Most of you wanted Hasler gone...
Most of you were happy with appointment of Pay.
Now after a few BAD results are calling for a new coach.
What seems to me is no matter what and no matter who the coach is you will never be happy.
One must consider he is in his first appointment with a difficult task ahead of him. He needs at least 18 month to try an change the culture, roster and playing style. This is a realistic time frame. Before the season and now you say
1. MORRIS TWINS NEED TO RETIRE
2. ELLIOT IS RESERVE GRADER
3. TALAU AND FUALO ARE RESERVE GRADERS.
4. TOLMAN IS SHIT
5. WOODS SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN SIGNED
6. JOSH JACKSON OUT OF FORM
7. MONTOYA AND HOPPA OUT OF FORM
8. LIECHA IS SHIT (OVER LAST 3 SEASONS)
9. WE NEED A 5/8 TO PARTNER FORAN
10. OUR BENCH IS WORST IN NRL
11. DES RUINED OUR JUNIOR SYSTEM
12. BOARD ROOM FIGHTING
13. EASTWOOD OVER PAID
14. DES BACK ENDED DEALS (SALARY CAP A MESS)
I CAN NAME MORE.
NO COACH WITH ABOVE WILL BE ABLE TO FIX ABOVE.
Yet you are all blaming our new coach. HE NEEDS TIME he has had 5 matches. He will experiment, he will try things, he will change team around, let him do his thing. Judge him middle of next year that would be a fair time to see if he can coach.
LOOK AT KEARNY. EVERYONE THOUGHT HE WILL BE FIRST TO GET SACK.
We need to support our team. Not continually put our NEW COACH DOWN after 5 minutes expecting miracles.
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- Thread: Most of You are SPITTING on PAY
- Thread: Lichaa signing confirmed
Michael Lichaa to Rejoin the Pack!
The Canterbury-Bankstown Bulldogs have today announced the re-signing of hooker Michael Lichaa, for a further two years.
Head Coach, Dean Pay was delighted that the club had been able to retain Lichaa: "Having worked with Michael at junior representative level, I know what a talented footballer he is. We are extremely pleased that we have been able to extend Michael's time here at Belmore and I'm looking forward to seeing him back with the club. He will be an important part of our forward strength next year."
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The following thread is purely my reasons and mine only to cancel my membership effective immediately. I speak for myself and not to influence anyone who chooses any differently. I respect every ones decision on how they will go about their choices in the future regarding their Bulldogs club membership. We are all entitled to express our opinions.
The following was sent to the Bulldogs Membership department......
Could you please advise if my membership is on auto renew for the above membership #'s? (removed from thread)
If so, please remove this as I would like to confirm that I will not be renewing both
of these memberships.
Please confirm by reply your acceptance. Thank you.
Hi (name removed from thread),
Thanks for your email.
That is very unfortunate. Is there any particular reason for this?
You are on the automatic rollover but we will take you off.
Please note that if you do not renew by the deadline, your seats will be allocated to
Please let us know if you do change your mind and we will be happy to help you.
Thanks for your confirmation in cancelling our memberships.
Sure i am happy to explain my reasons for cancelling them.
As far as entertainment on the playing field goes we never got our value for money. For
what the season tickets cost us, the quality, the style and the lack of understanding
for change when required during the season provided a very, very boring product. It
felt like we were watching the same thing week in week out.
I will also share my frustrations when deals are done with a player saying when they
will and when they won't play, so how do you expect members to support the club and
team throughout the year when a player is not prepared to do so? This club use to stand
for Club first, team second and player third. Us members have been taken for a ride
where you took our money but did not provide the full product when injuries took no
part. Simply a player did not want to play for personal reasons and good luck to him.
That's not what i paid for as i thought prior to renewing our memberships in late 2015
that all contracted players will play if 100% fit (excluding suspensions) in 2016.
That's a slap in the face to us as a consumer.
In future, your CEO, Board Members and Coach should not disrespect their members and
fans by expecting us to turn up in the cold, the rain and at times very tight schedules
and in particular when most people are struggling to save a dollar but put it towards
supporting the club and team when a contracted player is not prepared to do so and when
a coach was not prepared to change the product he was providing when it clearly was not
working. We'd had enough!
Also, there were 22,000 people at last weekends finals game against Penrith. That's
less than 10,000 Bulldogs members (as not all would have been members). Where were your
other 10,000+ members? Now lets not use the venue Allianz Stadium as an excuse. The
sooner your CEO, Directors and Coach realise that members and fans are turning away due
to the above reasons the quicker we will start seeing the entertainment we pay for on
the field that we have been known for and want to watch win, lose or draw. Then and
only then you may see members and fans returning. But unfortunately we will not be in
I appreciate for your time in hearing my reasons.
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- Thread: Tolman WTF!!!
- Thread: Warren Smith is 100% right
- Thread: Who is leaving?
- Thread: Kennel whipping boys....
Everyone has an opinion on players in here but haven’t some of the whipping boys in the team really stood up in the last few weeks. Meaney, Tolman, Elliott , JMK, Napa and even C Smith have been fantastic. I love the fact that a few of them have left me with egg on my face and let’s hope they can start doing it consistently.
I had doubts and was critical of Jacko’s leadership but he has shut me up after last night and the last few games.
Let’s hope it continues.
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Yes i am not happy with the way the bulldogs have perfomed in the first 2 weeks.
As a fan i am angry and dissatisfied with what i have seen.
WE ARE BLAMING DEAN PAY and I have as well. But after DEEP THINKING and taking away my emotions i realised that we have lost most of our experienced players in last 12 to 18 months due to salary cap clean up which we all knew wont be sorted until 2020-2021
We have a coach who has only reserve graders to pick a team for first grade and around 3 to 4 other players that might be considered 1st graders and would make any other first grade team.
I have read a lot today that DEAN PAY IS THIS AND THAT. BUT REALLY HOW IS THIS BECAUSE OF DEAN PAY. Get BELLAMY, BENETT AND MAGUIRE to ALL BE COACHES OF THIS BULLDOGS TEAM working together and they will not make this team play any better.. yes 3 of them coaching this team fulltime.
We know we have a bad roster.. we know have the least experienced team and we have a coach who HAS TO EXPERIMENT with this team until he gets the best players he has to play in whatever position.
He his rebuilding what HASLER BROKE and this takes time. He has brought in some young players that were available that MIGHT have potential and he has to give them experience.
He has made changes that were required and he will continue until he gets it right to the best of his ability WITH WHAT players ARE available.
YES WE ARE NOT HAPPY but lets be realistic. Lets be honest and instead of being emotional and negative. WE AS SUPPORTERS NEED TO BE EXCITED ABOUT THE FUTURE AND POSTIVE IN HOW WE THINK BECAUSE WE WILL NOT ALWAYS WIN.
ITS A GAME A FOOTY AND REALLY WIN LOSE OR DRAW IT DOES NOT CHANGE MY LIFE.
SO STOP BLAMING DEAN PAY. HE IS TRYING. HE IS A HUMAN BEING. HE HAS NOT GOT QUALITY PLAYERS AND THAT IS NOT HIS FAULT. AND I HAVE MADE UP MY MIND AND I WILL REPEAT THIS IS NOT DEAN PAYS FAULT.
So stop being KEYBOARD WARRIORS AND TRY AND MAKE YOUR SELF FEEL BETTER BY BLAMING DEAN PAY.
HE IS NOT THE ONE THAT SPENT 1.2 MIL ON FORAN.
HE is not the one that STUFFED up the salary CAP.
Unfortunately for him he has to rebuild a team from scratch.
NOT LIKE WAYNE BENNETT WHO HAS TAKEN OVER AN ALREADY MADE SOUTHS TEAM WHO ARE ALREADY A TEAM THAT CAN WIN THE COMP.
OKAY LOOK AT ARTHUR at PARRA they have stuck with him for years even after they got the spoon a few times. Now Wowww they WON 2 games and ready to DO a contract extension.
STUART AT RAIDERS SHOULD HAVE WON A TITLE BY NOW.
BROWN AT KNIGHTS WAS SIMILAR SITUATION TO WHAT PAY IS IN NOW.
PAUL GREEN WON A GF - MADE A GF and with the same team LAST YEAR ALMOST Got the SPOON.
ROBINSON A FEW YEARS BACK had the roosters near the bottom with a premiership winning team.
So stop SOOKING and CRYING AND BLAMING DEAN PAY AND TRYING TO MAKE YOUR SELF FEEL BETTER.
INSTEAD BE EXCITED AT OUR YOUNG PLAYERS COMING IN AND SEE WHAT THEY CAN DO. BE POSITIVE AND BE REALISTIC. LET THEM LEARN AND WATCH THEM DEVELOP. LET THEM KNOW THEY HAVE SUPPORTERS THAT GIVE THEM CONFIDENCE NOT SUPPORTERS THAT ARE TALKING SHIT ABOUT THEM.
WE CAN UNEARTH SOME FUTURE STARS AND IN A YEAR OR 2 CAN BUY SOME QUALITY PLAYERS THAT WILL MOULD THE TEAM INTO A THREAT.
I WOULD RATHER SEE MY TEAM GROW AND BE COMPETITIVE AND PLAY WITH A BULLDOG SPIRIT RATHER THEN BUY A TEAM AND WIN A COMP WITH PLAYERS THAT ARE NOT REAL BULLDOGS.
I AM ACTUALLY HAPPY TO WATCH THIS TEAM GROW AND LEARN AND TRY HARD AND LET PAY EXPERIMENT AND TRY AND WORK OUR WHAT IS THE BEST COMBINATIONS HE CAN DEVELOP AND LET THEM HAVE SOME FUN.
I CAN FINALLY ACCEPT THIS REALITY AND ACCEPT THAT THIS IS NOT DEAN PAYS FAULT. NO COACH CAN DO ANY BETTER.
AND IF YOU WATCHED THE FIRST 25MIN OF THE PARRA GAME. We actually played some good footy.. we just need to hold the ball and learn to defend better as they get fitter. We will improve in the next 4 weeks and I am confident we will make the 8.
And if NOT then so what. At least i have hope and thats enough to keep me excited to watch our next game and so on
If this was a top 4 team and we played like that then bloody oath i will blame the coach
WE ARE A TEAM OF ROOKIES AND THEY ARE STILL MY TEAM.
I LOVE MY BULLDOGS NO MATTER WHAT.
ONCE AGAIN I HAVE COME TO THE HONEST REALIZATION WITH MY EMOTIONS CLEAR OF ANY FEELINGS THAT THE TRUTH IS
THIS IS NOT DEAN PAYS FAULT
YES THAT IS THE TRUTH, THE HONEST TRUTH AND ONLY THE TRUTH
SO STOP PICKING ON PAY AND STOP CRYING LIKE LITTLE BABIES AND BE REALISTIC AND HONEST IN THE FACTS.
SOOKS, FAR OUT FOR THE LAST YEAR WE KNEW THIS REBUILD WAS HAPPENING. WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU ALL..
THIS IS NOT A TEAM OF INTERNATIONALS.
THIS IS A TEAM OF ROOKIES. THAT WILL BECOME A TEAM OF INTERNATIONALS
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- Thread: Merry Christmas
I would like to wish all of you ladies and gents on the Kennel a very safe and Merry Christmas. If you are travelling please take it easy.
To everyone who has contributed, it has been, at times, interesting reading. Not all of it agreeable with everyone but that’s why it’s a forum. So whoever is having time off work, enjoy it and recharge. We have one helluva year in front of us.
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Another great article... some which hasn't been mentioned already.
Drags on a little bit, but makes a very good point in putting things into perspective
Never heard of this site before but it's a welll written article raising some points that noboyd on here has as of yet.
Team of photographers deployed by Telegraph to ambush Dogs
(Op-ed) Big News Network.com
8th September 2018, 05:33 GMT+10
SYDNEY, Australia - Is the National Rugby League (NRL) and the Australian public right to be shocked at the events of last Monday when one two footballers were photographed after stripping off, and another was photographed vomiting?
The NRL rightly claims the image of the game has been diminished by the publicity that has flowed from it.
There are however perhaps more serious questions to be asked rather than focusing on the apparently drunken behaviour of a team of footballers letting off steam after the winding up of a pressure-packed season. That is not shocking. It is not called ‘Mad Monday’ for nothing. This is an annual ritual for players who keep a strict discipline for most of the year, commencing with pre-season training which for most clubs commences in October each year. The one day when they can relax, consume copius alcohol and let their hair down is this day. What is shocking is that The Daily Telegraph deployed a team of highly skilled photographers with telescopic lenses to spy on the unsuspecting group, apparently in the hope that some indiscretion would occur from which they could profit from and exploit.
During several hours of espionage, the team could only catch their prey out for the duration of a Neil Diamond song. The DT article was emphatic, the player or players took their clothes off and danced during the duration of the song (3 ½ minutes). There was no question they stayed in a state of undress. There was also a photo of a player looking as though he had dozed off on a chair. There was another one of a Bulldogs player lying down, seemingly asleep. There was another photo of a player vomiting. Each of these photos described “a Dogs player,” or “a Bulldogs player.” Nowhere did it make it clear, all 3 photographs were of the same player. So in summary, you have one or two players strip off while dancing to a song, one player dozing off and vomiting, and that’s the sum total of several hours of spying on them.
The Harbour View Hotel is a quiet neighbourhood pub in a residential area of The Rocks, in the heart of Sydney. There are nearby terrace houses, and just up the road are the Sirius apartments, the only residential tower within cooee of the hotel. It has been closed for several months and is roped off, awaiting its sale and likely demolition.
The Canterbury Rugby League club apparently has its annual Mad Monday wind-up at the hotel every year. They book the first floor restaurant, which is sometimes used for private functions. The hotel is now the subject of widespread publicity, and serious charges and fines under the Liquor Act, brought about because of the barrage of publicity.
Foxtel commentators argue these are footballers who people pay to go and watch, so they can’t complain about “intrusive media.”
We would argue they are entitled to a degree of privacy. Their club had organized a gathering in a private function room, not open to the public.
When one or two players shed their clothes while singing and dancing to the Neil Diamond classic, “Sweet Caroline,” with only their mates in attendance, one could hardly claim that was offensive or obscene behavior, which police have now charged the players for. When Prince Harry did the same thing six years ago at a private function in Las Vegas in mixed company, there was no public outrage, the prince was not fined or charged. Nor was the monarchy hit with a $250,000 fine.
And The Daily Telegraph’s coverage was nothing like what it dished out to the Bulldogs this week..
The Australian public, the NRL and the police all seem to have overlooked the fact that the furore that followed the Mad Monday incident damaged the game, not the incident itself. If the players had been left to themselves, as they and their club understood was the case, there would have been no scandal. The police confirmed at the time there had been no complaints. The hotel reported it had received no complaints from other patrons.
The fact that you had The Daily Telegraph stake-out and spy on this group, and capture what to the players was probably regarded as a harmless prank, and then publish those photographs on its front page and throughout their newspaper, and other News Corp newspapers in other states, and across their extensive stable of online websites, and their social media platforms, and their 100%-owned broadcast networks Foxtel, Fox Sports and Sky News was the problem. No-one can argue it was the very public exposure of the photographs that brought the game into ill-repute.
It is our estimation that the chances of anyone from the public actually getting a glimpse of nude footballers on that day would have been close to zero. You would have to be walking up the hill past the hotel, towards the (abandoned) Sirius apartments at the exact time when this brief incident occurred. Knowing the foot traffic on this road is somewhat negligible it is quite probable that no-one saw anything. But through the actions of The Daily Telegraph, photographs of the incident have saturated the media generally, as other publications and television have piggy-backed on the back of The Daily Telegraph ‘exclusive.’
All of the media are to blame, perhaps with the exception of Fairfax, and there are some serious issues at stake here. Firstly, you are not allowed to photograph people in the nude without their consent, regardless of the circumstances. And secondly you are not allowed to publish photographs of nude people without their permission. Irreparable harm has been done to the footballers, their club, and the NRL. The players in particular have been humiliated and their reputations and livelihoods severely impacted.
When Andrew Ettinghausen was photographed having a shower in the locker room on a Kangaroos tour in 1990, and a photograph was published in HQ magazine which was then-owned by Kerry Packer, Australian Consolidated Press was sued for defamation. Ettinghausen told the court he was not asked his permission to be photographed in the nude, nor was he asked if the photograph could be published. He said the photograph was taken without his knowledge and held him up to ridicule. He won the case and was awarded $350,000 by the jury for defamation. Packer’s company appealed the case, however the appeal judges remained firm on the verdict, but revised the damages down to $100,000. Nonetheless $100,000 in 1993 when the case was finalized is probably equivalent to an amount in excess of the $250,000 the Canterbury membership, which had nothing to do with Monday’s events, was fined this week. Canterbury too lost its long-time sponsor Jaycar on Friday as a result of the exposure of the photographs.
What is interesting is that when the Ettinghausen verdict came down, the media went berserk. They realized the decision had repercussions for the bigger picture. The media believe they are entitled to intrude on people’s private lives, if they are celebrities.
“The media response to the decision was one of incredulity and derision,” D Rolph of the University of Sydney wrote in a summation of the case. “Given the media response, Hunt CJ at CL felt compelled, two days after the jury verdict, dealing with an application brought by ACP for a stay pending an appeal, to take the somewhat unusual course of castigating the media for their reporting and analysis of the jury verdict, accusing them of unbalanced reporting of the outcome of the case arising out of their vested interests.”
In the case of the Canterbury get-together they were not aware there were professional, some may say predator, photographers lurking in the bushes opposite their hotel, ready to take advantage of them. If the photographers were caught by police, they would probably now be facing charges of being peeping toms.
The second thing we should be looking at is whether the newspaper has engaged in stalking. Why is it that professional photographers appear to be immune from stalking and invasion of privacy laws? This wasn’t one or two photographers either. The Daily Telegraph sent a team of three photographers to cover the event: Toby Zerna, Justin Lloyd and Christian Gilles.
A fourth photographer, Davis Swift, was over at Manly’s Mad Monday, no doubt hoping for a scoop there. The Manly players, as is well known now, were in fancy dress. The players did not ask to be photographed, and one would assume were not asked for consent in having publication of photographs of them in costumes being published, however numerous photos of them accompanied the initial story about Canterbury, dragging them into the debacle. It was a classic case of guilt by association, and all they were doing was minding their own business and having their once-a-year day-off.
Yes, the game has been damaged by this. So too have the reputations of the players caught out, their team mates, the officials and their club, and the families of those concerned. And yet they were the victims of deceitful conduct by a small group of people that wield so much power they believe they still own the game, as News Corp once did. Few would argue News Corp through its over-exposure of every conceivable incident that is negative to the NRL and saturates its hugely dominant platform to the fullest extent, is by far the most destructive force in the game. Just as some of its commentators played a significant part in bringing down the Australian government a fortnight ago, News Corp will stop at nothing to undermine the game. Through their commentators they call the shots. They tear strips off the NRL executive, individual clubs, coaches, players and referees. They called for the heads of CEO Dave Smith and ARL Commission Chair John Grant and undermined them until they were gone. They play a major part in coaching spills, raids on players, and attacks on referees. Ringmaster Phil Rothfield was even directing the NRL on how much it should fine the Canterbury club. “The NRL needs to come down hard on the Bulldogs for this, don’t muck around with fines of $50,000 or $100,000,” he wrote in an article on Tuesday titled ‘NRL needs to come down hard on Dogs.” Hence the fine of $250,000.
There is no question the club, the NRL and the police were bullied into action, playing into the hands of the Telegraph, as each action taken became a story in itself. The lightning speed at which each of these bodies acted is testament to the pressure and power wielded by News Corp in this country. This was not the dispensing of justice, it was ‘lynch mob’ mentality conjured up by the DT. The public is still waiting to hear the players side of the story. None of The Daily Telegraph articles have included statements from the players, or indications that statements had been sought. Nor would it appear that bodies investigating the day's events would have had time to grill the players. They and the Canterbury club were tried, convicted and sentenced before the public got any explanation as to the circumstances surrounding what occurred.
When Prince Harry spent 72 hours partying in various clubs in Las Vegas in 2012, culminating in a race in the pool with Ryan Lochte and then a game of strip billiards in his private two-storey hotel suite at Wynns, with 25 people in attendance, fifteen of them women, and lost, he was photographed by a ‘friend’ and two images were sold to TMZ magazine which published them. The photographs were then front page news around the world, all except Britain. There was a concern with privacy laws. Clause 3 of the UK’s then-Press Complaints Commission Editor's Code of Practice said: "It is unacceptable to photograph individuals in private places without their consent." The only newspaper to break ranks was the News Corp-owned The Sun which published the photographs. The widely-read publication also issued a statement saying why it was publishing the photographs. “We believe printing the photos IS within the Press Complaints Commission’s code, based on a previous PCC ruling in favour of a UK magazine which published pictures already widely seen online,” the statement said.
“On that occasion the PCC said that in privacy matters its code “required the Commission to have regard to the extent to which material is already in the public domain.”
It concluded: “The Commission felt that the images were so widely established for it to be untenable for the Commission to rule that it was wrong for the magazine to use them.”
In the Canterbury footballers’ case, the situation is entirely different. The Daily Telegraph used espionage to obtain the photographs itself.
It should be noted, at the outset of the statement The Sun made to its readers it said:
“The Sun is NOT making any moral judgement about Harry’s nude frolics with girls in a Las Vegas hotel. Far from it. He often sails close to the wind for a Royal — but he’s 27, single and a soldier. We like him.”
Prince Harry at the time of his Las Vegas partying was a Captain in the British Army, about to be deployed to Afghanistan. He was on leave. He was at the time third in line to the throne. No action was taken by the Ministry of Defence or the British monarchy. At least two newspaper articles suggested Harry would be given a dressing-down by his commanding officer, and one suggested he may be asked to donate two weeks of his salary (1,450 pounds or $2,600 (Australian dollars) to a charity of his choice.
So it is: “Different strokes for different folks.”
And The Sun? It’s actions drew more outrage than those of Prince Harry. Even more astonishing is the popular newspaper, a day before it published the actual photos, had two interns strip naked and replicate the pose of the prince and his companion in the actual photo being circulated in international media and online. Of course in this case the interns had no doubt given their permission. However, what company would ask and expect interns to strip naked to be photographed for front page coverage in their newspaper?
Just like the leadership spill of a fortnight ago, the people who matter get no say. The entire membership of the Canterbury club has been humiliated, embarrassed, fined heavily, and have lost a $500,000 a year sponsorship. The readers of The Daily Telegraph are similarly miffed. They have let it be known they disagree with the course of events this week, with nearly two thirds of them (64%) in a two-question poll run by The Daily Telegraph and published on its website, saying the incident was a matter “of just boys being boys.” And should Mad Monday be banned. A poll conducted by News Corp's Fox Sports had 83% of its viewers saying NO.
A similar poll carried out by Britain’s The Daily Telegraph (not related to News Corp) after Prince Harry’s naked incident produced similar results. In response to the questions, 27% were in the negative, while an overwhelming 73% of the newspaper’s readers gave the prince the thumbs up, saying he was “just being an ordinary young man and the Royals are better for it,” and “it doesn’t matter that he gets naked, but he was stupid to get photographed.”
Even Rupert Murdoch was light-hearted about the prince’s actions."Prince Harry. Give him a break. He may be on the public payroll one way or another, but the public loves him, even to enjoy Las Vegas," he tweeted at the time.
News now controls 100% of Foxtel, Sky News, Fox Sports, and owns two thirds of the newspapers sold in Australia, together with a large holding of the Australian Associated Press, total ownership of the most dominant online news sites and social media sites, and there is a slim possibility of this media goliath taking over the Nine Network. If News Corp is to continue to rule the print media, the airwaves and the online space it needs to do so responsibly. The hacking scandal and the fallout from that should be a constant reminder of what happens when it doesn’t.
Chasing a story is one thing. Creating controversies by setting NRL players up should not be the norm for a respected newspaper of the caliber of The Daily Telegraph, or a company the size and reputation of News Corp.
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- Thread: Coaching is tough
i noticed a lot of people very quick to bag out our coach,
I think it’s way too early for that,
The guy is doing everything we ever asked for,
He is dropping players,
Giving young guys a crack
Trying new things
Trying players in other positions
He is having a red hot go at it,
I am happy with what Pay is doing
No one is perfect
And he isn’t stubborn
I’m on board the Pay bus
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As I posted yesterday in the klemmer thread "fuck Paul kent" dirt bag spreading bullshit rumours to protect his mate hasler.
I know you read the forum kent go stick it up your arse.
Andrew hill TOLD kent it wasn't as bad as what the media are making it out and now our club comes out and says 5 players left with 500k to spend on them.
That doesn't sound like 14 players to go into 800k you lying sack of shit Paul kent
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- Thread: Hoppa Top Dog?
Thats a big call. Have you watched every game of football across all grades and competitions in every state or country in 125 years you bell end!
Im not saying hes the answer going forward but fuck me that statement is rubbish.
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- Thread: the reason kasiano left!
- Thread: Dogs are having a party
The tigers are in the bin. God that feels good.
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