Religious Discussion Thread

[The DoggFather]

If you want to dive deeper into the issues with that Leviticus passage, a biblical scholar from Harvard covers it really well. He goes on a deep dive about how the homosexual part may have been added later, as well as addressing other issues with it

Opinion | The Secret History of Leviticus (Published 2018)

The Bible forbids gay sex. But an earlier version of the text permitted it.

www.nytimes.com

It has a pay wall.

To be blunt it doesn't affect me so I have no horse in the race. I have my own sins to worry about TBH.

I just get the shits when demon ***** use the Bible incorrectly to spread their hate/agenda.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

It has a pay wall.

To be blunt it doesn't affect me so I have no horse in the race. I have my own sins to worry about TBH.

I just get the shits when demon ***** use the Bible incorrectly to spread their hate/agenda.

I often forget about paywalls...

This link should be readable if you open it on your phone. Maybe on computer too

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

 

[The DoggFather]

I often forget about paywalls...

This link should be readable if you open it on your phone. Maybe on computer too

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

Still paywall but was taking screen shots to read it lol

Interesting read though. From what I quickly read it looks like they are trying to examine it through a legal view?

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Still paywall but was taking screen shots to read it lol

Interesting read though. From what I quickly read it looks like they are trying to examine it through a legal view?

Yeah, plus other things. They cover the law at the time, translations and historical investigation. It's like any theological thing. It's hard to get true accuracy because it's too long ago, but it does raise some interesting points that is often raised with Biblical scholars. The Bible has had many versions. Even before the New Testament there was many versions of the Torah/Old Testament which changed over time.

The same thing was done with the New Testament. New words and descriptions were added. Some argue it was done to support the bias at the time (adding anti-homosexual verses and translations to support the changing law), while others argue that the change was due to the people not having words for it at the time.

Definitely a complex an confusing issue, but I like to look at it from all angles.

 

[Kelpie03]

Evil, false prophet.... the piece of shit has taken it out of context PURPOSELY. Don't know how he got line them up and shoot them when the passage he is using finishes with "their blood shall be upon them" not their blood shall be upon you. The death part of the scripture is spiritual death IE hell IE absence of God.

The Bible doesn't tell us to kill, in fact we are commanded not to.

This demon parading as a "Pastor" is trying to skew the Bible to suit his agenda. Im not a preacher but I'd shut this evil **** down in about 5 mins with scripture.

There is a special place in hell for these false prophets. They know the truth yet skew it to sprout hate.

Who needs atheists or satanists when man made religion has demons infiltrated already.

PS the way he is protesting it appears he is a self hating homosexual.

He probably is that, genuine Christians will defend Christs teachings but do it (or should do it) without outering the slighest bit of hate.
BTW I've heard a few of our Priests, love the sinner but hate the sin, which makes sence considering he saved the adulterous women.

 

[Kelpie03]

Yeah, plus other things. They cover the law at the time, translations and historical investigation. It's like any theological thing. It's hard to get true accuracy because it's too long ago, but it does raise some interesting points that is often raised with Biblical scholars. The Bible has had many versions. Even before the New Testament there was many versions of the Torah/Old Testament which changed over time.

The same thing was done with the New Testament. New words and descriptions were added. Some argue it was done to support the bias at the time (adding anti-homosexual verses and translations to support the changing law), while others argue that the change was due to the people not having words for it at the time.

Definitely a complex an confusing issue, but I like to look at it from all angles.

I can't disagree with you regarding some of the writings in the old testament, while many writings give us very good messages some appear to even controdict Christs teachings,
AS for the new testament, I don't believe that the Gospels which were written by Christ's four Apostles, have been doctered, simply because the people who translated the writings were very decated Christians, and it would have been wrong (sinfull) for them to do so. I've found many people who want the Christians Churches particularily (mine) to move with the times, which implies rubbishing Christs teachings, for that reason those sayig that Christs teachings were altered can't have it both ways.
As for saying that new words and descriptions were added to support their bias like anti homosexual verses, why would they (outlaw homo sexuality) If Christ had not declared it sinfull, their would have been homo sexual people around at the time, perhaps by the law of averages even some of Christs followers would have had that inclination, so anti homosexuality would not have been mentioned in the new testament scripture.
The anti Christian bias is the real a strong powerfull force these days, proof of this fact that some will accuse every Priest of either been paedophiles or supporting them, not to mention the that all Churches are wealthy corrupt businesess.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

I can't disagree with you regarding some of the writings in the old testament, while many writings give us very good messages some appear to even controdict Christs teachings,
AS for the new testament, I don't believe that the Gospels which were written by Christ's four Apostles, have been doctered, simply because the people who translated the writings were very decated Christians, and it would have been wrong (sinfull) for them to do so. I've found many people who want the Christians Churches particularily (mine) to move with the times, which implies rubbishing Christs teachings, for that reason those sayig that Christs teachings were altered can't have it both ways.
As for saying that new words and descriptions were added to support their bias like anti homosexual verses, why would they (outlaw homo sexuality) If Christ had not declared it sinfull, their would have been homo sexual people around at the time, perhaps by the law of averages even some of Christs followers would have had that inclination, so anti homosexuality would not have been mentioned in the new testament scripture.
The anti Christian bias is the real a strong powerfull force these days, proof of this fact that some will accuse every Priest of either been paedophiles or supporting them, not to mention the that all Churches are wealthy corrupt businesess.

It's prior to Christ stuff we're walking about. Old Testament. There is some suggestion that the verses were changed, but at the same time, Sodom and Gomorrah are pretty clear.

There is some debate with Paul's discussion of homosexuals not getting into heaven, but it's not a very strong debate.

It basically lies around the original translation of the Greek to English which was translated from a Greek term "arsenokoitai" to "abusers of themselves with mankind" which was then translated to "homosexuals"

But arsenokoitai actually means "men bed" and there's some debate over what that actually means with many believing it means "lazy"

Then there's "effeminate" which was translated from "malakoi", but Malakoi actually means "soft, weak" (there's a lot more complexity around that though)

It's enough for many biblical scholars to actually think that the translation was manipulated at the time. But it's also more probable that it's an accurate translation.

 

[Kelpie03]

It's prior to Christ stuff we're walking about. Old Testament. There is some suggestion that the verses were changed, but at the same time, Sodom and Gomorrah are pretty clear.

There is some debate with Paul's discussion of homosexuals not getting into heaven, but it's not a very strong debate.

It basically lies around the original translation of the Greek to English which was translated from a Greek term "arsenokoitai" to "abusers of themselves with mankind" which was then translated to "homosexuals"

But arsenokoitai actually means "men bed" and there's some debate over what that actually means with many believing it means "lazy"

Then there's "effeminate" which was translated from "malakoi", but Malakoi actually means "soft, weak" (there's a lot more complexity around that though)

It's enough for many biblical scholars to actually think that the translation was manipulated at the time. But it's also more probable that it's an accurate translation.

Jesus contridicated the Jews many times during his time on earth, which tells me that he did not agree with all which was written in the old testament. I'l give you an example of that, when the Jews accused him of working on Sabbath because he cured a person, he replied by asking them what would they do if one of their animals fell in a hole on the Sabbath.
As for this men bed thing, I have slept in a bed with both brothers and cousins, because we need to and liked each other, their was not the slighest attempt or even desire to play with each others genitals.
It is probably true that some men are attracted to other men, or women to women.
The Church has decreed and I can't see any reason to disagreem that Sodomy, and any for of sexual stimulation between men or women is sinfull, so why should athiest be concerned about a Church stating what it believes are Gods teachings.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Jesus contridicated the Jews many times during his time on earth, which tells me that he did not agree with all which was written in the old testament. I'l give you an example of that, when the Jews accused him of working on Sabbath because he cured a person, he replied by asking them what would they do if one of their animals fell in a hole on the Sabbath.
As for this men bed thing, I have slept in a bed with both brothers and cousins, because we need to and liked each other, their was not the slighest attempt or even desire to play with each others genitals.
It is probably true that some men are attracted to other men, or women to women.
The Church has decreed and I can't see any reason to disagreem that Sodomy, and any for of sexual stimulation between men or women is sinfull, so why should athiest be concerned about a Church stating what it believes are Gods teachings.

They shouldn't be concerned, unless it's being used as an excuse for oppression or restriction of freedoms.

Personally I just find it interesting.

 

[Kelpie03]

This is the daily reading taken from Kings 10-11, Matt 13:36-46, PS 113, Pro 12:-15. The readings are supplied VISION CHRISTIAN MEDIA, it is sent to anyone requesting it, this reading is for 1st. June 2022,
The booklet consists of daily readings, for 3 months, I send them a small contribution every 3 months, which I don’t believe is necessary.
Vision Christian Media is run by ecumenical Christians, who do not belong to any particular denomination.
Regards Kelpie03
Dr, Elizabeth Kuber-Ross, a leading authority on death and dying, and Dr. Raymond Moody jr. a well-known psychiatrist, examined the case history of over 500 who came back to life after been pronounced dead by their physicians. Their research convinces anyone with an open mind. The people in the study described either a location of beauty, marvel, joy and peace or they described something dreadful, and although their bodies were real, they reported floating outside them after been confirmed dead, some who were blind were able to see. They talked about people who were in the room, what they looked like, and what they did while they were there. Yet when these people were brought back, the ones who were blind could no longer see. In his book Life after Life Dr Moody writes: A doctor told me of his experience in attending a man who had been pronounced clinically dead. He succeeded in resuscitating the man who then sued the doctor for bringing him back into this miserable existence from the glory he had experienced. One woman, describing her situation after she had suffered a respiratory arrest, reports that the doctor trying to resuscitate, her were pounding on her body trying to get her back, while she was over them, looking down and saying, “leave me alone!” The apostle Paul explains why, for we know that if the earth tent, we live in is destroyed we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. Meanwhile we groan longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly Dwelling (2 Corinthians5:1-2).


Assasin, bro, you might relate with some of what is written here, sorry if you're not confortable with been reminded of your medical history, as for my own medical history I continually laugh about it to friends

 

[Hacky McAxe]

This is the daily reading taken from Kings 10-11, Matt 13:36-46, PS 113, Pro 12:-15. The readings are supplied VISION CHRISTIAN MEDIA, it is sent to anyone requesting it for 1st. June 2022,
The booklet consists of daily readings, for 3 months, I send them a small contribution every 3 months, which I don’t believe is necessary.
Vision Christian Media is run by ecumenical Christians, who do not belong to any particular denomination.
Regards Kelpie03
Dr, Elizabeth Kuber-Ross, a leading authority on death and dying, and Dr. Raymond Moody jr. a well-known psychiatrist, examined the case history of over 500 who came back to life after been pronounced dead by their physicians. Their research convinces anyone with an open mind. The people in the study described either a location of beauty, marvel, joy and peace or they described something dreadful, and although their bodies were real, they reported floating outside them after been confirmed dead, some who were blind were able to see. They talked about people who were in the room, what they looked like, and what they did while they were there. Yet when these people were brought back, the ones who were blind could no longer see. In his book Life after Life Dr Moody writes: A doctor told me of his experience in attending a man who had been pronounced clinically dead. He succeeded in resuscitating the man who then sued the doctor for bringing him back into this miserable existence from the glory he had experienced. One woman, describing her situation after she had suffered a respiratory arrest, reports that the doctor trying to resuscitate, her were pounding on her body trying to get her back, while she was over them, looking down and saying, “leave me alone!” The apostle Paul explains why, for we know that if the earth tent, we live in is destroyed we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. Meanwhile we groan longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly Dwelling (2 Corinthians5:1-2).

There's a pretty sad history surrounding Elizabeth Kubler-Ross. She did a lot of good work and eventually opened up a healing retreat for dying patients. But that retreat was eventually turned into a sex cult.

Moody is an interesting character too. His work is often heavily criticised for not being scientific at all. But it's interesting work nonetheless.

 

[Kelpie03]

This is the daily reading taken from Kings 10-11, Matt 13:36-46, PS 113, Pro 12:-15. The readings are supplied VISION CHRISTIAN MEDIA, it is sent to anyone requesting it for 1st. June 2022,
The booklet consists of daily readings, for 3 months, I send them a small contribution every 3 months, which I don’t believe is necessary.
Vision Christian Media is run by ecumenical Christians, who do not belong to any particular denomination.
Regards Kelpie03
Dr, Elizabeth Kuber-Ross, a leading authority on death and dying, and Dr. Raymond Moody jr. a well-known psychiatrist, examined the case history of over 500 who came back to life after been pronounced dead by their physicians. Their research convinces anyone with an open mind. The people in the study described either a location of beauty, marvel, joy and peace or they described something dreadful, and although their bodies were real, they reported floating outside them after been confirmed dead, some who were blind were able to see. They talked about people who were in the room, what they looked like, and what they did while they were there. Yet when these people were brought back, the ones who were blind could no longer see. In his book Life after Life Dr Moody writes: A doctor told me of his experience in attending a man who had been pronounced clinically dead. He succeeded in resuscitating the man who then sued the doctor for bringing him back into this miserable existence from the glory he had experienced. One woman, describing her situation after she had suffered a respiratory arrest, reports that the doctor trying to resuscitate, her were pounding on her body trying to get her back, while she was over them, looking down and saying, “leave me alone!” The apostle Paul explains why, for we know that if the earth tent, we live in is destroyed we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. Meanwhile we groan longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly Dwelling (2 Corinthians5:1-2).

 

[The DoggFather]

There's a pretty sad history surrounding Elizabeth Kubler-Ross. She did a lot of good work and eventually opened up a healing retreat for dying patients. But that retreat was eventually turned into a sex cult.

Moody is an interesting character too. His work is often heavily criticised for not being scientific at all. But it's interesting work nonetheless.

It's a shame that this is a common theme... organisations and groups start out with good intentions that end up getting hijacked for money, power or evil agendas.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

It's a shame that this is a common theme... organisations and groups start out with good intentions that end up getting hijacked for money, power or evil agendas.

Yep. It was a real shame for Kubler-Ross. She started it out with the best of intentions, but she went down the rabbit hole. She was convinced everything was supernatural. Then some dude rocked up claiming to be the head of a church and claiming he could speak to spirits. He said that the spirits needed to possess people and have sex or they couldn't pass on. She believed him. And even after it was discovered that he was a scam artist, she still believed him.

 

[The DoggFather]

Yep. It was a real shame for Kubler-Ross. She started it out with the best of intentions, but she went down the rabbit hole. She was convinced everything was supernatural. Then some dude rocked up claiming to be the head of a church and claiming he could speak to spirits. He said that the spirits needed to possess people and have sex or they couldn't pass on. She believed him. And even after it was discovered that he was a scam artist, she still believed him.

Never heard of this. Disgusting.

 

[EL Hefe]

 

[CrittaMagic69]

View attachment 54400

Na brah that's just the new Lettuce Vuitton hat.

 

[Kelpie03]

Yep. It was a real shame for Kubler-Ross. She started it out with the best of intentions, but she went down the rabbit hole. She was convinced everything was supernatural. Then some dude rocked up claiming to be the head of a church and claiming he could speak to spirits. He said that the spirits needed to possess people and have sex or they couldn't pass on. She believed him. And even after it was discovered that he was a scam artist, she still believed him.

Please elaborate on what you know about Kubler-Ross, and Dr Moody, as you know people shoot the messenger (and it is too often done) when they don't like the message.

 

[Kelpie03]

They shouldn't be concerned, unless it's being used as an excuse for oppression or restriction of freedoms.

Personally I just find it interesting.

Are you saying that you find sexual stimulaton between men interesting, I can assure you that I wouldn't.

 

[Hacky McAxe]

Please elaborate on what you know about Kubler-Ross, and Dr Moody, as you know people shoot the messenger (and it is too often done) when they don't like the message.

I covered it pretty well in brief but there's a lot of publicly available information about them.

If you want to read up about her, here's details of how she started a retreat to aid a pagan spiritualist which was basically a sex cult. And she actively supported him even after it came out that he was a conman who tricked people into sex, including underage girls. Best not to use Kubler-Ross as a source.

Death and dying with Elisabeth Kübler-Ross | Escondido Grapevine

www.escondidograpevine.com