Climate Change Protests

Dawgfather

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What???? Funding cut off by the same Government which is in bed with coal companies and resists major change at every turn? Come on, dude....that makes no fucking sense :P
I think that's a tough argument to make. State Governments have gone out of their way to ensure there have been no new coal mines built and no expansions approved for years now.

IF the govt was in bed with coal companies then you would expect to see new coal mines or expansions to existing ones and/or new coal fired power stations.
 

Dawgfather

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They've been doing that for years, though.....
Exactly my point. Doing it for decades and the public has not been convinced. I think generally people are convinced the climate is 'changing' but I don't think people believe that the human race is entirely responsible and I don't think they believe the impact is anywhere near as great as the activists try to tell us.
 

Dawgfather

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So they are happy to reap the benefits of these 'evil' companies production but then complain about how it is received. ROFL, you cant make this stuff up.

What are they giving up to support their claims, or is it a case of "its someone else's problem to fix?" Calling on others to act is NOT action.

Give up everything you claim is bad otherwise stfu and take a seat.
Prince Harry and Megan Markle and the british royal family are good sympbols of most climate change activists.

They'll tell you that you're an awful human for not blindly believing their claims, but then they'll take private jets and generate more carbon emissions in one week than most humans will in their life time.
 

Bob dog

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Who are they actually protesting against?
The industrial world?
Waste off effort, Governments have reduced emissions.
Federal Government has invested millions to ensure coal arrives on time for export, it floats our economy during recession.
 

Flanagun

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I think that's a tough argument to make. State Governments have gone out of their way to ensure there have been no new coal mines built and no expansions approved for years now.

IF the govt was in bed with coal companies then you would expect to see new coal mines or expansions to existing ones and/or new coal fired power stations.
That's not even true....Watermark mine and Wallarah 2 mine have recently been approved in NSW and five more new mining projects and expansions have already been recommended for approval. Not to mention Adani, which is a massive project which has been all over the news. Come on, dude.,...you're just making shit up.
 

Flanagun

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Exactly my point. Doing it for decades and the public has not been convinced. I think generally people are convinced the climate is 'changing' but I don't think people believe that the human race is entirely responsible and I don't think they believe the impact is anywhere near as great as the activists try to tell us.
Because people are pig headed and stubborn....when EXPERTS tell them there is a problem they clutch at straws and claim vested interests.
 

Dawgfather

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I just don't think the debate is a complicated one.

If the science was so 'clear' like we get told every day, then I think the 'action' these activists talk about would have been considered more seriously.

But I don't think the science is clear.

What is clear is that the forecasts for 'warming' have been wrong on a consistent basis (fact), and for some strange coincidence the miscalculations always seem to lead to the forecasts predicting more warming than actually occurs (go figure).
 

Dawgfather

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That's not even true....Watermark mine and Wallarah 2 mine have recently been approved in NSW and five more new mining projects and expansions have already been recommended for approval. Not to mention Adani, which is a massive project which has been all over the news. Come on, dude.,...you're just making shit up.
My point is that in general the trend is towards less new coal mines and expansions and power stations.

My personal opinion is that we are the most resource rich country in the world yet we don't take advantage of this. We are sitting on stupid amounts of gas, coal and uranium, yet we have some of the highest power prices in the world.

It's stupidity of the highest order. We should be able to give businesses low power costs and hence low costs of business, yet the opposite is happening.
 

Flanagun

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Are people 'pig headed and stubborn' only when they don't support your argument? Or 100% of the time? Were they pig headed and stubborn when they voted for same sex marriage?
Denying evidence supported by an overwhelming majority of scientists and making up cock and bull stories about the majority of scientists lying to receive funding....and falsely claiming politicians around the country don't continue to support and endorse new mining projects is stubborn pig headedness, there's no better way to describe it.

One issue is an evidence based, scientific issue and another is a social issue which comes down to subjective opinions about personal freedoms and/ or morality. Weird comparison. The only common ground, is just like the SSM debate, conservatives again seem to be going against a consensus.
 

Flanagun

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My point is that in general the trend is towards less new coal mines and expansions and power stations.

My personal opinion is that we are the most resource rich country in the world yet we don't take advantage of this. We are sitting on stupid amounts of gas, coal and uranium, yet we have some of the highest power prices in the world.

It's stupidity of the highest order. We should be able to give businesses low power costs and hence low costs of business, yet the opposite is happening.
Do you have any stats or evidence to support the view we are approving less projects/ expansions than we used to?

And if you are convinced the Government is reluctant to fund scientists who go against the consensus on climate change, what is their interest in doing so? Why would governments even think of creating economic headaches for themselves if there wasn't a very real problem? If this was strictly an ideological issue, the Labor Govt in Queensland wouldn't have approved Adani.
 
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JUNKYARD DOGS

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I just don't think the debate is a complicated one.

If the science was so 'clear' like we get told every day, then I think the 'action' these activists talk about would have been considered more seriously.

But I don't think the science is clear.

What is clear is that the forecasts for 'warming' have been wrong on a consistent basis (fact), and for some strange coincidence the miscalculations always seem to lead to the forecasts predicting more warming than actually occurs (go figure).
upload_2019-10-8_11-3-40.png
 

Dawgfather

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Denying evidence supported by an overwhelming majority of scientists
I generally agree that where a majority of scientists agree on something, I am more likely to pay attention and possibly change my behaviour to suit their conclusions (assuming it's in my interest to do so).

The issue here is that I think a lot of people recognise that the climate change issue has become one of religion and not one of science.

People are religious about climate change and it's harming your own argument.
 

Flanagun

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Have fun. This map shows where the worlds carbon and pollution is coming from. I'll give you a hint (it's not Australia)

https://www.carbonbrief.org/mapped-worlds-coal-power-plants
Lol that has nothing to do with the question I asked you. We may not be the biggest polluter out there, but we contrinute a lot to the problem given our relatively small population....and if we continue the way we are going, we are hardly in a good position to lobby other governments to change, are we? Adani is an Indian company, by the way....so by approving that project here, we are actively enabling one of the biggest polluters.
 

Dawgfather

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Do you have any stats or evidence to support the view we are approving less projects/ expansions than we used to?

And if you are convinced the Government is reluctant to fund scientists who go against the consensus on climate change, what is their interest in doing so? Why would governments even think of creating economic headaches for themselves if there wasn't a very real problem? If this was strictly an ideological issue, the Labor Govt in Queensland wouldn't have approved Adani.
The Labor government in Queensland approved Adani because their hand was forced by the federal election which you may or may not remember.

The federal labor government got absolutely wiped out in Queensland because Shorten pissed off the unions who wanted Adani to go ahead for the jobs benefit. Seeing the result of running AGAINST jobs, the queensland state government had to approve Adani or they'd be wiped out as well.

I'm not trying to be a dick here, but people care more about their job and their livelihood than they do about climate change religion.
 

Flanagun

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I generally agree that where a majority of scientists agree on something, I am more likely to pay attention and possibly change my behaviour to suit their conclusions (assuming it's in my interest to do so).

The issue here is that I think a lot of people recognise that the climate change issue has become one of religion and not one of science.

People are religious about climate change and it's harming your own argument.
It's not an issue of religion if there is evidence to support it.... religion is all about faith - belief in the absence of evidence.
 

Dawgfather

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Lol that has nothing to do with the question I asked you. We may not be the biggest polluter out there, but we contrinute a lot to the problem given our relatively small population....and if we continue the way we are going, we are hardly in a good position to lobby other governments to change, are we? Adani is an Indian company, by the way....so by approving that project here, we are actively enabling one of the biggest polluters.
Australia contributes 1.4% of global emissions.

We could do everything you want and it would make shit all difference to global temperatures. But it might make you and other activists feel warm and fuzzy inside.

But you do realise what ACTUAL difference it would make? It would make an actual difference on regular australian's electricity bills by increasing what they pay. This would disproportionately affect people on lower incomes and people in rural communities already struggling to get by.
 
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