outside backs. Since we experienced a large number of positional changes early in the season the full year stats for the spine don't truly represent what a settled team would produce. I don't know about yours but my crystal ball is still rather cloudy about how our spine will go in 2020, that story is yet to be written.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs

I couldn't read all that @Sancho2020 lol