What can we learn from the 1998 team?

[Tassie Devil]

Been thinking long and hard about our current team and the direction we're going in. Do we have enough class to challenge? Why aren't we bringing in more talent?

Looking back at the Bulldogs of old it was all about attitude and togetherness. Never say die and fight for the guy besides you, which is why I fell in love with this club at a very young age. When I'm having a rough day I always look back at those games in 1998 and realise that you should never give up, and that it's not all about 'talent'.

We're clamouring over getting another centre, better halves, wingers, hooker etc. but let's not kid ourselves. Looking back to 1998 Lester & Marteene were really no world beaters. Yes, Ryan was injured for the final but you can't say he was world class either. Corey Hughes as a 5/8? Grimaldi, Relf, Reardon, Stone, Hughes, Thompson in the pack?

Not slagging these guys off, just pointing out that they're far far far from big names. But at the end of the day they put in for the club and gave their all. Their togetherness nearly brought us to an impossible GF win.

Maybe we all just need to be patient for the club to bring our attitude around to allign with the times of the past?

 

[Bazildog]

What we can learn from the 1998 team? When leading at halftime in a Grandfinal, grab the trophy, declare ourselves the Premiers and set off the fire alarms...

 

[Spoonman84]

You could argue they just caught fire a couple of weeks earlier then the 2019 team. That 98 team was absolutely shocking for the first half of the year and it took Folkes making a hard decision by dumping Simon Gillies to reggies and installing big Edgar Britt as captain and we didn’t look back.

What we are crying out for currently is a player like Polly who just hated losing and had the talent to drag the team to wins. Wakeham could possibly be that type of player with some luck.

The attitude in defence on display was very reminiscent of the 98 team but the game has changed a lot since then and that’s just not enough now. You need to have a fair bit of talent too.

 

[KiwiDog7]

1998 was a different world

 

[Tassie Devil]

You could argue they just caught fire a couple of weeks earlier then the 2019 team. That 98 team was absolutely shocking for the first half of the year and it took Folkes making a hard decision by dumping Simon Gillies to reggies and installing big Edgar Britt as captain and we didn’t look back.

What we are crying out for currently is a player like Polly who just hated losing and had the talent to drag the team to wins. Wakeham could possibly be that type of player with some luck.

The attitude in defence on display was very reminiscent of the 98 team but the game has changed a lot since then and that’s just not enough now. You need to have a fair bit of talent too.

Fucking love Polly. What a leader

 

[coach]

Sounds like a united thread there Steve lol

 

[c-b-b]

Each era we look back on with rose coloured glasses was different and had different circumstances. The 80's, 94/95/98, 2004. Can't compare this era with those.

Perhaps this group will play some solid games, play for the Jersey, jag some unlikely wins. But they're not in serious contention or up there with the best teams and miracles are unlikely.

The best teams are adding more talent, some will say NRL is allowing them to cheat the cap, fact is we need smart people to make things work better for us.

I'm keen to see who will be signed for 21 + 22 when there's no salary cap excuses etc.

 

[flamebouyant]

Been thinking long and hard about our current team and the direction we're going in. Do we have enough class to challenge? Why aren't we bringing in more talent?

Looking back at the Bulldogs of all it was all about attitude and togetherness. Never say die and fight for the guy besides you, which is why I fell in love with this club at a very young age. When I'm having a rough day I always look back at those games in 1998 and realise that you should never give up, and that it's not all about 'talent'.

We're clamouring over getting another centre, better halves, wingers, hooker etc. but let's not kid ourselves. Looking back to 1998 Lester & Marteene were really no world beaters. Yes, Ryan was injured for the final but you can't say he was world class either. Corey Hughes as a 5/8? Grimaldi, Relf, Reardon, Stone, Hughes, Thompson in the pack?

Not slagging these guys off, just pointing out that they're far far far from big names. But at the end of the day they put in for the club and gave their all. Their togetherness nearly brought us to an impossible GF win.

Maybe we all just need to be patient for the club to bring our attitude around to allign with the times of the past?

Great post. I'm with you here. Sure enough, you need some talent to really be competitive, but I think we do. We're not as talent loaded as the rorters or Melbourne, but we still have some quality in our side, and i think we will be very competitive this year.
Team unity is very important in sport, especially in such a tough sport like rugby league.

 

[Sleeky]

The best teams are adding more talent, some will say NRL is allowing them to cheat the cap, fact is we need smart people to make things work better for us.

I'm keen to see who will be signed for 21 + 22 when there's no salary cap excuses etc.

Having trouble disagreeing with any of your posts CBB

 

[Howard Moon]

our guys were able to go on the run they did at the end of the season because morale was up... and morale was up because they continued to turn up despite the results.. our wins all came on the back of attitude and turning up for your mate... we might be lacking in key areas but it could be as simple as one or two guys having their breakout seasons that will really shake things up in regards to our attack.. JMK showed glimpses in 2019, Wakeham could reproduce his Canterbury Cup/ Fiji form in FG... we just never know.. there is a lot to be optimistic about though

 

[TwinTurbo]

The best teams are adding more talent

I'm not so sure, compared to this time last year for example the Wabbits have lost Burgess x 2, Inglis and Sutton and added Mitchell, arguably more talent lost than gained. The Chooks have lost Cronk, Mitchell and Tetevano and gained Flanagan, surely that is more talent lost than gained. Even Melbourne, where they have lost Croft, Scott, Kata, Chambers and Stimson (plus maybe JAC) and gained Jacks, surely is a net loss of talent. The Sharks, they have lost Brailey, Feki, Flanagan, Gallen and Capewell and signed Tracey and Ramien, which looks like another net loss.

Maybe it's just me, but I'm seeing a lot of moving around but the retirements and losses to Rugby and SL from many teams is greater than their additions. I think we have gained more than many teams, for sure most are not recognised talents (yet), but since this time last year we have added DWZ, Simson and Britt and lost Lichaa, Fualalo, Olive and Brown. Looks like a net gain to me.


Go Dogs

 

[bradyk]

I saw a lot of effort last season (even when we were struggling). I actually can't question the teams effort at all. I think we already have what you're saying and we have a coach that drops players for not having those values. Talent is everything but we're going to avoid the bottom four if our effort is the same as last year. Gould also pointed that out on commentary (more towards the wooden spoon).

 

[Rodzilla]

that we were idiots to sack folkes (not renewing counts as a sack)

 

[Alan79]

I honestly saw a lot of promise in our sides development last year. As with the 98 team it wasn't loaded with talent. But the way they finished the season hopefully taught them that success is theirs for the taking if they give their all. It was heart and determination that let us go on our late season charge. If we can replicate that early on in the year we might really surpass expectations.

I actually feel bad about always falling back to Lichaa and his lack of a fluid passing game. He shouldn't always be the scapegoat. But after Ennis left, our pack looked like they really had to time their runs to wait for Lichaa to pass. Forwards typically take some time to wind up on their runs and with Lichaa here they weren't able to do that. While we had a hooker that allowed our pack to receive the ball at pace our forwards were a force. Even Tolman had plenty of people calling for him to step into the origin scene. The halves usually didn't get their hands on the ball much sooner than the defense was in their face with Lichaa at 9 either. JMK still lacks polish in some areas and he might not have the running game of Cook. But his service is closer to what is required and you can see that he's developed a lot in his first year where he's played hooker regularly. Cogger isn't an explosive runner like many people tend to fap over, but he's shown signs of being a crafty half who has some deception in his game as well as a varied kicking game that can give us some repeat sets. I don't know what combination out of Cogger, Lewis and Wakeham will be our main halves pairing, but if they can create more half chances our backline might actually look a lot better. If you put together the best outside backs in the NRL but had them playing behind a pack that was being dominated and halves who had no ability to create chances, they'd generally not go too well. I think that was a bit more visible with the queensland team after both Cronk and Thurston left the rep scene. As much as DCE gets huge fanfare, I really think he's hugely over-rated.

I'm not confident that we'll be a force to be reckoned with from the start of the year. But I'm pretty proud of the fact that I'm usually very slow to deathride our chances. And ahead of this season I do think that the mentality of the team will be a lot better. We'd have played finals footy last year if the refereeing hadn't screwed us in some early games and if anything I think the side learned that they might get bad calls when attacking, but if they can frustrate opponents with the solid defense that was responsible for our strong finish, it goes a long way towards negating the ability of referees to decide the results with a few dubious calls.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the year pans out for the lads. I'm never a happy fan when we aren't performing, but I think that we have plenty to look forward to this year despite not having a roster packed with established talent. Like Slovenia Steve pointed out, a never say die attitude can carry a team a long way and that might just be the big thing that the team developed late last season. Lets just hope they can replicate that through the entire season this year.

 

[Tassie Devil]

I honestly saw a lot of promise in our sides development last year. As with the 98 team it wasn't loaded with talent. But the way they finished the season hopefully taught them that success is theirs for the taking if they give their all. It was heart and determination that let us go on our late season charge. If we can replicate that early on in the year we might really surpass expectations.

I actually feel bad about always falling back to Lichaa and his lack of a fluid passing game. He shouldn't always be the scapegoat. But after Ennis left, our pack looked like they really had to time their runs to wait for Lichaa to pass. Forwards typically take some time to wind up on their runs and with Lichaa here they weren't able to do that. While we had a hooker that allowed our pack to receive the ball at pace our forwards were a force. Even Tolman had plenty of people calling for him to step into the origin scene. The halves usually didn't get their hands on the ball much sooner than the defense was in their face with Lichaa at 9 either. JMK still lacks polish in some areas and he might not have the running game of Cook. But his service is closer to what is required and you can see that he's developed a lot in his first year where he's played hooker regularly. Cogger isn't an explosive runner like many people tend to fap over, but he's shown signs of being a crafty half who has some deception in his game as well as a varied kicking game that can give us some repeat sets. I don't know what combination out of Cogger, Lewis and Wakeham will be our main halves pairing, but if they can create more half chances our backline might actually look a lot better. If you put together the best outside backs in the NRL but had them playing behind a pack that was being dominated and halves who had no ability to create chances, they'd generally not go too well. I think that was a bit more visible with the queensland team after both Cronk and Thurston left the rep scene. As much as DCE gets huge fanfare, I really think he's hugely over-rated.

I'm not confident that we'll be a force to be reckoned with from the start of the year. But I'm pretty proud of the fact that I'm usually very slow to deathride our chances. And ahead of this season I do think that the mentality of the team will be a lot better. We'd have played finals footy last year if the refereeing hadn't screwed us in some early games and if anything I think the side learned that they might get bad calls when attacking, but if they can frustrate opponents with the solid defense that was responsible for our strong finish, it goes a long way towards negating the ability of referees to decide the results with a few dubious calls.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the year pans out for the lads. I'm never a happy fan when we aren't performing, but I think that we have plenty to look forward to this year despite not having a roster packed with established talent. Like Slovenia Steve pointed out, a never say die attitude can carry a team a long way and that might just be the big thing that the team developed late last season. Lets just hope they can replicate that through the entire season this year.

Good post and agree with it. We desperately need to get a solid start to the year so the boys have belief in themselves and in Pay. Another slow start and I do worry a tad that they simply won't be able to get that spark back.

 

[Tassie Devil]

Sounds like a united thread there Steve lol

Just vomitted a little inside when you mentioned United ...

 

[KLil]

Run hard.. don't give up.

Biggest difference is not having experinced guys in the spine like Silva, Polly and Hetho at the back end of their careers.

 

[DinkumDog]

I honestly saw a lot of promise in our sides development last year. As with the 98 team it wasn't loaded with talent. But the way they finished the season hopefully taught them that success is theirs for the taking if they give their all. It was heart and determination that let us go on our late season charge. If we can replicate that early on in the year we might really surpass expectations.

I actually feel bad about always falling back to Lichaa and his lack of a fluid passing game. He shouldn't always be the scapegoat. But after Ennis left, our pack looked like they really had to time their runs to wait for Lichaa to pass. Forwards typically take some time to wind up on their runs and with Lichaa here they weren't able to do that. While we had a hooker that allowed our pack to receive the ball at pace our forwards were a force. Even Tolman had plenty of people calling for him to step into the origin scene. The halves usually didn't get their hands on the ball much sooner than the defense was in their face with Lichaa at 9 either. JMK still lacks polish in some areas and he might not have the running game of Cook. But his service is closer to what is required and you can see that he's developed a lot in his first year where he's played hooker regularly. Cogger isn't an explosive runner like many people tend to fap over, but he's shown signs of being a crafty half who has some deception in his game as well as a varied kicking game that can give us some repeat sets. I don't know what combination out of Cogger, Lewis and Wakeham will be our main halves pairing, but if they can create more half chances our backline might actually look a lot better. If you put together the best outside backs in the NRL but had them playing behind a pack that was being dominated and halves who had no ability to create chances, they'd generally not go too well. I think that was a bit more visible with the queensland team after both Cronk and Thurston left the rep scene. As much as DCE gets huge fanfare, I really think he's hugely over-rated.

I'm not confident that we'll be a force to be reckoned with from the start of the year. But I'm pretty proud of the fact that I'm usually very slow to deathride our chances. And ahead of this season I do think that the mentality of the team will be a lot better. We'd have played finals footy last year if the refereeing hadn't screwed us in some early games and if anything I think the side learned that they might get bad calls when attacking, but if they can frustrate opponents with the solid defense that was responsible for our strong finish, it goes a long way towards negating the ability of referees to decide the results with a few dubious calls.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the year pans out for the lads. I'm never a happy fan when we aren't performing, but I think that we have plenty to look forward to this year despite not having a roster packed with established talent. Like Slovenia Steve pointed out, a never say die attitude can carry a team a long way and that might just be the big thing that the team developed late last season. Lets just hope they can replicate that through the entire season this year.

Nice Alan (and Steve). How quickly the deathriders forget despite the challenges and poor start last year we finished just one game out of the finals when we came home with a wet sail.
Of course we still have some work to do in recruitment over the next couple of years as well as bringing our young lads through before being able to sustain a competitive roster year in year out - no one denies that.
But we’re on a good path and I think we share the sentiment that there’s no reason we can’t push into the 8 this year with a better start and never say die attitude (like ‘98, like many other times).
A combo of more experience from our young fellas and seeing what our recruits like Stimson can add will be hopefully good to watch.
No one expects to win every game but as long as we’re not dropping very winnable games like we did last year (which ended up being the difference between making the 8 and not) then we’ll go OK.
Roll on Round 1!

 

[c-b-b]

our guys were able to go on the run they did at the end of the season because morale was up... and morale was up because they continued to turn up despite the results.. our wins all came on the back of attitude and turning up for your mate... we might be lacking in key areas but it could be as simple as one or two guys having their breakout seasons that will really shake things up in regards to our attack.. JMK showed glimpses in 2019, Wakeham could reproduce his Canterbury Cup/ Fiji form in FG... we just never know.. there is a lot to be optimistic about though

I'm not saying you're wrong but we also went on a run at the end of 2018 winning 5 out of 6. The same type of things were said this time last year. In 2019 we won 5 out of the last 6. The key will be the start to this season, not the end as well as recruitment for 2021.

 

[DinkumDog]

I'm not saying you're wrong but we also went on a run at the end of 2018 winning 5 out of 6. The same type of things were said this time last year. In 2019 we won 5 out of the last 6. The key will be the start to this season, not the end as well as recruitment for 2021.

Agree re: good season start and 2021 recruitment - but I think the difference between now and 12 months ago is this time last year there was too much talk after a little confidence booster at the end of 2018.
Notice this pre-season they've been much quieter apart from the odd media appearance here and there.
More importantly - guys like Lewis, Meaney and even Cogger have several more games under their belt going into 2020 than they did 2019.
I'm not saying that's a panacea, but I think we're in a better position starting 2020 than we were 2019 - and we're keeping our heads down about it.
Still, they have to prove themselves come Round 1.