How will you measure success in 2020

bradyk

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How are deals that finish in 2020 linked to anything after 2020?
I don't want to copy paste but I literally posted it. You replied to this by the way:

"This salary cap has been and still is a huge saga
It feels like there is no end in sight sometimes"

Just because it's 2021 doesn't mean everything is back to "normal". There are still difficulties we're going to face and recruitment is one of them.
 

Spoonman84

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I don't want to copy paste but I literally posted it.
All those things you mentioned have nothing to do with backloaded deals though. I really don’t understand where you are coming from with this?
 

bradyk

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All those things you mentioned have nothing to do with backloaded deals though. I really don’t understand where you are coming from with this?
There is an after effect due to back ending contracts... (which would be the same to lack of success)? I don't know how more obvious I can be if you don't get it at this point I'll just be repeating myself.
 

DinkumDog

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I'm not sure if you're reading my posts but the after effect remains regarding recruitment moving forward. They're linked. The same reasons why we missed out on more signings similar to DWZ will be there.
You’re always going to have some continuity issues though because all contracts are staggered. So it’s a matter of good roster management as the Chooks have proven rather than trying to overpay any shape of a current roster, which is where we went wrong.

I agree with the new policy of shorter contracts and make the players earn their upgrades and extensions - partly a seperate issue, but ties into overall roster management.
 

Spoonman84

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There is an after effect due to back ending contracts... (which would be the same to lack of success)?
Can’t agree at all that can all be sorted if you have the right people in charge and can get deals done. Do we have them? That remains to be seen. What I’m saying is that there is no physical problem with backloaded deals after 2020 which is 100% fact.
 

bradyk

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You’re always going to have some continuity issues though because all contracts are staggered. So it’s a matter of good roster management as the Chooks have proven rather than trying to overpay any shape of a current roster, which is where we went wrong.

I agree with the new policy of shorter contracts and make the players earn their upgrades and extensions - partly a seperate issue, but ties into overall roster management.
Which is why it's going to be a longer rebuild then other clubs have done. We can't recruit like the Roosters (get who we want without overpaying) so we have two obvious ways to go about rebuilding the roster and one takes longer than the other (which looks like we're going with which is okay).
 

bradyk

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Can’t agree at all that can all be sorted if you have the right people in charge and can get deals done. Do we have them? That remains to be seen. What I’m saying is that there is no physical problem with backloaded deals after 2020 which is 100% fact.
You're not thinking hard and far enough then if you believe that (we're already seeing it now).
 

TwinTurbo

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Not really at the end of 2020 backloaded deals have absolutely no impact at all. There might be other issues getting recruits but backloaded deals isn’t one.
Maybe you have better information, but I haven't seen any evidence that says there couldn't be existing back ended contracts that carry on to 2021. There are a small number of contracts from the previous administration that don't finish until 2021 and they could well be back ended.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs
 

bradyk

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Spoonman84

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Maybe you have better information, but I haven't seen any evidence that says there couldn't be existing back ended contracts that carry on to 2021. There are a small number of contracts from the previous administration that don't finish until 2021 and they could well be back ended.

Happy New Year to All
Go Dogs
Who are they? I’m pretty confident that there isn’t any.
 

Spoonman84

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100% fact? As soon as 2021 hits we'll start recruiting like the Roosters!
I’m not saying that I’m saying there is no longer backloaded deals on our cap after 2020.
 

DinkumDog

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Which is why it's going to be a longer rebuild then other clubs have done. We can't recruit like the Roosters (get who we want without overpaying) so we have two obvious ways to go about rebuilding the roster and one takes longer than the other (which looks like we're going with which is okay).
I think what you’re saying is the rebuild is in two parts - first was to clear the cap mess and second is to build results and attract ‘better’ players. Sure, I don’t dispute that but that’s what every club has to strive for - manage your cap so you avoid #1 and #2 is ongoing - build a squad good enough to win a comp and the inevitable rebuild that follows because it’s near impossible to keep comp winning squads together - one of the reasons why back-to-back titles are hard to achieve and impressive when achieved these days. The Chooks won’t be at the top forever (assuming they’re playing by the rules)...
 

bradyk

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I’m not saying that I’m saying there is no longer backloaded deals on our cap after 2020.
And I said there is going to be an after effect due to back ending deals/lack of success and you're disagreeing which is ludicrous.
 

bradyk

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I think what you’re saying is the rebuild is in two parts - first was to clear the cap mess and second is to build results and attract ‘better’ players. Sure, I don’t dispute that but that’s what every club has to strive for - manage your cap so you avoid #1 and #2 is ongoing - build a squad good enough to win a comp and the inevitable rebuild that follows because it’s near impossible to keep comp winning squads together - one of the reasons why back-to-back titles are hard to achieve and impressive when achieved these days. The Chooks won’t be at the top forever (assuming they’re playing by the rules)...
Yeah. I'd say the rebuild is over when we've assembled a squad that can contend for the premiership. The first step is rebuilding into a top eight team. When you're at the top it's easy to recruit (Roosters are at the top of the pecking order) and as long as you don't mess up who you recruit and your squad management it takes a lot to fall. Other clubs will pay overs for your players and it's hard to keep everyone. You just need to recruit the next best thing for value (if you're a successful club it's also going to be easier to develop talent as they're coming into a winning culture).
 

Spoonman84

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And I said there is going to be an after effect due to back ending deals/lack of success and you're disagreeing which is ludicrous.
There is going to be absolutely no after effect from the last backloaded deal finishing this year. You believe there will I don’t fair enough. I’m done with the discussion.
 

wendog33

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I don't have evidence but I suspect we paid overs for just about everyone, rather than big big dollars to just two or three players. On the basis we thought the cap was going to increase much more, I'd say we signed blokes like Holland, Montoya and Elliott for way too much.

If not that, then I'm with you - where did the bloody money go?
This is the best explanation...Total balls up all round :grinning:

SC been stuffed and unworkable for years.

If half the roster are getting big money at the back end of their contract, 2019 leading to 2020, then the money splashed to guys in 2016-17-18 must have been sensational. Des bought that player loyalty on the back of crazy money for average players.
 

Shire Dog

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I’m not saying that I’m saying there is no longer backloaded deals on our cap after 2020.
That’s fantastic news for everybody associated with this great club
I’ve always said we are the most passionate supporters who in recent times have endured a lot and been put to the test when it comes to staying loyal
We can finally put the backloading nightmare to bed in 2021
Better times in the near future for all.
 

DinkumDog

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Yeah. I'd say the rebuild is over when we've assembled a squad that can contend for the premiership. The first step is rebuilding into a top eight team. When you're at the top it's easy to recruit (Roosters are at the top of the pecking order) and as long as you don't mess up who you recruit and your squad management it takes a lot to fall. Other clubs will pay overs for your players and it's hard to keep everyone. You just need to recruit the next best thing for value (if you're a successful club it's also going to be easier to develop talent as they're coming into a winning culture).
I hear ya, and I think we can be or will go close to being that Top 8 team this year. In effect though the second ‘rebuild’ never ends (to stay Top 4) - shrewd cap management and being ready to pounce when the next Cooper Cronk becomes available is key. Chooks didn’t hesitate to cut a rep player like Pearce (previous off field issues or not) - because they knew Cronk was better and could deliver a premiership. It paid off, they got 2. Now their challenge is what’s next as Flanagan ain’t no Cronk (yet, anyway). We’ll need the same bank and smarts to deliver the same results - it’s a cut-throat business whether we like it or not.
 

Shire Dog

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It’s not crazy mate, it’s supporting your team and good on you for doing so. I’m at almost all games as well (certainly all Sydney games) and I believe the team needs our support in good times and bad. Hopefully it won’t be long and the big crowds will be back (a mix of true believers and some fair-weathers) chanting ‘BULLDOGS!’... I agree a few teams look a bit average and that’s one of the reasons I believe we can make the 8 this year.
I also attend the Sydney games and am always impressed with how many
supporters turn up considering our form the last 5 years
The 2019 membership of 18,000 is not to shabby at all
Those teams you mentioned as average might show up this year
Have a feeling it’s going to be hard work with this squad
 
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